Plymouth Rock thread!

A little heresy here. Professor Dryden commented in the early 20th C. that the "type" for Barred Rocks did not bode well for their use as utility birds. He felt the standard birds were too large and too much emphasis was put on barring and other features in the show ring.

Interestingly enough, although the standard disapproves, the dark markings on the legs of pullets were an important feature to the practical poultry man since they made sexing easier, when combined with examination of the head spot. For decades the standard called for equal barring on both pullets and cockerels, and this continued for a few years after it was determined that barring is sex related - so breeders had separate dark and light strains for producing the genders separately for the show ring.

I am not an opponent of showing poultry; I just wish show standards included some utility points. There are a lot of very beautiful birds that lay less than 100 eggs a year, or have too much abdominal fat to make a good carcass. This is one reason that many once useful breeds have become "heritage" and doomed to survive only in show circles. Dryden noted then that the excess abdominal fat would disappear if breeders focused on egg production and utility meat production.

Take a good look at a Decorah or Privett utility bird. They may not be glamorous, but some are still used in commercial farming, especially pastured operations.
 
In the early 20th C. and before, their used to be Production Trials. I think these should be brought back. In the old days breeders submitted a pen for a year long supervised lay. This could even be cut down to ninety days in the summer and fall and give meaningful results. Doing this would encourage keeping utility qualities in our heritage breeds. Think UKC as opposed to AKC.
 
Here are my youngest hatchery type BR hens. Barbara is almost two years old, small bodied, wonky comb, no idea why she's like she is because her grandmother, Ivy, one of my originals from Ideal, was a chunky hen with a really nice comb, and Barbara's sire, Dutch, whose own sire was a big McMurray rooster, was very large bodied, too. I love my show quality types, but my love of Rocks started with Ivy and Lexie, mother of Dutch.

Barbara:
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Here is Barbara with her own mother, Fern, in the background. Fern is about the best layer ever. She has started her molt and quit laying about three days ago. Before that, she just did not miss a day of laying for months. Fern's mother, Ivy, had Maran-like barring.

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I agree completely, and believe hatchery birds DO have a place, just as show birds do. Hatchery stock focuses on the utility aspects of most of their breeders. Something that is lost on folks breeding for show, unfortunately. But, it is what it is, and it's the same with most any livestock on the planet.
 
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Hi Yamika hid,

The breeder I got my Barreds from has a large emphasis on production, also. To be honest, I don't know why so many people think that Standard bred birds don't produce. I've found that mine do (not saying that some don't, though).

The standards are chosen the way they are to emphasize production for the type of breed. Rocks should be balanced for both meat and eggs. IMO, the culling process should be judges on the standard ans these articles the ALBC has to boost production. http://www.albc-usa.org/EducationalResources/chickens.html
Mitch
 
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Hi Yamika hid,

The breeder I got my Barreds from has a large emphasis on production, also. To be honest, I don't know why so many people think that Standard bred birds don't produce. I've found that mine do (not saying that some don't, though).

The standards are chosen the way they are to emphasize production for the type of breed. Rocks should be balanced for both meat and eggs. IMO, the culling process should be judges on the standard ans these articles the ALBC has to boost production. http://www.albc-usa.org/EducationalResources/chickens.html
Mitch


Unfortunately, the standards *don't* correlate with production. Professor Dryden found that conformation and laying were often not related in the ways expected. He found short bodied hens that laid for a living, while many beautiful, typey birds that supposedly had the conformation of a layer were doing well to crank out more than 70 eggs per year.

The only way to breed utility back into show birds is to cull as heavily for carcass quality and egg production as for type. And it just isn't happening - which is one reason that requiring laying trials and carcass examinations would be very useful in improving the stock.
 
Hi Yakima kid,

I disagree (with the standard part). When the birds fit the standard they should produce well to what they were created for.
Here's a quote from the article I posted the link to.
The following information can be used by the producer
to identify birds that will excel in production traits and
would be good candidates to retain for breeding stock.
Keep in mind that any bird that is selected must also
meet the established historic standards for the breed.
These historic standards were written at a time when
chicken breeds were being used for commercial production
within several production systems. Input from
the top breeders of each breed was used to establish
the particulars of size, and other qualities, that would
produce the best specimen for the role each breed was
designed to fulfill
.

Some breeders are doing exactly as you mentioned. Many are involved in the ALBC's recovery projects.
(I'm not disagreeing with you, but I don't think it's quite as bad as you think)
Mitch​
 
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Back off is a poor choice of words. I see other folks stating that Jeremy has the best birds and why is nothing said to them?Jeremy does have the best birds period so whats wrong with that? I will show you lots of examples on this whole website where folks have stated that so and so has the best and nothing was said to them. Sounds like Im being singled out.
 
There is an entire thread dedicated to that one breeder, as you probably already know: https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=399477


He
has wonderful birds, no question. There are some who prefer the birds of other breeders for their own reasons and there is nothing wrong with that, either, but this is not the thread for showcasing one breeder or deciding who is the best of the best. This is the general Plymouth Rock thread for all varieties of Rocks, both breeder/show quality as well as hatchery stock. No one is "singling you out", just trying to keep the thread to its original intent.
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