Marans Thread - breed discussion & pictures are welcome!

[Wynette]

Wynette~ Thanks for asking Bev and thanks for posting this. I eagerly await the conversation to follow. A question I have is why try to breed the Birchen Marans so completely different than the other varieties? All other varieties of Marans are to have pumpkin/orangey eyes and red faces and such....the black eyes and mulberry faces to me just does not seem right for the Marans.

Pink, I honestly don't know what other breeds which have Birchen varieties show as their phenotypes. I don't own Birchens of any breed, so I have nothing to go by other than pictures. But, I DO appreciate the need to at least have a draft of a very basic standard for them, or to get some of these basic questions answered so folks can move on.

I hate to think there are peeps running several different lines becauce they don't know which is going to be the accepted one, that's a ton of work to be sure, but then again, maybe that's just how it goes when working on acceptances of new varieties in a newly accepted breed?

 

[gilavina]

I agree that there needs to be some basic proposed standards to go by that have gone through the filter of feedback from the APA so that we all have something to go on for all the varieties that have not yet been accepted. I understand it is a ton of work to get all that done for all the varieties, but believe it is perhaps what has been lacking and made some of the qualifying meets more difficult. The way I see it, it would be really hard to breed a certain direction and then find out right before a qualifying meet that what the APA will be judging for is different. That would be such a disheartening feeling I think. My overall goal with everything is just to tighten up the definition of birchen and their attributes as they will be allowed in for the APA, so we have a chance of having a good turnout for the qualifier for the birchens, no matter how far down the road it might be.

 

[snowbird]

Vicki, Someone should also be working with the APA on getting something started on the Blue Copper , Most do not have any kind of idea what will be required for them to be acceptable. I imagine it will resemble the Black Copper.

 

[gilavina]

Vicki, Someone should also be working with the APA on getting something started on the Blue Copper , Most do not have any kind of idea what will be required for them to be acceptable. I imagine it will resemble the Black Copper.

I was on the yahoo site the other day and think I saw something about a standard for the blues. Let me go look and see if that's what I really saw or not.

 

[snowbird]

What most folks fail to realize is that the Faults and DQs are determined by The APA SOP in the first 40 pages. Breed clubs have very little to do with these.

 

[gilavina]

What most folks fail to realize is that the Faults and DQs are determined by The APA SOP in the first 40 pages. Breed clubs have very little to do with these.

Good word Don.

 

[pinkchick]

Ok......then how I understand it and I see it every breed variety that is Birchen or Crow-wing which includes the Black Copper should have the mulberry face and black eyes?
Take a breed like Minorca for example....they have several different varieties and colors.....with in the breed all have the same lobe color and eye color. If "Birchens" in every breed are to be different, then why aren't all blue varieties of chickens the same, why then does the blue andalusian differ from the blue langshan.. etc, etc...........?

 

[snowbird]

I agree that there needs to be some basic proposed standards to go by that have gone through the filter of feedback from the APA so that we all have something to go on for all the varieties that have not yet been accepted. I understand it is a ton of work to get all that done for all the varieties, but believe it is perhaps what has been lacking and made some of the qualifying meets more difficult. The way I see it, it would be really hard to breed a certain direction and then find out right before a qualifying meet that what the APA will be judging for is different. That would be such a disheartening feeling I think. My overall goal with everything is just to tighten up the definition of birchen and their attributes as they will be allowed in for the APA, so we have a chance of having a good turnout for the qualifier for the birchens, no matter how far down the road it might be.

I don't think any of the other Standards for the Marans have been worked on eccept the Cuckoo. If anyone wanted to work on Proposed Standards they could contact Bev Davis and volunteer their services as most likely no one is working on them. If any one wanted to do this , then you could collaborate with Walt as you work on the Standard. If this does not happen their are going to be a lot of angry people when changes are made day before the Qualifying meet.

 

[gilavina]

Ok......then how I understand it and I see it every breed variety that is Birchen or Crow-wing which includes the Black Copper should have the mulberry face and black eyes?
Take a breed like Minorca for example....they have several different varieties and colors.....with in the breed all have the same lobe color and eye color. If "Birchens" in every breed are to be different, then why aren't all blue varieties of chickens the same, etc, etc...........?

birchens in the standard don't refer to the coppers or other birds that are genetically a birchen, it is referring the the color birchen, which is silver in the standard if that makes sense. There are some variances in the APA, but like Don said, they are working on tightening those up. In the beginning of the standard there is a color standard for different varieties that govern the breeds further in the standard.

As far as all this goes, this is where all my questions come in, because we are dealing with certain constraints and without an actual written proposal for the silver birchens and being able to run it by Walt, it leads to tons of questions, but that's what I'm so excited about with this dicussion. I'm hoping we get some solid clarity on all of it.

 

[gilavina]

I don't think any of the other Standards for the Marans have been worked on eccept the Cuckoo. If anyone wanted to work on Proposed Standards they could contact Bev Davis and volunteer their services as most likely no one is working on them. If any one wanted to do this , then you could collaborate with Walt as you work on the Standard. If this does not happen their are going to be a lot of angry people when changes are made day before the Qualifying meet.

I agree Don. I've picked about the worst time for me to be bringing this up with everything on my plate, but after the first couple of weeks in November, should be able to have more time to look into and inquire deeper. I would be interested in collaboration tho!