Save The House Sparrows (STHS)

[ChicknsRock]

Honey, you need to get a grip!

But while we are getting all worked up about saving living things, what exactly constitutes a living thing worth saving? Do rats, mice, insects also deserve your protection (oh, my, those murdering chickens, eating all those helpless insects!) Plants are living things; without them, none of us would be here - is it really OK to kill them?!

I think ALL animals deserve our protection. If it wasn't for those rats, mice, and insects, carnivores and insectivores would possibly starve, and plants might take over.

 

[CHICKEN CRAZY1]

Honey, you need to get a grip!

But while we are getting all worked up about saving living things, what exactly constitutes a living thing worth saving? Do rats, mice, insects also deserve your protection (oh, my, those murdering chickens, eating all those helpless insects!) Plants are living things; without them, none of us would be here - is it really OK to kill them?!

I think ALL animals deserve our protection. If it wasn't for those rats, mice, and insects, carnivores and insectivores would possibly starve, and plants might take over.

Yes,some things do need to be uthinized,becuase they pose a threat to humans or domestic animals. But killing birds becuase they kill other birds is like killing wolves,becuase they kill other wolves!

 

[roostersandhens]

Honey, you need to get a grip!

But while we are getting all worked up about saving living things, what exactly constitutes a living thing worth saving? Do rats, mice, insects also deserve your protection (oh, my, those murdering chickens, eating all those helpless insects!) Plants are living things; without them, none of us would be here - is it really OK to kill them?!

I would never dream of killing a rat mouse or insect. That would be a horrible thing to do, I love all living things. If you didn't notice I am an animal rights activist, and animal rights is my life. I do not love killing weeds, because they are so great for the world. But I do eat plants, because unlike animals, plants don't feel pain, plants don't think, plants aren't being tortured. I don't eat animals, or animal products, because they come from a tortured animal who does feel pain, and does have a want to live. And I always feel bad when my chickens eat insects, but I can do nothing to stop it. But almost all my chickens are rescues, mostly from battery cages. But what makes you think, that a life is less important than soda? Or a bag of lifeless chicken food?

 

[Bunnylady]

Quote: I wouldn't bet on this. It has been repeatedly demonstrated that plants that are stressed by one problem frequently get hit by another, because like us, they have a limited ability to fight off attackers. Many years ago, a study was done on a type of pine tree and a small beetle. This beetle is not a problem for a healthy tree, but it can kill a stressed one; the beetles were almost always found in large numbers on stressed trees but hardly ever on healthy ones. The researchers wondered, how did the beetles find the stressed trees? They eventually discovered that the stressed trees gave off an ultra-high frequency vibration that the beetles could "tune in" to. So yes, you could say that the trees were screaming, and that's how the beetles knew which trees to attack.

Given the chance, many plants will change their chemistry in response to an attack. Trees may lose a lot of leaves to caterpillars some years, but it seldom happens twice in the same year because the leaves are loaded with chemicals that are distasteful or even toxic after the first assault. That may not be exactly "thought," but the trees are not passive, inactive victims, they respond.

 

[chooks4life]

Quote: Resource control. By eliminating the clutches of other birds that compete for the same resources within the same territories during the same seasons, they ensure more resources are available to their offspring, and thereby secure better survival rates. It's just a survival trait.

Birds that build families by retaining clutches over the generations, not dispersing far, tend to be more aggressive in defense of territory regarding direct competition because they're a growing company so to speak and always need more resources.
Quote: ....But killing birds becuase they kill other birds is like killing wolves,becuase they kill other wolves!
Technically the analogy would be more accurate if it said the wolves were taken from their native country and introduced to, say, a place with native carnivores in the same (canine) family as they are, but which they kill.

Best wishes.

 

[roostersandhens]

 

[Bunnylady]

Quote: Yes, I realize that the attack on those nestlings wasn't entirely pointless, and this was the point. There were other nest boxes available, so he wasn't after the nesting site per se. This bird wasn't content with harassing the adult birds; by killing the ones that were stationary and therefore vulnerable (the chicks) he could reduce the population pressure in the area as a whole. The territorial imperative in this species is so strong, they don't just defend territory/resources against their own kind, they defend it against any species that might compete with them in any way. They don't "live and let live," or "share and share alike," they want it ALL (rather like some humans, huh?)

 

[chooks4life]

Yes, I realize that the attack on those nestlings wasn't entirely pointless, and this was the point. There were other nest boxes available, so he wasn't after the nesting site per se. This bird wasn't content with harassing the adult birds; by killing the ones that were stationary and therefore vulnerable (the chicks) he could reduce the population pressure in the area as a whole. The territorial imperative in this species is so strong, they don't just defend territory/resources against their own kind, they defend it against any species that might compete with them in any way. They don't "live and let live," or "share and share alike," they want it ALL (rather like some humans, huh?)

Ah, I see. I had thought perhaps you were being somewhat satirical but didn't know for sure.

I've lived in areas with large Sparrow populations and many other similar size or smaller birds lived alongside them, so while I don't deny they can have an impact, I don't think they're as bad as the Flying Canetoad, not by a long shot. I've seen Indian Mynahs attach themselves like ticks to larger birds and just hang by their beaks, wings and legs folded neatly, letting the larger bird carry them around. Sometimes the bird wasn't much larger, they'd just bear it down to the ground by hanging on it, then brutalize it to death. I've seen them assaulting Rainbow Lorikeets fresh from the nest.

We once looked after a little female who'd had a hole almost 2 centimeters deep pecked into the back of her skull by them. I've seen them attacking whole flocks of R.Lori's and they're aggressive birds, dangerous enough by themselves, but the Mynahs don't care. They attack everything. Kookaburras, birds of prey, tiny and large alike. They have a definite and highly aggressive impact on the environment, I wouldn't be surprised if they are responsible for much of the House Sparrow population's decline in Australia.

 

[Bunnylady]

Quote: There is always this risk when introducing a new species - whether the introduction is intentional or not. We in the southern U.S. have suffered the annoyance of fire ants for many years, but I understand the folks in some parts of Texas are now dealing with a species of ant that can even put the fire out of the fire ant, as it were.

 

[DurhamDuck]

Quote: That's my point. House sparrows are too aggressive and assertive. They drive out native birds, killing them or leaving them homeless. They cause all sorts of destruction. To save them is to destroy an entire ecosystem. They do not belong here. Even if we had not touched the bluebird habitat, the house sparrows would have destroyed it by driving out them from nests. This is not nature. It is the opposite of nature.

This is like putting a dog into a ring of rats and saying, "Sure, the dog is a little feisty, but that's nature."

There is nothing natural about introducing an animal into an environment and letting it kill native animals.

This is like starting a "Save the Florida pythons" or "Save the rabid raccoons" campaign. You're hurting countless animals by doing this. Extinction cannot be undone. Look up the passenger pigeon. They are gone forever.

House sparrows are UNNATURAL in North America. If you truly love nature, you will send it back to the way it was before, by helping. Make nests for native birds and keep house sparrows out of it. It doesn't matter how cute they are. They are not good for the environment.