Orpingtons of Different Standards

[Sonoran Silkies]

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Type makes the breed. It the type is different, they ARE different breeds. The fact that both go by the same moniker is like saying that all girls named Susan are the same person.

 

[lildinkem]

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Type makes the breed. It the type is different, they ARE different breeds. The fact that both go by the same moniker is like saying that all girls named Susan are the same person.

One of the officers in the United Orpington Club insists the difference between the two is very slight. The UK's have a shorter back with a higher tail angle. And they like a looser feathered bird is what she said to me on the phone a week ago. Other then that there both the same breed. Both want a full rounded breast. Both want them at 10 lbs for cocks and 8 lbs for hens. Now the trend in this breed as well as others is to make em as big as you can. But that is not what the SOP wants. When I first got into Poultry the trend was the same for the Australorps. now you are seeing that trend being reversed. Australorps are now getting judged closer to what the standard says in size. I think the best from both will eventually be used in one breed called Orpingtons. You will see the tighter feathering win out, you will see the biggest heads win out, you will see a wider chest, wider back. The legnth of the backs will be medium and not short or too long. I do not see the United Orpington Club encouraging a new breed of Orps based on the UK SOP. I also do not see enough of the UK breeders here getting organized to create a club, and pay the APA to get them accepted. That will take alot of dedication. And that type of dedication is more then buying, feeding and watering Orps.

 

[HallFamilyFarm]

If folks will go back and read my first article on the English Orpington in the January 2011 Poultry Press you will read that I proposed the APA waive the time requirement and hold a qualifying meet for the imported Orpingtons. I have not changed my mind. However, no imported birds were shown at Crossroads. Two would have barely qualified, but the award was declined. So we have acquired some 100% UK blood and will be showing them. Folks will be able to see them in person at the shows we attend. They will be able to compare the two cousin breeds side by side.

We will also be raising a cash award for Lucasville. The American Orpington Poultry Fanciers (AOPF) will promote the seperate showing of these until a breed club is formed. We have a copy of the UK standard on one of our site pages. We were never opposed to the legal importation of any breed. (enough said).

As for the Splash. It is my understanding the ABA accepted Splash in some breeds in 1965. However, the APA accepted the Splash Silkie in 2001. The Splash MGB at Crossroads. (Are Silkies really chickens?

) Back to Orps. If 5 breeders with Splash that have been breeding them for 5 years wish to ask the AOPF to request acceptance, we will be happy to apply. Those breeders will need to help with the cost. It would be best to request both LF and Bantam. We would then need those same breeders to show Splash at the required shows and at the qualifying meet. I would suggest all breeders of Blue Orpingtons start showing their Splash Orpingtons.

I do appreciate the varried opinions on this thread. I also appreciate the "cooperation". We must remain polite or the thread will be closed. I can guarentee it is being watched. So lets discuss this politely and come to a point of agreement that will benefit all.

 

[jeremy]

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You're talking about the Lemon Cuckoos you now have, right?

Here's the issue, I have not seen a single Lemon Cuckoo Orpington in the United States that looks even 50% pure English. The type on the LC birds that are in this country is mediocre at best, the examples that were brought into the States IMO do not accurately reflect the British SOP for an Orpington. They need A LOT of work, or another line needs to be brought in that accurately represents the British SOP.

So that said, how do you plan on showing them alongside their "cousins" and expect people to see a difference when they will look more like an APA Orpington than a British bird?

 

[RedReiner]

what is the American Orpington Poultry Fanciers? when was that started? and why when there is already the United Orpington Club? sorry for all the questions but this is all new to me, the club thing and multiple ones for the same breed. would it not make things much simpler to continue working on things with just one club?

 

[heritagehabitatfarms]

Quote:
You're talking about the Lemon Cuckoos you now have, right?

Here's the issue, I have not seen a single Lemon Cuckoo Orpington in the United States that looks even 50% pure English. The type on the LC birds that are in this country is mediocre at best, the examples that were brought into the States IMO do not accurately reflect the British SOP for an Orpington. They need A LOT of work, or another line needs to be brought in that accurately represents the British SOP.

So that said, how do you plan on showing them alongside their "cousins" and expect people to see a difference when they will look more like an APA Orpington than a British bird?

y is that??? is it because they where imported from Australia??? i don't know much about the LC so i would really like to know... also what would be the best way to improve the one's that are here???

 

[jeremy]

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No, I don't believe they were imported here from Australia, but from the UK.

The quality of the birds just isn't there, they probably came from stock in the UK that didn't exhibit the best type. There are good exhibition quality birds and some less than perfect specimens in the UK just like we have birds of different quality here.

The best way to improve upon the LC stock that we have in the US would be to breed them to nice Buff Orpingtons like those birds pictured on the first page of this thread. Either exhibition APA Orps, keep in mind that you then would be breeding to the American SOP or find an imported line of Buff Orpingtons and breed the Lemons to them. Either way it's going to take time and you will have to cull hard to improve the overall type of the birds.

ETA:

heritagehabitatfarms, here's a picture of what I would consider Lemon Cuckoo Orpingtons with good type. These are obviously bred to the British SOP.

 

[RedReiner]

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The UOC is the most recognized Orpington organization.

Yeah Jim, why is there an American Orpington Poultry Fanciers club? Weren't you instrumental in it's founding?

Actually, aren't you like the president of the club?

Why not just stick with the United Orpington Club?

we better not go into that on this thread it will get closed for sure lol... the current Marans club is the 5th one and for a while there where 3 Marans clubs at the same time... as long as there is ppl with different opinions there will be different breed clubs... it is up to each person to support the club that u see fit IMO...

wow, coming from purebred dogs and other livestock with registries, yes I know chickens do not have pedigrees. there is one parent club, they dont make another club because some do not agree. it gets worked out or remains a split forever. membership majority rules. I can see how this could get confusing very quickly. thank you for the response!

eta apparently I can not speel

 

[HallFamilyFarm]

Folks, lets stay on topic!
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[HallFamilyFarm]

Folks please DO NOT respond to off topic questions or statements. Click the report button if you feel it neccessary.

I will respond to any off topic question via private email or at the AOPF sites.

Thanks,

Jim