Marans Thread - breed discussion & pictures are welcome!

[AquaEyes]

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Very well spoken, Pinkchick!

Exactly how I feel! I've been breeding blrws for 6 years, and people still ask me what lines my birds are from. I don't want to be rude, but after all this time, what difference does it make? They are "my" line now. They see pictures of my birds, and still are wondering???

Same with the Marans.
Speaking of clean legs, most of the birds imported to the US, were from England where they bred for a clean leg. The feather leg has been bred back into most of the lines now, but that clean leg still pops up occasionally out of 2 feather legged parents. Its not a big deal.

Sue

Sue, from what I've been learning here, the feathered legs are a dominant trait over clean legs. If clean legs pop up from time to time in feathered flocks, that would indicate that some birds are heterozygous for the trait, meaning they have the clean leg gene. If breeders kept one clean legged hen and one clean legged roo in a separate pen, they could test-breed to see which of their feather legged birds carry the clean legged gene. A heterozygous bird with feather legs bred to a bird with clean legs would statistically give 50% feathered legs and 50% clean legs. If the breeder knew which birds were heterozygous, they could then choose to stop breeding them, or at least not breed them to other heterozygous birds. Has anyone tried that?



~Chris

 

[sewandgrow]

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Nice looking eggs Jennifer. Where did you get your Lavender Ams? A couple of those Marans eggs are really dark. That is my goal.....................LOL

I got the Lavender Ameraucanas from the SQ egg swap from Sebrightmom.

I have never done one of the swaps but I have traded hatching eggs many times................. That is one of the ways I end up with too many different breeds..........LOL

 

[jennifersmith326]

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I got the Lavender Ameraucanas from the SQ egg swap from Sebrightmom.

I have never done one of the swaps but I have traded hatching eggs many times................. That is one of the ways I end up with too many different breeds..........LOL

I like the swaps but like you said, I get too many different breeds.

 

[sewandgrow]

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Susie, could you cut a strip from the bottom of a plastic cup where it turns from the side of the cup to the bottom.Make it tall enough to support the leg & bring the foot forward & tape it to the top of the flat bottom & tape the leg to the side that goes up???? Is that clear as mud???? You would have to push the ankle into the corner where it turns up & tape both the leg & the foot...... It would be firm but light weight.

 

[sewandgrow]

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I have never done one of the swaps but I have traded hatching eggs many times................. That is one of the ways I end up with too many different breeds..........LOL

I like the swaps but like you said, I get too many different breeds.

I started out wanting to limit myself to about 5 breed/varieties. Good luck with that........ What I have done is tried to compile good stock to keep & cull out the hatchery stuff I started with & I am almost there. I have a few layers in the layer pen that I do not breed with at all that are hatchery stock just for eggs.Other than that I have worked toward improving what I have & only adding good breeder stock & learning to cull. Then something like Blue Birchen come up & whoops....there I go again.....LOL

 

[pinkchick]

Chris~ I have found that breeding 2 clean legged birds that were hatched from 2 feather legged birds produces 100% clean legged chicks all of the time. Ipurposely kept some clean shanked birds for the laying flock and breed them for selling as layers. I bred a couple of the girls to a heavily feather shanked roo and got a majority of feather legged birds with s few popping up clean legged. Unfortunately I wasnt there to see what bird hatched from which egg so that I could identify the bird carrying the recessive gene. My bad. Anywho, my point being that I was under the impression and have experienced that if they dont have it upon hatch its not a gene they can pass on....they will pass on the clean shank instead. Is there anyone else here that has worked with this that has some info or opinion to share? I find this topic very interesting.

 

[VillageChicken]

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On clean shanks: From what I have seen, I don't think it's always a simple case of one single dominant gene. If that is the case, then why do we sometimes get a feathered middle toe? And why do we sometimes get a feathered shank, but not a feathered toe? I have some EE's with feathered shanks, and in crossing them to clean shanks, you get a whole range of vulture hocked, fully feathered, to just a tiny line of feathers down the top of the shank. I believe Marans feathered shanks are dominant, but in what genetic combination they express consistently as lightly feathered shank and outside toe is not clear. The fact that we select for LIGHTLY feathered helps eliminate the middle toe feathering in most cases, but perhaps selecting for this also increases the chances of clean shanks popping up as a result. Maybe selecting the lightly feathered individuals actually selects more easily the heterozygous form of the shank feathering!

 

[AquaEyes]

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That would fit with clean legs being recessive to feather legs. If a clean leg bird came from parents who were both feather leg, then both parents must be heterozygous, meaning they are both "feather leg split to clean leg." Breeding two birds homozygous for the same recessive trait (such as two clean leg birds) will not result in any offspring with the dominant trait (unless a random new mutation occurred). If you said you bred clean leg girls to the same feather leg boy, and got feather legs and clean legs in the offspring, then the boy must be split to clean legs. If there was more than one boy with the girls, or if the girls could be retaining sperm from a previous mating with another boy, then you can't be sure of the paternity. It wouldn't matter which hen hatched which, if both are clean leg. If clean leg is recessive, then a clean leg bird can't be split to feather leg. But a feather leg can be split to clean leg.

So if you want to find out which of your feather legs are split to clean leg, first you can see which pairings resulted in clean leg birds. Clean leg birds must have come from two split parents, one split parent and one clean leg parent, or two clean leg parents. If you want to avoid having any clean leg offspring, don't allow those split birds to be bred to other split birds (split X split = 25% clean leg offspring). If you have birds with feather legs and want to know if they are split to clean leg, test-breed to one of your clean leg birds. Split X clean leg = 50% clean leg, 50% feather leg. Pure feather leg X clean leg = 100% split (having feather leg, but carrying clean leg).

If you want to eliminate the clean leg trait from your flock, don't breed any of the splits at all when you identify them through test-breeding. If you breed only from those birds that are pure feather leg, you'll remove the clean leg gene from your flock. If you just want to sell eggs/chicks and want to guarantee that all will have feather legs, you can still breed the splits, but only to those that are pure feather leg (i.e. they have two copies of the feather leg gene). All offspring from that pairing will have feather legs, though half will be split to clean leg.

All this holds true if feather leg versus clean leg is controlled by one gene, and feather leg is dominant to clean leg. I'm assuming this to be the case because of what I've read here, but if someone knows for certain that there is more than one gene involved, then please educate me. I know the principles of how genetics works, but I don't know specifically how to categorize the traits in chickens. If someone tells me "This is sex-linked recessive, that is incomplete dominant, those are simple dominant/recessive, etc." then I can tell you how things work, and what to do to get what you want.



~Chris

 

[berkeleysprings]

with all the faults marans have getting a clean leg every now and then is a breeze
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My flocks have never thrown a single clean legged chick in three years. Ron Presley, Wade Gene, and Bev Davis origin. Nor wheaten. Sometimes I get excessive red on the breast, and some mossiness and a shorter than normal outer toe though.

Hi, will be up front and say that out of over 600 BC last year I had about 20-25 without feather legs. I believe one thing that helps is use a male that is as heavy foot feathered as you can find that has other good type. Don

 

[math ace]

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I was thinking this, but did not want to say it