My pups went on a killing spree :(

[cmjust0]

The thing you have to understand about most LGDs is that they come more or less "factory equipped" with all the skills to be good livestock guardian dogs. You'll see the word "training" brought up a whole bunch in regard to LGDs, but there really isn't much training to it....they already know what to do.

However...they don't always know what NOT to do, which is where correction comes into play. Correction is hugely important when it comes to LGDs, and -- contrary to what you often hear about folks' LGDs being perfect angels from day one -- many, many, many of them need quite a bit of correction when they're young. In my personal opinion, the vast majority are absolutely going to need correction from time to time when they're young.

The point I most want to make is that your dogs aren't defective -- they're just dogs. In fact, they're young dogs with no guidance, living around fowl.. I don't care what the breed is -- when you put young dogs with no guidance around fowl, you're occasionally going to have problems.

Correct them. If you see them do something you aren't comfortable with, let them know right then and there. I'm sure they're stubborn and probably aren't that interested in making sure you're happy all the time -- they may even seem 'stupid,' compared to herding breeds or something like that -- but I can promise you that they're highly intelligent, and they're very sensitive dogs. Usually, all it takes is a stern word to get an LGDs attention in a big way..

Just don't give up on them.. What you're experiencing here is IN NO WAY UNCOMMON, and all it means is that you've got some corrections to make. That's all. Once corrected and matured, when these dogs are about 2 years old, you won't be able to imagine life without them.

 

[zazouse]

One of mine did this when he was younger when he ate the whole chicken i realized he was just hungry, he never bothered the chickens any other time.

I made sure he got three meals a day till he got older and never lost another chicken,he just did not know that chickens were not food, but he learned after a couple rounds with the water hose.

 

[Pupsnpullets]

Quote:
I agree. Two pups can think of things together that no 6 pups by themselves could or would dare to do. They can be taught but you really do have to move fast on this one. You've had some good advice so far so I'm rooting for you!

 

[Grillo]

It really boils down to never leaving the pups with fowl unsupervised. They should spend as much time as possible with them, as long they as they are supervised. That's the only way and you need to correct them the moment you see mishap. They really are very senstive. My dogs will immediately notice when I get upset and they walk to a corner or otherwise get out of the way. If you really get angry when they play with fowl they will notice and remember it. But yes, no pup should ever be left unattended with fowl. My own dogs would not eat the chicken or intentionally harm them but they would literally lick to death the younger chickens if left on their own. Good luck.

 

[thebritt]

My GP tried to kill young chickens when he was about 4-5 mos old. I was lucky enough to catch him in the act both times. I saw him with a young hen between his paws, laying on the ground, licking the feathers off - bird was still alive - and I shouted, "NO NO NO!!!" while running over to him - tackled him - and held him down by his throat, my face in his, while making horrible growling noises (ME doing the snarling). Afterwards, I put him on a lead, and we walked around the birds. I had treats in my pocket, and when he looked at a bird, he got a sharp correction with the lead, and a firm "Don't touch" command. When he looked away, he was told "Good boy" and got a treat. This had to be done consistantly for several weeks, but he got the message. He's now 6 yrs old, and lays with the chickens all around them, and barks and chases away hawks and ravens like a good GP should. Hang in there, and try to follow the advice given by Jamie and others.

 

[Skyesrocket]

My dogs are all chicken trustworthy...except for guinea hens. When you said peahen I wasn't sure if you meant guinea or peacock. The guineas behavior seems to draw dogs attention to them. Once the chase is on things get out of hand.
Very young chicks are another problem with dogs. Again, with all the noise and running around they do brings on the dog's prey drive.
Size doesn't seem to be a factor. I have young seramas out running around and the dogs ignore them. The behavior of the skittish birds can get the dogs to chase. So I don't keep guineas and I keep chicks up until they grow out some.
I'm sorry you are having trouble with your pups.

 

[chickenzoo]

Peafowl and wild type ducks seem to be more tempting to them as puppies. My one female at 4 months(and I have had more problems with the females than males for some reason) killed a peacock and my pair Mandrin ducks when she broke into the pen after a different type of dog food then she had, that I gave them.

I never found my male, but the female Mandrin I found her chewing on and beat her all over the place with the dead duck. She never touched the geese, Pekin ducks, turkey, chickens.. etc... I separated her and put her with my Shepherd who loves the birds and she is very good now. She shares my front yard with 4 Black Swans, and though I really kept a close eye on her at first, she is now fairly trustworthy as she has gotten older. I would def separate them and work them individually.

 

[sourland]

I think it comes down to the plain and simple fact that you can have one dog and your fowl, or you can have two dogs. They are in control and will continue to be in control unless you permanently seperate them. I know this is not what you want to hear, but it is fact. Listen to Jamie Dogtrainer.

 

[Bear Foot Farm]

My prob is also I work against my sister, I love her dearly but the "spoils" them rotten, like "oh its a horrible life to be in a pen all day, etc". Yes, but until they LEARN, darnit!

That's much like saying " You can't go in the water until you learn to swim"

They willl never learn to get along with birds if they are not WITH birds.
If you want a Guardian dog, you have to let them guard.
If you want a pet, you bring them in the house to play.

What you have now are a couple of bored puppies with no experience or guidance.
If you take the time to work with them and LET them learn, they may turn out OK

If you're going to lock them up "until they learn", they'd be better off somewhere else

http://www.bountifulfarm.com/lgd_seminar.htm​

 

[thndrdancr]

OK, Maybe I am retarded but I need step by step instructions on whats best to do.

One person says dont leave them unsupervised. So that means pen, right? Yesterday I penned them, took one out at a time on the leash, took them to the birds and coops while I took care of feeding, getting eggs, etc. made them sit, lay down quietly while I was working, etc.

Thats what I meant by "while they learn". I am at wit's end, I guess this isnt the thing to do? I dont want to rehome one but will do it if thats what is needed. When I ask for tips, I meant step by step.

Dan I sure wished I could just bring them to you for training, darnit. I cried myself to sleep thinking I might have to let even one go. The escape proof pen thing just didnt seem to work either when I discipline Sugar. The only thing that works for them is squirting them with hose but I am so distraught when I find a dead bird I dont even think of it.

Oh and thanks for the website, but I have read that one and a thousand more over and over again, but none of it helps with my situation exactly.

Also the pen I have them in is a foot away from 5 baby guinea's, a young chick, a duck, and in another pen next to them, a mama hen with six chicks.