Livestock guardian dogs

[Phoenixxx]

Look for additional vendors. Cost for me is ~$135 per 164 foot length. My coons are every bit as tough as`yours and more numerous yet they do not defeat the netting. Limitation you will have is protecting an acre then it is recommended only four lengths per series to limit fire risk.

How many birds are you trying to protect.

That guy was the cheapest. $200-something for the net, another $200 for the power source, then 15% tax on top of that. Ordering from the states would wind up about the same after shipping and import fees. Number of birds fluctuates - right now I'm down to only 11, 3 of which are near-future chicken dinners. I've had as many as 40 when u count/include the babies.

 

[centrarchid]

Follow this link and look to their shipping costs. I get Items out of Australia and shipping does not impact cost like you indicate. NAFTA should apply to you.



Now follow link.

http://www.kencove.com/fence/Electric+Net+Fencing_products.php

 

[Phoenixxx]

Follow this link and look to their shipping costs. I get Items out of Australia and shipping does not impact cost like you indicate. NAFTA should apply to you.



Now follow link.

http://www.kencove.com/fence/Electric+Net+Fencing_products.php

Yeah, that was one of the first sites I looked at earlier in the year. My birds are fliers - they can all clear 4' no problem so this wouldn't work. Yep, I have a big-(insert adjective) marans hen that can clear a 4' fence, the BAs and anyone else so inclined can, too. I tried confining them to a fully-enclosed pen, but that only worked until the coons dug under my buried fence bottoms. Dog is the cheapest and most viable option for my situation, especially when - considering the odd, awkward shape of my property layout - it would cost me about $2000 on a fence that my chickens can fly over and, ergo, coons can climb over. (They'll find a tree, climb it, come down on the inside of the fence. And I have a lot of trees!)

 

[centrarchid]

I think you are dead set on dog regardless of comparative cost. Raccoon for me easy to beat on a budget with small flock like yours but if dog floats your boat then start the process. If you plan on a single dog then keep birds tight to make dog's work more doable during day. I assume you enjoy a maritime climate? Keep that in mind. If birds kept tight, then a typical LGD likely not needed or optimal. You have some large sized dog breeds up your way that can protect barnyard plus provide pet benefits.

 

[Phoenixxx]

I think you are dead set on dog regardless of comparative cost. Raccoon for me easy to beat on a budget with small flock like yours but if dog floats your boat then start the process. If you plan on a single dog then keep birds tight to make dog's work more doable during day. I assume you enjoy a maritime climate? Keep that in mind. If birds kept tight, then a typical LGD likely not needed or optimal. You have some large sized dog breeds up your way that can protect barnyard plus provide pet benefits.

oh, the dog searching and researching has been a HORRENDOUS process to say the least! I've been searching for over a year, it's TOUGH! But, I grew up with dogs and I believe no family is complete without one; having chickens and the recent (this year) predator issues has only served to make me more selective as to breed/personality/etc. Yes, I guess I have a maritime climate - friggin cold! And damp! This past summer was pathetic, barely a summer at all (I live on the beach and only went swimming TWICE, and had to force myself in - last year I was in every day from May through August). Yes, my flock is normally pretty tight, though I found with raising chicks this year that each batch tended to stick to each other and I wound up with multiple groupings of birds. But, now that I'm left with only 4 from my original hatch of 16 and 5 from my hatch of 23 and zero from my hatch of 6, they stick pretty closely.

 

[centrarchid]

Do you have the resources for a Newfoundland Dog? Should handle your climate just fine and very large. Not dog aggressive as typically desired in in LGD's but presence alone will keep most wild predators away. Dog may need a little training to promote kill interest in critters like a raccoon which will be tough unless bad guys come often.. If raccoons are your biggest headache the smaller but climate tolerant breeds also an option. If you have the coyote-wolf hybrid up your way then dogs will not be your most cost effective option to protect birds.


When it come to raccoons there are other approaches you do not appear to have considered that will keep them at bay. Part of that takes advantage of the chickens natural roosting behavior.

 

[MrsBachbach]

For guarding a typical flock of chickens they eat a lot. After using dogs to protect sheep and goat herds of about 50 animals with one dog per herd, the dogs were deemed to expensive and swapped out for donkeys. Dogs are not cheap. You also have occasional vet bills with them as well. Herding dogs will also get tired of herding birds and ignore them looking for more stimulating activities. Bird dogs most certainly tire of molesting the birds.

For a typical flock, half a dozen birds, sure, if you are looking at dollars and cents. It is a personal choice though and some don't look at every cent spent. If they were, they likely wouldn't be raising chickens in the first place. Most have them for enjoyment and good quality eggs. Most would love to give their birds the ability to free range and if you live in the right area an LGD can make that possible. One can always find cheaper quality food, take the dog to the shot clinics (much cheaper), and do your own worming, etc.
Most don't have the ability to put up electric fencing, or even hardwire cloth fencing. You mention fire hazard, another thing to consider when electrifying a fence. An electric fence wouldn't work where I'm at for several reasons and I'm not willing to fence three acres like a fortress with hardwire cloth. I'm not protecting a half dozen birds, but several dozen and birds that cost me, initially, a pretty penny. They are my hobby, not an income producer. Because of my choice, my girls can free range all they want, saving me $ in feed. My dog is well worth her small expense and because of her I can go out at night and not worry about me being surprised by a bear, bobcat, coyote, etc. She is always on guard or has an eye or ear open around here. She works even when a fence isn't. She didn't cost hundreds of dollars, doesn't eat much at all, and I have had no major medical problems with her. I spend more on the chickens than I ever spent on her total. For me, and I'm sure others, an LGD is the better option, because the fence would be the waste of money. Meaning, it would likely be shorted out often around here, not give me the ability to free range and bite my grandkids when they get near. Don't much feel like driving post in rock either. Nope, not for me.
And I sure wouldn't want to wait for a bird dog to tire of chasing the birds. Could lose your whole flock before it tires. If you already have the dog before the flock, sure, make the effort to train it. If not, and you are looking for a guardian dog, get an appropriate breed.
'

 

[rainbowhatchery]

It definitely depends on a lot of things. If you only have a small flock of cheap $2 birds then yes probably not worth it. If you have alot of livestock then it is. Plus its not always about money but if you have a hobby farm and love your animals you cant really put a price on protecting them. I will hands down say there is NO better method than an LGD if people so choose. They are out there 24/7 and can make the needed judgement calls. I do agree its all in how you value your livestock though. I have very rare breeds of chickens along with our pheasants and peacocks. I have some Enlgish Orps that are worth several hundred dollars a piece so its very worth it for me to protect them.

 

[MrsBachbach]

oh, the dog searching and researching has been a HORRENDOUS process to say the least! I've been searching for over a year, it's TOUGH! But, I grew up with dogs and I believe no family is complete without one; having chickens and the recent (this year) predator issues has only served to make me more selective as to breed/personality/etc. Yes, I guess I have a maritime climate - friggin cold! And damp! This past summer was pathetic, barely a summer at all (I live on the beach and only went swimming TWICE, and had to force myself in - last year I was in every day from May through August). Yes, my flock is normally pretty tight, though I found with raising chicks this year that each batch tended to stick to each other and I wound up with multiple groupings of birds. But, now that I'm left with only 4 from my original hatch of 16 and 5 from my hatch of 23 and zero from my hatch of 6, they stick pretty closely.

Look here:

http://maine.craigslist.org/pet/4748910797.html


Not sure how far you are from here or what rules apply in transporting across the border. These being a year old and maybe not around livestock would probably require some extra effort in training. Pyrenees are protective because of a deep maternal instinct bred into them. What they consider the "pack", they will protect. So, the trick is making them aware of who is part of the "pack". I kept mine housed near the flock but she didn't have access to the flock. I kept her on a very short leash when I brought her in the pens. Corrected any excitment she would display immediately. I held birds when introducing her to flock. I worked with her daily for a few weeks before trusting her without a leash. Taught her commands during this time. I never let her in the pen without a leash though. Mine was young though, not an older dog, that's why I say it could take more time. On the plus side, an older dog may be out of much of that puppy play you have to watch out for.

 

[rainbowhatchery]

Yes socializing LGD dogs with poultry is VERY different than with traditional livestock. I would not call my self an expert but that is exactly what we do here. We breed LGD dogs (Anatolian Kangal line x Pyrenees) and have a chicken hatchery so that is basically what we raise and breed the dogs for is poultry. It is not what any LGD dog was intended for but they are excellent at it if done right but it takes a lot of work and patience and is done very different than with goats and sheep ect.....and not every dog has the temperament for it. I agree the drive to protect is more of a motherly drive in LGD dogs. Its what we call in the LGD world a defense drive as opposed to a prey or play drive. Most guard dogs, which Im very familiar with attack and protect from prey drive. With LGD dogs that prey drive was bred almost out of them, its still there but in the lowest level of all dogs. Instead the defense drive was enhanced which is the same type of drive a mother has over her babies, a willingness to basically attack and kill with serious ferocity anything of any size or magnitude if it means her life in protecting. Coming from a very different place and its what makes them so caring and loving of their livestock and family yet so dangerous and ferocious at the same time. Imagine a mother of any animal that views everything else as a danger to her babies and you have a perfect idea of how LGD think. If raised correctly they are amazing and 100% trustworthy with you and your family compared to other guard dogs. Raised wrong and they are dangerous beyond explanation.