not all birds are created equal

[CelticOaksFarm]

Quote:
I think when done properly new blood helps a flock a lot. Again picking for the traits most desired.

We pulled in a new group of hatching eggs this year for new blood for the EE flock. These new birds had a Lav Am rooster over leghorns, so bringing in good laying, all have peacombs and some degree of silver or slate legs. If they dont lay what we are looking for they will be sold as eating egg layers and make someone very happy.

From the original group we have 2 hens left, they live in our eating egg flock full time. Our 2 lead roosters are from EE hens with a Lav AM roo, good temperaments in them both. Our newest roo is from one of those first two and a blue AM hen. He is larger than dad, good temperament and has his own flock now.

Not all new blood is helpful, we had some hens from an EE/AM cross that were little in size and flighty. They were sold as egg layers and making the owner very happy with their fully enclosed run.


---------------------------------

 

[CelticOaksFarm]

First page was updated since there is some confusion for some reading, hopefully the red text will clear this up for those who were not understanding from beginning.

This thread is discussing not all birds should be bred.

Ok this is a touchy subject so for those who might get offended, sorry ahead of time, stop reading and find a new thread.

NO FLAMING, no harrassement, no posting just create an arguement


PLEASE UNDERSTAND THIS THREAD IS NOT FOR OR ABOUT BACKYARD FLOCK OWNERS WHO BREED FOR SELF ENJOYMENT.

THIS IS FOR AND ABOUT BREEDING AND SELLING AND OR SHOWING AND THE PRACTICE SOME HAVE TAKEN TO SELLING MIXED,OR POORLY BRED BIRDS AS PURE AND SQ.

​

NOT all birds are created equal. Or, not every bird deserves to reproduce. Its just that simple, just because you have cute drake quackers and cute duck daisy doesnt mean those eggs need to be hatched. Having pet flocks that you never set eggs from IS PERFECTLY ACCEPTABLE. Eat the eggs, bake with them, give them away, just enjoy them.

If you do chose to breed and hatch ANY birds (chickens, ducks, geese) PLEASE do the breed you are thinking of breeding a HUGE favor and buy a copy of the Standard of Perfect from the APA, around $59 for the current hard copy with full descriptions and color pictures too! It will help guide you in what is and is not a feature/trait you should be breeding.

Be HONEST with yourself on what quality the birds you have is. Just because you bought eggs to hatch or birds from a quality line wont make those you have worth breeding. Improvement of breeds should always be the goal when making the choice to allow animals to reproduce. if you are unwilling to be critical of your own birds, then ASK someone who has high standards to help you access them. Be open to the fact you may hear negative things and that the person you asked for hlp from may tell you not to breed them. Dont get offended, be happy you had someone willing to help you. Be happy you arent flooding the market with sub-standard birds who do nothing for the breed.

Its nice to have our birds sorta help pay for the feed, but be honest, you WONT get rich off of poultry/waterfowl breeding. If you dont have the time and space to dedicate proper separated breeding pens/paddocks/pastures then dont breed. Dont become a "puppy mill" backyard poultry/waterfowl breeder.

 

[pbjmaker]

What is to stop the new owner of your "culls" from breeding them? Just curious.

 

[redhen]

Celtic..do you sell your culls? The birds that dont meet your breed standards?

 

[redhen]

What is to stop the new owner of your "culls" from breeding them? Just curious.

Ha..we think a like. That's what I was wondering...
Its still spreading lower quality birds around.

 

[CelticOaksFarm]

nothing, but if being sold as pets or culls the buyer knows this up front. You cant control what others do with those culls of course, no more than any animal sold really. Dont confuse culls with hatchling sales or young bird sales as quality is UNknown when buying young birds and are a chance at something worth breeding. Just like when we grow out and select something to keep.

most dont want to breed and appreciate say like a marans who doesnt hold breedable traits but still gives them a dark toned egg, or goose to graze and keep the grass short but who has wrong color eyes, no dewlap, too long of a neck ect.

 

[redhen]

Celtic..what I'm saying is..you are making a market for lowering the breed quality if you keep selling them to people.
Which surprises me because you're the one that started this thread. Its just confusing is all..

 

[CelticOaksFarm]

people get so upset over labels, but seriously NOT everyone is a winner and our society of people who believe everyone deserves a ribbon needs to wake up.

culls are NOT bad animals.......they meet the needs of that breeder......its that simple.....you will see fall juveniles in geese listed for every year..........these are all THAT breeders culls...............they might not be better or as good as the current breeders so thus a cull..........they might be a world better than the stock said buyer has though and they improve there stock through this purchase.

Culls from breeding are all a wide variety of levels............Pets only.......not the same quality (or better) as the breeders current breeding stock...........genetically bad and showing bad visual traits (these arent sold by use, they hit the freezer or the dogs food bowl)

So before ANYONE choses to run out and claim we selling bad birds as culls for others to breed we do not.

Cull - freezer (for us) --- ANYTHING with bad genetics, off walk, legs, head, neck, hips ect VISUALLY something wrong that would make be listed as "special needs" would equal not something we want to pass along to anyone else ever

Cull - pets -- chickens who lay well but maybe the egg isnt as dark as it should be (marans) or a duck with yellow bill who should have a dark bill. They are still good eating egg layers in pet flocks

We have a culled Dewlap Toulouse goose we are keeping........she is in our meat goose flock now. She has great size and will make nice off spring for table birds. She is a sweet goose as well. Our meat flock is small (3 birds now a breeding trio) and they are in their own space and hatchlings are for our use not for sale so very limited hatching done. The rest of the eggs are for eating or egg art.



Redhen you are wrong with your statement............we are not creating a market for lesser animals....they are sold (99% of the time) locally for people who 3-4 chickens or a couple of ducks as pets. Please the above statement as CULLS have various reasons for being culls.

 

[canesisters]

Redhen, it's not confusing at all.
If it weren't for folks selling cheap, mid-quality birds I wouldn't have any at all. I have a lovely flock of identify-able - if not show quality birds. I had the opportunity of being given a dozen grown "redish-brown yard bird" chickens from a neighbor or picking out specific breeds that I wanted. I chose to buy a few cheap pet quality chicks. They were perfect for my 'starter flock'. I knew that they weren't 'show birds' when I picked them up. Because I have a bit of integrity, I would never try to pass them off as anything other than what they are.
Simple logic says that a breeder of good stock cares about their birds and about the breed they favor. They wouldn't toss all that money into the money pit otherwise. Therefore, it would also make sense that if they sell any 'non-show-quality' birds - for whatever reason - they will be sure to tell the buyer that the birds they are interested in are not showable. If they're smart, they will suggest that if the person wants show birds they will be happy to hook them up with a couple of grown champions for a much higher price.
I do intend to move up to some high quality pure bred birds one day. And I expect to pay WAY more than $2 each for them.
The same people who whine about breeders selling 'pet quality' animals would also take offense if told that a breeder will only sell show quality stock and will destroy all healthy, non-showable animals to protect their breed from irresponsible breeding.
Some people just can't play nice.

 

[CelticOaksFarm]

Not confusing at all.
If it weren't for folks selling cheap, mid-quality birds I wouldn't have any at all. I have a lovely flock of identify-able - if not show quality birds. I had the opportunity of being given a dozen grown "redish-brown yard bird" chickens from a neighbor or picking out specific breeds that I wanted. I chose to buy a few cheap pet quality chicks. They were perfect for my 'starter flock'. I knew that they weren't 'show birds' when I picked them up. Because I have a bit of integrity, I would never try to pass them off as anything other than what they are.
Simple logic says that a breeder of good stock cares about their birds and about the breed they favor. They wouldn't toss all that money into the money pit otherwise. Therefore, it would also make sense that if they sell any 'non-show-quality' birds - for whatever reason - they will be sure to tell the buyer that the birds they are interested in are not showable. If they're smart, they will suggest that if the person wants show birds they will be happy to hook them up with a couple of grown champions for a much higher price.
I do intend to move up to some high quality pure bred birds one day. And I expect to pay WAY more than $2 each for them.
The same people who whine about breeders selling 'pet quality' animals would also take offense if told that a breeder will only sell show quality stock and will destroy all healthy, non-showable animals to protect their breed from irresponsible breeding.
Some people just can't play nice.

Thanks

I feel the same way............. Culls make great pets.......... we started with your basic backyard pet chicken. Many who become bit by the bug do. All these years later we are sorting, selecting and breeding birds we love. We have grown with what we like and dont like as well in poultry. We dont keep bantams as they dont do well here and we prefer large eggs to eat when not hatching. The bigger the bird the happy hubby is, he just loves large waterfowl and poultry. (aside from his aviary of mandarins he insists are good for the soul to sit and watch)


Edited by Staff