Preparing Your Flock & Coop for WINTER

[CanaDawn]

Your pictures, by the way, are wonderful, but I am confused by the heater at the top; normally radiant panels are placed near the floor, and the heat travels up. I can't imagine making heat travel downwards from the top unless there was forced air. That tractor and coop are way cool, worth a second look or two and maybe study. Thanks

If they are infrared or radiant heaters, they heat objects not the air, and are just fine placed high.

 

[RnRRidgerunner]

Yes, heat rises, but if you put it under the roost they will get pooped on. The word radiant means it will radiate the heat away from the panel. I believe it can be felt well enough from about a foot to 18 inches, but you could check on that with someone who has one. sounds like you have the water thing figured out. Perhaps heat tape could be wrapped around your piping, just make sure you get the correct length. I got one too long and had to return for a shorter one. They don't use much amperage and are very safe. Glad you liked the pictures, I got the plans on line. I used both the small 1/2 inch wire and chicken wire in some places all covered in 14 gauge 2X4 inch wire fence to critter proof. It is only mobile on smooth ground, not my rocks I had to add four trailer dolly wheels at each corner. ha ha oh just fyi: http://www.chickenmobilestagecoach.com/id67.html the web site.
Good luck

 

[coop410silkies]

'Radiant ceramic panels (or similarly 'pig blankets' are safer, if they are spaced off the wall to allow air flow all the way around, and also it's best to put some mesh between them and the birds so that they don't lean on them... And this also assumes you have them properly wired, and extension cord across the yard is not proper wiring... But they are designed for spot heating not heating an entire structure...

With that said in a 10x12x7 hoop house with no insulation will require several 1000s of watts of electrical heat to keep it above freezing in cold temp a total waste of heat as almost all will simply escape...

The best you could do in this case is build a roosting 'box' inside the hoop house with just the front open, a big enough box that they can all fit in there and roost, then mount the radiant heaters on the back of the box, spaced off the back wall a bit, that way the heat flows across the roosting chickens as it escapes out the front of the box into the hoop house... This of course does little for keeping water liquid in the coop though...

As always if one chooses to heat a coop do it properly and safe, even if it's just heating the water... For most it's simply not advisable to heat the coop, as the cost to do it properly it prohibited in many cases and doing it on the cheap and unsafe is a fire hazard waiting to happen...

I'm not against heating, as I heat my coop to about 35-40°F all winter, but my coop is an actual building with a real forced air furnace it's not some tossed together fire hazzard, I check the furnace filters daily and check the furnace insides weekly to make sure there is no dust accumulations to further minimize risk... I actually have a 2 stage air filter system on the furnace to keep dust out...

MeepBeep, thank you for your input. I think you've saved me from making some serious mistakes. I find myself confused about the heating panels I wanted to use. I don't think they're the same thing as the radiant heat panels some people are talking about. Have considered pig blankets in the distant past, but decided against them for reasons I can't remember. OK, it doesn't make so much difference anymore, since, as I mentioned, I'm not committed to heating my coop, only to keeping clean liquid water available for long periods of time. If I don't heat the coop, I won't be using the drinkers to do that, it's just that simple. I do have electric to my coop, but certainly not anything like that required for the furnace set up that you have. BTW, the description for the little panels I was considering strictly forbade the use of extension cords with them. These panels, as reviewed by several people, raised the ambient room temperature of a 10x12 space by about 10*. Not enough for what I would nee, as you pointed out. So I'm going to simply heat the water and be done with it. The 11 Roos I over wintered in an unheated vinyl covered 7x12 hoop coop survived, even thrived, with no heat. No frostbite whatsoever. There was an attached Dogloo for them to use on especially nasty days, but I don't think they used it much, if ever.

Your idea for the roosting box I thought was very appropriate and well thought out. I used deck boxes in a similar manner, but without the heating. I think they stayed plenty warm, even in double digit negative temperatures. Snow did not stick on these roosting boxes, but blowing snow got in, and with all the respirations, I think moisture - more than cold - was a problem. I will make these boxes available again, but inside bigger, enclosed coops, where I can ventilate them without risk of rain or snow entering.

One of my major challenges has been to set up separate breeding pens for six or so breeding groups. I don't really have a model for this; all I've got is two windswept acres of weeds and a modest SS income. (And of course, a towering intellect). I just keep plugging away, with a need to keep things as simple and uncomplicated as possible. BackyardChickens and threads like yours help a lot. Many thanks,

 

[coop410silkies]

Yes, heat rises, but if you put it under the roost they will get pooped on. The word radiant means it will radiate the heat away from the panel. I believe it can be felt well enough from about a foot to 18 inches, but you could check on that with someone who has one. sounds like you have the water thing figured out. Perhaps heat tape could be wrapped around your piping, just make sure you get the correct length. I got one too long and had to return for a shorter one.  They don't use much amperage and are very safe. Glad you liked the pictures, I got the plans on line. I used both the small 1/2 inch wire and chicken wire in some places all covered in 14 gauge 2X4 inch wire fence to critter proof. It is only mobile on smooth ground, not my rocks I had to add four trailer dolly wheels at each corner. ha ha  oh just fyi:  http://www.chickenmobilestagecoach.com/id67.html   the web site.
Good luck :cd

Thanks, looks like a Project!

 

[CanaDawn]

These panels, as reviewed by several people, raised the ambient room temperature of a 10x12 space by about 10*.

I'm going to take a bet that those spaces were insulated rooms within houses? I can't see a 400w wall panel heater managing that, to be honest, in a hoop enclosure made of tarp. especially if it 's windy.

I would say heating the water only will vastly reduce both the cost and the worry involved. I've seen quite a few options for rigging up water heaters, most of which I can't use as I haven't the space or the number of birds to make it practical, but probably with what you have, you can find something that works well.

 

[coop410silkies]

I'm going to take a bet that those spaces were insulated rooms within houses?  I can't see a 400w wall panel heater managing that, to be honest, in a hoop enclosure made of tarp. especially if it 's windy.

I would say heating the water only will vastly reduce both the cost and the worry involved.  I've seen quite a few options for rigging up water heaters, most of which I can't use as I haven't the space or the number of birds to make it practical, but probably with what you have, you can find something that works well.

Thank you, CanaDawn, for so thoughtfully addressing my winter dilemmas. I've been preoccupied, but I meant to reply earlier. Did I actually get around to posting that -15F = --26C? That was worst case scenario last winter for me. For the record, my 65 gallon rain barrel stayed liquid and usable on all but the nastiest days last winter, even in a totally exposed location and heated with only a 250 watt submersible bucket heater. The spigots NEVER froze on less exposed heated barrels, and not one of the birds in enclosed uninsulated unheated hoop coops got frostbite.

You are right about the panels being used in homes. Even in a 12x10 enclosed hoop coop, a 10* increase from -26C to -16C would not be enough to keep the drinkers from freezing. I would have to enclose everything in a small space, and that is worth neither the trouble nor the expense.

So heating the coops is out. My birds are large Light and Speckled Sussex and are no doubt a bit hardier than your tiny Seramas. My goal in providing larger, enclosed hoop coops for them is to make a space large enough to both shelter their roosting(huddle) boxes (in order to ventilate them adequately) and create a an area wherein they can be comfortable being cooped up in on the worst days. I can put in large heated water sources, along with 100lb capacity feeders, and enjoy my chickens on even the worst of days, not having to worry about them. I know this will not work for your Seramas in their particular situation, but I am hoping you will not worry about my Sussex. I personally cannot imagine living through your kind of cold in the winter, and I can just barely appreciate the commitment it takes to raise small Seramas. I have some Silkies - currently very busy with overpopulating the world with their offspring - which never cease to amaze me at how adaptable and hardy they are. I have different accommodations for them, of course, and even now am having to enlarge THEIR quarters (because they are so reproductive). The heat panels MIGHT work in their little coop, and I will think about that.

Thank you for all your thoughts on the heat panels. and good luck with your Seramas! Best regards from me in Berthoud.

 

[Beekissed]

It was a long winter and here it is August again, and I am reviewing what I did last year, what worked and what didn't. Am so glad this thread has continued as so much of the help shared here has been so useful.

In a nutshell, the winter here was colder (extended periods of subzero temps) than years in the past - with only moderate snow - and the wind was sometime ferocious. The small open end hoop structures, with huge deck boxes for overnight shelter, we're just barely adequate, but much better than nothing. The cinder block heated 5 gallon water buckets worked well, but for all the work they were to set up, my birds much preferred to eat snow. The bucket feeders with 3" elbows worked fine for the chickens - and for all the mice, too. (I can fix that)

The tarp and 1/2" electrical PVC held up fine, even with heavy birds hopping around on them. Two major problems with these, however: 1) they were only 4' feet high, and my back will never forgive me all the bending over I had to do to fill all the feed and water buckets, and 2) because they were open ended, (I think), the chickens were over exposed on really cold days and got bad frostbite on their (rooster) combs. The enclosures they sheltered in overnight were too small to be cooped up in, and I believe they were frost bitten while out running around in the cold during the day. Also, I often cracked the lid open a bit, and melting snow may have dampened their housing a bit.

So this summer I am working on larger (10 x 12 x 7' high) hoop coops that are both enclosed and a snap to construct. They will be big enough to house the overnight huddle boxes, and also to have some decent roost space. Many of last year's woes will be solved with these.

Here is my question, (and it's very possible it may already have been asked and answered in this thread): I have never been a fan for heating coops in the winter - I know birds can be VERY hardy to cold - but I am returning to the idea of using gravity feed water drinkers. I've used large heated rain barrels to good effect, and I've used the light bulb heated horizontal nipple 5 gal water buckets with no problems, but now I'm thinking it would be better to heat the coops just enough to keep the water from freezing. Am thinking to use a Thermocube with a wall panel radiant heater. Gravity feed drinkers will freeze solid in subzero temps, no matter how much I insulate them. So, given the high potential for subzero temps in winter, what wattages might I need to keep my drinkers above freezing? Given a cubic foot space of around 700 to 1200? Taking into account a chicken population of 10 - 15?

I think the panels might be safer than the cinder blocks, especially if I build protection from the chickens around them (hardware cloth?). What do those of you who've had experience with these panels have to say? Is 400 watts OK, or should I get a 600 watt panel for something this size and temperature?

Many thanks to all of you who help out on this thread. Laurie in Berthoud

I'm thinking it would be worlds and worlds easier to just use a heated dog bowl for water in the winter than trying to stick with gravity drinkers in the cold of winter. They are fine for other times but require all kinds of monkey shines and money to keep going in the winter, so why not just have water reservoirs that suit the season? The water bowls use only 25 watts, are easy to fill, clean and maintain and are more than large enough to keep 15 chickens in water all winter, they are very safe to use and last a long time, so the $20 spent on them pays off greatly over the years of use.

Problem solved.

 

[Mrs. K]

Have you ever measured the amount of water chickens need in the winter? It is CONSIDERABLY less than what they need in summer. Mine have never had warm water 24/7. They do just fine.

Truthfully, you are risking burning down your coops for mostly an imaginary need. Black rubber bowls, have two. Fill one, next morning when it is frozen flip it upside down so that the sun shines on it. Fill the second bowl. The sun will melt it enough, even in sub zero weather to drop the ice chunk out, or you can stomp it out.

Really I am finding that a drink once a day is enough for a chicken in very cold weather.

Mrs K

 

[CanaDawn]

I personally cannot imagine living through your kind of cold in the winter, and I can just barely appreciate the commitment it takes to raise small Seramas. I have some Silkies - currently very busy with overpopulating the world with their offspring - which never cease to amaze me at how adaptable and hardy they are. I have different accommodations for them, of course, and even now am having to enlarge THEIR quarters (because they are so reproductive). The heat panels MIGHT work in their little coop, and I will think about that.

Thank you for all your thoughts on the heat panels. and good luck with your Seramas! Best regards from me in Berthoud.

I have one silkie (came for free with the Seramas specifically to help with keeping them thru winter!) and because I have so few birds, I can get away with a small enclosure, and a heat lamp. It makes it easier to cope with the cold, having so few, but harder to deal with water. Most of the heated water options are too big, or too open, to work in the small space I have. If I had more birds, I would do what you're doing and put in a floating or submersible tank heater, in a much larger volume of water, or go with a commercial heated waterer that would work for more birds in more space and could be hung to keep the crap out of it.

I didn't find the Seramas harder to keep over winter than the large birds we had when I was a kid, and only one tiny comb bump got caught by frost last winter. This year I have a run attached to the shed, and may consider some changes to let them have more space. The challenge then is that the Silke doesn't fly and none of them seem interested in using a ramp...so providing heat will have to be reworked - although not heating is just not an option for me.

I'm fine converting C to F with all the converters online, but wasn't sure just how cold it got for you. -26C can be a challenge, but if you get sunshine, and they are sheltered from wind it's not too hard to get the temps up to -10C or so, and even my Seramas were ok at that. It sounds like you have things figured out, though.

I can only imagine how productive Silkies are, as mine has been very determinedly broody this year even with no eggs at all. Maybe next year I will let her sit on some, but we really don't need more birds here, as it would mean ramping up scale on everything! Since we're on a city property, and a fairly small lot, I think we're maxed out already...

 

[CanaDawn]

Have you ever measured the amount of water chickens need in the winter? It is CONSIDERABLY less than what they need in summer. Mine have never had warm water 24/7. They do just fine.

Truthfully, you are risking burning down your coops for mostly an imaginary need. Black rubber bowls, have two. Fill one, next morning when it is frozen flip it upside down so that the sun shines on it. Fill the second bowl. The sun will melt it enough, even in sub zero weather to drop the ice chunk out, or you can stomp it out.

Really I am finding that a drink once a day is enough for a chicken in very cold weather.

Mrs K

Mine are very thirsty twice a day when they get the new waterer. I have no space for rubber bowls, and they would quickly be filthy and unuseable even if they were unfrozen, which they will be, far sooner than the next morning. Heating is absolutely not imaginary need here, with tiny birds and very very cold winters that last 6 months or more.

I'm curious how you measured their need in winter, and what "very cold" is in your area. Maybe our situations are very different. "Subzero" means nothing much to me, between the F/C conversion and the range that "subzero" covers in both scales.