looking for a particular kind of dog leash

[Hound]

Would this work? We use these for our dogs and like them a lot, but i'm not entirely sure what you're after.

http://www.mightypets.com/product.asp?3=908

 

[Akane]

You can put any weight and size of snap on a set of horse reins. You could even find plastic snaps. Depends on how big and strong your dog is. I wouldn't know exactly what to use or where to get it since for my dogs I actually upgrade the snaps. Sometimes to full 6" rock climbing carabiners. My akita hit the end of one of those flex leads with plastic snaps and despite it being rated for her weight it just popped in 2 so fast my arm didn't even get pulled completely straight. I tried to tell my mom that was not an akita approved leash despite her being less than the 100lbs it was rated for.

I have some plastic and some little 1-2" metal carabiners being used for attaching budgie or sugar glider toys or holding rabbit cages shut. Those would hardly be noticeable even on a small dog but I didn't check exactly what they are rated for.

 

[wolftracks]

I'm too tired to remember company names I guess, but one place I've bought from for many years is U.P.C.O.

I think they are now a part of Petsmart, but they have their own site and you can even order a printed catalog.

try www.upco.com

 

[welsummerchicks]

You might consider looking at some Schutzhund websites, they have equipment like you're describing. Unfortunately, schutzhund equipment is all the rage and rather expensive.

As far as leashes go, I like the old fashioned kind with no stitching, the loop and the collar snap are secured with heavy leatherwork that looks like pull-through braiding. The clip is rather short, not a scissor type, and the braiding is supple and doesn't make a stiff section of the lead that would hang down awkwardly, like most stitched leashes. The added advantage is that this sort of leash just never appears to break at the snap or loop.

Myself, I think the problem might possibly be, not in the leash, but the collar(unless the leash is one of those stitched ones). I also think any collar that doesn't have a complete release to it, makes it much more difficult to teach the dog to heel correctly. While an exhuberant strong young dog with a powerful chest and neck is always something of a challenge to teach to heel anyway, I think the best way is to have a collar with a complete release. Rather than trying to hold the dog at one's side with a continuous (or even intermittent) pressure on the leash, the collar is usually loose, and the dog is guided into position by quick jerks on an otherwise loose lead.

The training collar should be rather snug, and fitted so that it is not resting around the base of the neck, but somewhat higher (not so high as behind the ears which would be uncomfortable), and the chain end when the training collar is properly fitted would not hang down at all - the properly fitted training collar would keep the snap from hanging down and being a problem.

The chain collar should have large (for your dog) smooth links that go through the large rings very smoothly. Any rust or rough spots makes the collar not work properly. Many cheap collars have large, poorly shaped links that don't 'run' through the rings of the collar at all well. Links that 'run' well fit smoothly together, a little bit like the links on an old english curb chain of a bridle.

The training collar is put on so the 'dead' ring (the one the leash is not on) constantly pulls the collar out to its widest - this one is on backwards, and is about six inches too long, both being very common mistakes. With a long chain collar left on the dog when not training, a dog can catch it on things and can injure itself very severely, but a longer chain collar also is far harsher on the dog and doesn't provide a quick, clean release. here's the incorrect setup -

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...3&ndsp=10&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:14&biw=908&bih=363

To make it easier to put on, some use a 'martingale collar', which has one central ring where one clips on the leash.

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...4&ndsp=10&ved=1t:429,r:2,s:24&biw=908&bih=363


I don't find they have quite as nice or as quick a release as a traditional collar, I don't find them as effective, but I use them on dogs with a thick ruff or roll on their neck. They should be fitted so that they sit on the neck in the right position - not right behind the ears, just a little further down...not near the base of the neck. Products that sit near the base of the neck or on the chest, just encourage the dog to pull, and can lead to confusion if you want to teach the dog tracking (I think you mentioned that).

Then the dog is corrected per position with quick snap - and - release motion, and 99% of the time, the snap on the lead is hanging down. But it hangs down so little that it's relatively out of the way. The trick really is in how the collar is put on and how it's fitted to the neck...as well as mastering the quick snap. The size would be two inches longer than the snug measurement around the neck where the collar should sit.

Some people then start out with 'directed heeling' on a long lead, letting the dog wander around to the end of the leash - I find that to be a horrendous waste of time as well as creating a whole set of behaviors the dog may never completely 'unlearn'. BUT...some people prefer that strongly.

I was going to post a youtube video of someone teaching heel...but after looking there for quite some time, I couldn't find even one that did not look like a total disaster. I found it a little disturbing to see so many 'trainers' training with incorrectly put on and fitted collars, but none of them were getting good results, either.

I was brought up using a very yanky-spanky Koehler type method of training, but 'got religion' on using treats and a much lighter approach when I saw how fantastic the results are - look at that wag and smile, as well as the reaction when the dog nearby barks like a banshee - the dog doesn't even turn its head - it's hard to tell from the camera angle, some of the finishes might be a little sloppy, but the overall attitude of the dog shows how effective the slightly lighter training style is.

 

[patandchickens]

Hey thanks, I knew I could count on you folks! Some great ideas and resources there.

A couple of them, like the spindrift.com one, are pretty much what I was envisioning... but now you've got me thinking about DIY and maybe converting a rein or horse lead (I still have the leather racetrack lead from my first horse who was actually quite a good racehorse before I got him; it is leather and chain, and has just sat in a box since 1993 because I am not a chain-shank kinda gal, but if it's still in good condition maybe I could remove the chain and make it into a leash... although then I'd need another collar... have to think about it)

wc, I know the methods you are discussing are traditional and well thought of, but this dog has not been trained that way (jerk-and-release) and yet after only, what, 3 months of having him, he *does* walk on a loose leash beside me real well now, with the exception of when he thinks someone is coming directly to pet him (and that continues to improve, and heck he's only 8 months old, so,

). He doesn't heel in an obedience-ring sense (staring at you like a maniac) for more than maybe 20 seconds at a time yet, but again, he's young. Anyhow my point here is simply that I am fully comfortable that a fixed (buckle) collar does pretty much exactly what I want it to. So I think I will stick with that

Much appreciated,

Pat

 

[onthespot]

I have something kicking around here for some time, not sure where it came from. It is a rolled leather slip lead. It is light oil (yeillowish beige) and sorta like a pigging string, but as thick as your finger. Don't want it, don't need it. My dogs are way to small for it, (toy and small minis) and you are welcome to it if you want to pay shipping. It just looked too good to throw away.

 

[welsummerchicks]

oh ok now I understand why he's been 'over enthusiastically' been greeting passers by.

As for the 'head jammed up staring at master' heeling...I'm really, really not sure it's a good posture for a dog to have all his working life, that's a lot of wear and tear on a neck that's not meant to be in that position, so far up and to one side. I teach my dogs to look up only during very brief periods, and to spend most of their time in a normal position.

I don't know of any studies of the neck position - it's so popular and so admired, it's unlikely to come under any scrutiny.

 

[patandchickens]

Quote:
Yes: it's because he is an adolescent lab puppy

(I did *try* the jerk-and-release method btw, for the first 3 or 4 weeks we had him. It did some good, but not miracles. It was when I started NOT using it, and working instead on getting him to concentrate on following me and using the clicker and reversing whenever he wasn't staying beside me on loose leash, that he started making very rapid progress.)

The only time there's a problem these days is if someone actually bends down while approaching and petting is obviously imminent -- and even then, often I can get him to sit and wait (albeit a very *wiggly* sit). But not always, especially for very enthusiastic people swooping down on him

Perhaps you are thinking of a couple threads I posted a couple months ago about pulling. That was then, this is now

In fact if he *were* pulling on the leash nowadays, we would not be *having* the problem of the snap clonking him in the knees b/c of the leash being totally loose

Pat