Shadrach's Ex Battery and Rescued chickens thread.

[Shadrach]

Two and a half hours. Mainly dry at 18C.
Despite my awareness of the possible problems of not having a chicken male in the group it is quite apparent that Sylph and Mow have adopted me as their token male. This isn't good. It's kind of sweet and many with hen only flocks seem to be besotted by hens crouching for them and being the leader of the group, but my view is this is so unnatural that it is to be avoided whenever possible.

Is this likely to cause problems should a chicken male be introduced to the group? I'm not sure but I can see potential problems. Any new male introduced now has to compete with me and on one particular issue no new male stands a chance when it comes to providing food, which is possibly the main method a chicken male tries to attract females.

Nothing to be done at the moment but if and when a new chicken male arrives I'm going to have to be very careful about how I behave.

Anyway, yesterdays pictures.

One courgette plant is dying off but the other four are still producing fruit.

 

[Perris]

I don't understand how this extra protein when moulting myth has any credibility. and keeps being recommended when in the majority of cases a bit of logic shows it isn't needed.

Most hens stop laying eggs when they have their annual pre winter full moult. This means the protein that was being used to make the eggs is freed up for feather replacement. Very roughly one third of the protein a hen consumes is used to make an egg.
There may be some advantage for the Cornish CX breed but I would want to see some evidence.

I posted the relevant stuff from Jenni and Winkler on the (featured content) moulting quiz thread this morning; hopefully more people will get the message.

 

[Perris]

Any new male introduced now has to compete with me and on one particular issue no new male stands a chance when it comes to providing food, which is possibly the main method a chicken male tries to attract females.

Nothing to be done at the moment but if and when a new chicken male arrives I'm going to have to be very careful about how I behave.

isn't the food supply situation the same for most backyard keepers?

I get no grief from mine: my guess is that's because I don't handle anyone unless they're sick (or being evicted from the house) so I'm not a perceived rival for the mating game, which is what the roos are mostly focused on. I supply food to all and try to mate with none

 

[Skyeknight]

The organic feed I buy (AR) has higher amounts of protein. If I remember right about 17% for layer en 19% for chick feed. All flock is not something that is sold under that name as far as I know. The chick feed is a good alternative with oyster flakes on the side.
I give my hens the choice between layer pellets and chick crum..

Maybe I am wrong with translating it. I see "kippenkorrel" literally translates to chickenpellets as all flock, and "legkorrel" literally translates to layingpellets as layer pellets. The difference between the 2? legkorrel has 1% less protein and 1% more calcium than kippenkorrel. I also feed a mix a feed and then let my chickens decide what they want.

I don't understand how this extra protein when moulting myth has any credibility. and keeps being recommended when in the majority of cases a bit of logic shows it isn't needed.

Most hens stop laying eggs when they have their annual pre winter full moult. This means the protein that was being used to make the eggs is freed up for feather replacement. Very roughly one third of the protein a hen consumes is used to make an egg.
There may be some advantage for the Cornish CX breed but I would want to see some evidence.

My apologies for spreading misinformation. This is never my intention! What you say does make a lot of sense if you think about it for more than 2 seconds, which I didn't . I thought it was credible because the last thing you want to feed to a (probably overweight) CX is more protein.

 

[RoyalChick]

I posted the relevant stuff from Jenni and Winkler on the (featured content) moulting quiz thread this morning; hopefully more people will get the message.

I am not sure that ‘not needing extra protein for molt’ is the right message when so many people are feeding commercial feed at a % of protein regarded as the minimum for commercial egg production.
Seems to me that most confined hens would benefit from more protein all the time!
Maybe biologically molting is not specifically when they need it - but let those poor birds enjoy it when they can get it even if the excuse is ill-founded.
I am pretty confident my ladies are not protein-deprived. They spend much of their day out and about choosing to eat whatever they want and their commercial feed that is available all the time is 20% protein. And still they - without fail - pick through whatever kitchen scraps I have to get at the protein first, and if for whatever reason there are two different commercial feeds available they always choose the one with more protein.
Admittedly they also love junk carbs like bread and pasta but I have always been intrigued by their ability to ferret out protein.
Tax: one of the Littles that Tassels has taught to grab the small black flies that hang out on the Mugwort.

 

[thistlewick]

Royal Chick - the answer is penny pinching.

The less protein a feed has, the cheaper it is.

People don't want to spend $25-35 bucks on a 40lb bag of feed when they can spend half that for scrimping on the protein.

Considering the consumer bags of feed are all based off practices of large-scale industrial farming of chickens, where the only thing they are interested in is profit and spend the LEAST amount on overhead, I am not at all surprised that such feeds exist for the consumer to buy and 'save a buck' because why not? Saving a buck is nice and people are always strapped.

I feed a 20% all flock because I have cockerels and babies but I will not be switching when they all grow up, even if I get rid of all the cockerels. My girls grew feathers back on their backs outside of molting time -- pretty sure that's because they have plenty of protein.

 

[Perris]

I am not sure that ‘not needing extra protein for molt’ is the right message

To be fair, that's Shad's message rather than Jenni and Winkler's.

If birds have choices, then they can satisfy their appetites for protein and carbs as they wish, which will vary bird to bird, yet that is ignored by feed manufacturers, who are only interested in averages. That is one of my main issues with processed so-called complete feeds.

 

[Labsandchickens8]

I am not sure that ‘not needing extra protein for molt’ is the right message when so many people are feeding commercial feed at a % of protein regarded as the minimum for commercial egg production.
Seems to me that most confined hens would benefit from more protein all the time!
Maybe biologically molting is not specifically when they need it - but let those poor birds enjoy it when they can get it even if the excuse is ill-founded.
I am pretty confident my ladies are not protein-deprived. They spend much of their day out and about choosing to eat whatever they want and their commercial feed that is available all the time is 20% protein. And still they - without fail - pick through whatever kitchen scraps I have to get at the protein first, and if for whatever reason there are two different commercial feeds available they always choose the one with more protein.
Admittedly they also love junk carbs like bread and pasta but I have always been intrigued by their ability to ferret out protein.
Tax: one of the Littles that Tassels has taught to grab the small black flies that hang out on the Mugwort.
View attachment 4207873

I've been wondering if it's possible to feed too much protein? I bought a local feed, milled one hour away and shipped in every Monday morning. The lysine and methionine are at the levels recommended. The first ingredient is "wheat middlings", whatever that is, and corn is not the first ingredient like most feeds. It seems good. I supplement with lots of fresh vegetables and some fruit. I've pulled back on supplemental protein since using this food because I don't want to overload them. There have also been runny poops and I don't know why. I'm hoping just the heat, and them drinking more, but could it be higher protein?
I spend more time worrying about their diet than my own, for sure.

 

[RoyalChick]

Royal Chick - the answer is penny pinching.

The less protein a feed has, the cheaper it is.

People don't want to spend $25-35 bucks on a 40lb bag of feed when they can spend half that for scrimping on the protein.

Considering the consumer bags of feed are all based off practices of large-scale industrial farming of chickens, where the only thing they are interested in is profit and spend the LEAST amount on overhead, I am not at all surprised that such feeds exist for the consumer to buy and 'save a buck' because why not? Saving a buck is nice and people are always strapped.

I feed a 20% all flock because I have cockerels and babies but I will not be switching when they all grow up, even if I get rid of all the cockerels. My girls grew feathers back on their backs outside of molting time -- pretty sure that's because they have plenty of protein.

Oh I know why people feed the lowest protein, I was just arguing that I don’t want to be giving advice not to give more protein at any stage.
If someone can afford to give extra protein and does so to support their birds during molt, I would just let them do so.

 

[RoyalChick]

I've been wondering if it's possible to feed too much protein? I bought a local feed, milled one hour away and shipped in every Monday morning. The lysine and methionine are at the levels recommended. The first ingredient is "wheat middlings", whatever that is, and corn is not the first ingredient like most feeds. It seems good. I supplement with lots of fresh vegetables and some fruit. I've pulled back on supplemental protein since using this food because I don't want to overload them. There have also been runny poops and I don't know why. I'm hoping just the heat, and them drinking more, but could it be higher protein?
I spend more time worrying about their diet than my own, for sure.

I won’t be able to find it but i read something that yes, there can be too much protein, but that looks like 28 or maybe 30% not 18 or 20% (I feed 20%).