She said/He said Who's right? Who's wrong? No one!

[WVduckchick]

Well, my curiosity won. I assisted. No blood, all the vessels had retreated. I made a fairly big hole once it was obvious it had piped internally and poked it with the chisel I had used. No response. Manipulated the beak a bit, not a twich. So, I did what any curious person would do, I unshelled it. Gave it some painful stimuli but no response. Deliberately nicked a vein, no bleeding. Felt it's breast, no beating. Called time of death as sometime in the last day or so.

There was an air embolism in it's neck so I determined that it had internally pipped and drowned. I have pics if anyone is interested but I will only post/pm on request in case there are any squeamish about dead chick pics. Kinda sad in all honesty. *sigh* so close!

Sorry to hear that. I wondered if it had pipped internally. Was there any deformation of the body? I'm curious as to why it might have drowned.

 

[HiyokoInNippon]

Sorry to hear that.  I wondered if it had pipped internally.  Was there any deformation of the body?  I'm curious as to why it might have drowned. 

No deformation besides the air embolism, I checked. The 'bator did fluctuate from 38-42*c every day though so it may have been too weak to hold its head in the aircell. Alternatively, the hair cell may have had a bit of water in it? Some albumen may have leaked in? I just don't know. The beak was below the pip though there was no bleeding in evidence which supports the too weak to hold its head up theory.

Picture in spoiler.

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

[scflock]

SC, I like your new coop. I entertain similar thoughts. I think that if the current poultry craze continues, that one could make a tidy little profit by selling sturdy coops made of re-cycled/purposed materials. Could even take it a step further and sell as a complete kit with coop, feeders, chicks and a broody heat pad. Provide a basic "how to" booklet. What are you using for hardware cloth??

I've sold a few this summer, just messing around and advertising as I build them. I'm not making any profit, but it definitely helps with the cost of supplies. The plan is to get a few floor plans I like and improve on them this winter, build a few to have in stock for next spring. Right now I just start cutting and fastening until I make what I was seeing in my head. Then I save all the pictures and measurements. The wire on this one is just hog wire that I had left over from pen rennovations. Too big, really, but I will use rabbit type hardware cloth on the next one. I just wanted to see how it turned out before I started spending money on materials. I will probably try to couple them with chick sales in the spring, but I don't see much of a profit advantage to adding the feeders and waterers.

 

[BYC910]

I've come to think that all I think may be wrong. and have much research to do again. but one train of thought of mine is this most drug companies fund a lot of Major medical universities . I know for a fact refuse to offer any alternative treatment other than drugs . holistic or herbal is vodo medicine . this words came out of a doctor's mouth along why can't people except their child for what they are and deal with it .would not order the heavy medal scan my child needed so now I deal with it . herbal medicine helped get my child off drugs . vaccine studies are done on confined or isolated flocks most times with the illness induced for development of the vaccine. there are so many ways to go vaccinate or not herbal or not. hard choices here more research needed If I were going to show I would vaccinate . I go to a sale barn I ware rubber boots even if its is hot changes cloths bleach everything before I go around my chickens .Be a good visitor clean and disinfect your self before and after going near someone's flock . be smart about it. treat a show the same way .once again doesn't make it right just the way I think . lot to do today much latter.

and thank you don for sharing with us. to bad your so far away .I would pay you a visit .bet you have great stories .

 

[sjturner79]

No deformation besides the air embolism, I checked. The 'bator did fluctuate from 38-42*c every day though so it may have been too weak to hold its head in the aircell. Alternatively, the hair cell may have had a bit of water in it? Some albumen may have leaked in? I just don't know. The beak was below the pip though there was no bleeding in evidence which supports the too weak to hold its head up theory.

Picture in spoiler.

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

It was definitely finished before it died. Most chicks pip externally before they are anywhere near that ready to emerge.
If you don't know your humidity levels for that incubation I would say that there is a huge chance it drowned right after pipping internally.

 

[HiyokoInNippon]

It was definitely finished before it died. Most chicks pip externally before they are anywhere near that ready to emerge.
If you don't know your humidity levels for that incubation I would say that there is a huge chance it drowned right after pipping internally.

It was basically ambient and it is VERY humid at the moment.

 

[WVduckchick]

No deformation besides the air embolism, I checked. The 'bator did fluctuate from 38-42*c every day though so it may have been too weak to hold its head in the aircell. Alternatively, the hair cell may have had a bit of water in it? Some albumen may have leaked in? I just don't know. The beak was below the pip though there was no bleeding in evidence which supports the too weak to hold its head up theory.

Picture in spoiler.

Oh, I think that chick died several days ago.... I'm sorry...

 

[sjturner79]

It was basically ambient and it is VERY humid at the moment.

Sounds like you need a dehumidifier incubator over in Japan.
I would need a cooling brooder to do spring hatches as even keeping the 6 months olds alive during the weeks we get the over 120f nights is a challenge. Seems to be about an extra 4 days of it each year. It's getting to the point I would love a summer that we didn't go past 110. Despite that I'm busy complaining about how cold and wet it is right now
with a top of 60f

 

[HiyokoInNippon]

Oh, I think that chick died several days ago.... I'm sorry...

I can confirm it died sometime today as I candled it yesterday and it was kicking.

 

[sjturner79]

Sounds like you need a dehumidifier incubator over in Japan.
I would need a cooling brooder to do spring hatches as even keeping the 6 months olds alive during the weeks we get the over 120f nights is a challenge. Seems to be about an extra 4 days of it each year. It's getting to the point I would love a summer that we didn't go past 110. Despite that I'm busy complaining about how cold and wet it is right now
with a top of 60f

And on when to assist if you are going to
1 - if the egg has been noisy for more than 24 hours and gets quieter.
Put small hole in aircell. Place aircell down and candle for internal pip. Usually if water in cell it comes out at this time and chick can proceed normally. Check every hour or 2 for shrink wrapping.
2 - pips external but not well. Careful peel back a tiny piece from above beak to ensure chick can get air. Check hourly for shrink wrap

3- Starts zipping wrong direction then stops. Full assist will be needed.
4. Starts zipping. Stops. Gets noisy.
Chick is stuck. Finish the zip , and take top off. Check for shrink wrap. If not then leave.

If you find you have assisted to early you can use damp cloth, vegetable or baby oil, Vaseline and egg cups or shot glasses to get the chick back to a stable spot to finish ripening.