On oprah right now , how our meat is raised

[DuckyBoys]

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Here's the other side to the pigs - and by the way ALL farms will be using gestation pens instead of crates soon - many already are. But anyway - I have several farms who have done the conversion already and have the sows in the gestation pens, plus I have farms who still have crates. here's what the difference is:

Gestation pens = higher mortality. Pigs fight. Ever seen a pig fight?

Gestation pens = more room to move around. More room is good unless you bump into your neighbor, then pigs fight.

Gestation pens = less control over nutrition. Less nutirional control means higher mortality.

Gestation pens DO have crates - the pigs have free choice of which crate they enter and how long they stay in there. And they DO enter. So you'd think - why would a sow want to be in a crate when she could be out in the pen roaming around at will? Because she's fat and cranky and doesn't want anyone touching her. I wish I could post pictures but propiatory blah blah blah...

So while I am very pleased that the move has been made, and by the way ALL the producers who have done it feel it was worthwhile, I can see that it is a trade-off. As is everything.

FYI - ALL hog barns have curtains that open and close. Pigs have very structred environmental conditions.

Another FYI - the farms that have made the move to gestation pens are the largest producers in the country. Look it up and there you go. Big corporate farms doing good things. Who'd a thunk.

 

[Katy]

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Amen to that!!!!!

 

[deerman]

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AGREE what next, people will be telling us we CANT use incubators to hatch eggs, because the chicks need their mommy.

We need to pass a law, all lawyer must wear Bib overalls to court.

 

[mullers3acers]

MissPrissy
very well put!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Msbear]

 

[scooter147]

Saw it,

My issues, the veal calf/crate thing, just plain cruel.

The gestation crates, I think the sows should at leat be able to turn around and lay on their sides.

Batteray cages, the stacked cages with chickens getting pooped on and stuffed 6 to a cage and it was filthy. Cruel

The second egg caged farm looked ok to me. The cages were not stacked, the hens had all their feathers and appreared to have room to move around and it appeared lighter and cleaner. That being said, where "new" hens just placed in the cages and did they just do a great clean up job the day before the film crew arrived.

This is a tough topic, we have lots of mouths to feed in this country and unfortunately I don't think all farm animals can be free range and provide "affordable" food, unless we all go vegetarian.

 

[ChevygirlBeth]

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Amen to that!!!!!

I'm right there with both of you!

I am an 8th generation farm girl... while we don't currently support our family entirely on farming (although I'd like to... maybe someday we will get back to that), it is a way of life for us, like Katy pointed out. I cannot imagine not making hay, raising beef cattle and hogs (and now chickens)!

Most farmers are already underpaid for their products (I'm not talking about factory farms here). People want cheap food... with the way grain prices have been (although they've come down a bit recently), that's not easy for the avrage producer (although many of us have switched to grass fed, which helps)! Most consumers don't understand the work that goes into raising these products (I guess you could compare it to what a stay at home mom's work would be worth if someone paid them). Most people wouldn't be willing to put in the hours in the cold, wet, frozen winters or the hot, sticky summers that farmers spend caring for their livestock. Seriously, if I counted the profit we made on the pigs last year and divided it by the hours we put into caring for the pigs (not counting the hours we spent building our pig building or the materials for the building) we would have made less than $.66/hour.

Now don't think I'm on the side of the factory farmers and their often cruel treatment of animals (although not all of them are that way - my neighbor has a large commercial feeder pig farm and although I am not thrilled about pigs spending their whole life contained in little pens - he and his family treat those pigs very humanely and they have one of the lowest mortality rates of anyone that contracts with the company they're with), because I don't condone the way that many of them run their operations, but I felt I needed to defend those of us on the smaller side of things that are trying our best to raise our products responsibly and lovingly and still try to make a small profit!

 

[poussin_noir]

I missed this show, does anyone know where I could view it, I'm really interested in seeing it.

 

[redhen]

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hi katy..please dont take this wrong..i am not directing this at you at all..as i'm sure your animals are taken care of quite well..

..but , i just have to say...to the ones that are only concerned with a profit margin...um...then get out of the business..these are REAL LIVE, feeling, THINKING animals here...when we start to worry more about the profit than the BASIC humane care of these animals....all i ask of them is to please..get ANOTHER job!!..pigs are very smart..4th smartest creature on the planet...lets think about that..please.(its like having a toddler in a small cage..honestly..read up on them)...but thats just my dumb, uneducated opinion .....Peace, Wendy

I don't know if you've got or have ever had any direct connection to agriculture, but what most people who haven't don't understand is that is isn't just a job, it's a lifestyle completely interwoven with your job. Most farms have had many generations (my grankidskids are the sixth) living on them trying to make a living, so to just say get another job isn't that easy....that's asking them to give up not only their job, but basically their whole life. If a person who raises livestock isn't allowed a profit margin, what are they supposed to live on. A person can't be involved raising cattle, pigs, chickens or any other kind of animal and not care about them. Believe me, the rancher (my husband and I included) who doesn't care isn't going to be out in the middle of the night checking heifers who are due to calve. Believe me that's not much fun when it's cold and wet out. My dad had some hogs when I was growing up and we didn't keep them in crates. They were always fighting and slashing each other open.....is that better? Personally I don't think so. As far as comparing them to putting a toddler in a small cage....if you have kids, did you never put them in a playpen to keep them from getting hurt?

Do I think that animals think and feel? Yes, I do, but they are not humans and people need to quit thinking that they think and feel the same way humans do.

Katy,
i never said that farmers shouldent make a profit....i KNOW that as with ANY job, you have to make money....all i said was..IF thats ALL they care about..then get another job..

...NEVER said or implied that ,that was you.. because i dont think thats you at all...
and i wasnt referring to the birthing pens..i know that sows need to be seperated..so...

..
also..LOL..yes, i have indeed seen pig fights...i have males..you see, pig fights are about a pecking order(much like chickens), and one pig has to submit...and honestly, most pig fights are bluff and shoving around, (thats why when you have a fresh pig..and he challenges you.., you shove him back on his shoulder, hard and fast....make him back up...and you win the pig fight...lol).....actually they rarely result in fatal injury...and even when wounded, pig skin heals very fast...(like the next day sometimes), when mine get a cut from the teeth slashing..or a ear nipped..it is usually healed the next day..honestly..(check it out..)..thats why they use it in skin graphs..., and also, if the pigs have enough room..the fighting is not as bad..they need room to retreat from the attacking pig...and once the other retreats and submits, there is peace...(for awhile anyways..)
also..about the play pen thing...sorry, but you wouldnt leave a baby in a play pen 24 hours aday..its just differant..
and also..no, i dont think that pigs are human...LOL...or i wouldnt eat them..

...but, yes they DO have feelings and emotions....and nothing written on here will ever change that fact..and it is indeed a fact....AND i feel that they should be treated properly until butchering time....thats all i ask...now,,i dont mean like MY spoiled pigs..lol..but..i think you know what i really mean...
and as for the i'm not a farmer comment...lol, nope...you guys work to hard for me!....BUT..i DO raise pigs....so i do have some say, i'd think..

...
again..all i said was..they desverve BASIC humane care..and living in a small box..is not basic humane care..sorry...but its not..
i understand that farmers have it hard...they can barely afford to keep things going sometimes, (thats why i support my local farmers..)...and i know that the local farmers take very good care of their livestock..its the others i was speaking of....thats all...take care, Wendy

 

[OHChick]

i think that until there is a movement across the country for people to learn about their food and where it comes from, nothing will change.

i see the side of the Humane Society of the U.S. and agree, animals deserve to be treated humanely. but additionally i see the side of the farmers...they will go out of business and eggs/meat will be imported from China/Mexico, etc. which to me is repulsive that we would be importing something like eggs! or grain! or milk! this is why we have all these food recalls.

i don't know the answer, other than this is why i know where my food comes from. at least MOST of it.