Niacin Overdose

[Isaac 0]

Yes this is calculated with the dosage the study say

You put that @ 350 mg/kg it becomes toxic. That Is the number i used for my math. Yes 3 drops is many many times the required dose for a duckling.

When I said this-

"The study shown above states that it takes several hundred times the recommended dose for there to be any possible side effect, it seems pretty safe to me. Hundreds of people have treated their ducks using Cattle B Complex Brands and to my knowledge, there haven't been any toxic side effects reported yet."

I was referring to B12, not niacin. There are many niacin supplements out there that could easily be overdosed with. Here is one for example that contains 1000mg per scoop, if you were to give that to a week or two old ducklings there'd likely be adverse side effects if the use was prolonged. The same goes for most Cattle B Complex's.

https://www.amazon.com/Nutricost-Ni...coding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=N15Z8PBXP78H2GEKF1C4

 

[Sarahf95]

Sorry to hear about your duck.

I'm assuming your vet thinks this is a thiamine deficiency?

Could you post a picture or tell me the brand name of the bottle you have?

@Isaac 0 The vet didn’t really know to be honest (they rarely see ducks) but said to just give it to him in case it is any kind of deficiency. So I’m really just going off the advice on here too. Sorry it was supposed to attach on my last message

 

[Isaac 0]

@Isaac 0 The vet didn’t really know to be honest (they rarely see ducks) but said to just give it to him in case it is any kind of deficiency. So I’m really just going off the advice on here too. Sorry it was supposed to attach on my last message

Yes, I got the label. Do you have the brand name?

 

[Pollo Blanco]

Cyanocobalamin is one of the ingredients added to most B Complex's for cattle, I wasn't saying it should be given to ducks, simply showing the risk of overdose toxicity. Hundreds of people have used the B complex with their ducks and we haven't seen any signs of toxicity or adverse side effects.

I don't know enough about it to go into further details though, but it seems to be safe in the amounts recommended.

It's a tough one (cyanocobalamin) to find info on. Unfortunately Google filters out natural health information due to their ties to big pharma. Even using Duckduckgo, this information was on page five of the search.

IIRC, it can cause macular degeneration in 15% of the people who take it.

Cyanocobalamin
(Also CN-Cbl, or Cyano B12)

Cyano B12 is a cheap, synthetic, slightly-toxic, inactive form of B12 that is made with a cyanide donor and is used commercially. It is the most stable form, because the cyanide molecule has the greatest attraction to the cobalamin and protects it from extreme conditions (like high temperatures). However, it doesn’t absorb well and requires methyl groups to detoxify it.

Methylation is one way in which your body detoxifies. But it requires methyl groups, which are often in low supply because of our modern life which is full of toxins. To remove the cyanide out of cyanocobalamin, the body uses a methyl molecule. This is why people with methylation problems (like autistic children) can get worse on CN-Cbl but not on other forms of vitamin B12.

https://regevelya.com/vitamin-b12-forms/

 

[Isaac 0]

@Isaac 0

Is it also important to consider how much they are drinking and eating at the same time that you are dosing Issac ?

For example, with our very poorly ducklings, they were barely drinking or eating (supplemented with BY) at all - the dose in the water was quite high but their intake of anything was very low indeed. I also made sure they at least had a nibble of something at the same time as having their bill dipped. We tried dropper feeding before and I suspect that contributed to one of our poorly ducklings dying.

My reasoning was I know if I take supplements on an empty stomach, I can end up feeling queasy.

Once they started more normal ducky behvaiours with their food and water (standing in it, throwing it everywhere) I tapered down the dose because I read that as a sign they were recovering and eating and drinking more.

Thank you for the info - I think its super important to understand as much as possible on the dosing and quality of supplements.

May I first ask what they had, that they weren't eating and drinking, and one died?

 

[Isaac 0]

How old were they when you first started supplementing? With ducks that arent drinking/eating much, orally is the way to go.

 

[HalfWayUpAMountain]

For the ones that survived ? Essentially as soon as the yolk had finished being absorbed.

For most of them, it was like they barely had the energy and / or focus to get to the shallow bowls to sort themselves out even when they knew where they were.

They all responded to bill dipping - we did one at the start with a dropper, they got better then tanked and died with (new) breathing problems.

Appreciate that could be our technique rather than all attempts via a dropper being bad !

Our choice moving forward will be bill dipping

Edited to add: when I say bill dipping, I mean I dipped their bill and then they joined in and took a little drink themselves. Still very very low volume compared with what ducks usually get through.