Silkie/Smooth Sizzle

[PippinTheChicken]

Noted with thanks… please understand I was answering five of the exact same wrong replies to my post at the same time… Not meaning to be rude at all. People love to feed off posts and I find it cringing. I was literally laughing typing out the same thing over and over. I honestly wish that people would read the entire thread before continuing to answer then they would see all of the information that’s been posted and not repeatedly posting the same thing over and over… I guess we all have wishes- but it’s all harmless . this is a chicken forum

Thank you for not being offended.

The replies were still technically correct. Your bird is a sizzle satin.

 

[MysteryChicken]

I clarified I was talking about feather type, not breed.

I don't want to argue. You have your mind set on a breed in the making, I was describing a Feather type you can get in silkies with the same name.

I'm not trying to be rude.

 

[MysteryChicken]

Here's the other thread, so it's not so confusing.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/silkie-smooth-sizzle.1525767/
Both have the same title.

 

[Christyna8]

The replies were still technically correct. Your bird is a sizzle satin.

Maybe we’re reading something different…. most of the comments I was replying too were people telling me this chick WAS NOT sizzle and WAS A barnyard mix or a cross mix… Or WAS A Satin (which is the same thing as a lot of people are also now commenting)
.

 

[PippinTheChicken]

Maybe we’re reading something different…. most of the comments I was replying too were people telling me this chick WAS NOT sizzle and WAS A barnyard mix or a cross mix… Or WAS A Satin (which is the same thing as a lot of people are also now commenting)
.

If the parents are 2 different breeds it is a cross breed.
And it is a satin because a satin is a smooth feathered silkie (on this forum, sizzle is used to describe a satin silkie with frizzle feathers)

 

[Christyna8]

If the parents are 2 different breeds it is a cross breed.
And it is a satin because a satin is a smooth feathered silkie (on this forum, sizzle is used to describe a satin silkie with frizzle feathers)

Sizzles or Satins were started from frizzled Cochins and Silkies.. that’s is there Ancestral history.that is the way this breed started in the first place.
Again. I think everybody’s forgetting the point that half of the hatchlings were curly feathered and half of the hatchlings were smooth feathered FROM THE SAME PARENTS. So that means they were half smooth Satins and half curly satins or what you’re calling frizzles.

these are first generation.

So I guess we’re saying all Sizzles, Satins and Frizzles are barnyard mixes

I understand your striving to prove a point and be right here but I feel like you are bullying me at this point and would appreciate you just unwatching this forum thread

 

[pipdzipdnreadytogo]

Part of the offspring from frizzled Cochins are smooth feathered and we don't still call them frizzles, so I'm not sure what your point is there. Just because they used to be called Sizzles does not mean that that's the currently preferred term, nor does that mean that everyone else is wrong for calling your bird a Satin. Since Satin is less likely to cause confusion, it's the preferred term for smooth-feathered Silkies now, and Sizzle is the term for the birds who inherit the frizzling gene. It's no different than breeding two Blue chickens and ending up with Black and Splash offspring. You wouldn't still call those Blue just because their parents are Blue, right?

Also, yes, technically Sizzles and Satins are barnyard mixes; they are a non-standardized mix between Cochins and Silkies. Frizzles aren't necessarily mixed breeds and no one said they were.

 

[Christyna8]

Part of the offspring from frizzled Cochins are smooth feathered and we don't still call them frizzles, so I'm not sure what your point is there. Just because they used to be called Sizzles does not mean that that's the currently preferred term, nor does that mean that everyone else is wrong for calling your bird a Satin. Since Satin is less likely to cause confusion, it's the preferred term for smooth-feathered Silkies now, and Sizzle is the term for the birds who inherit the frizzling gene. It's no different than breeding two Blue chickens and ending up with Black and Splash offspring. You wouldn't still call those Blue just because their parents are Blue, right?

Also, yes, technically Sizzles and Satins are barnyard mixes; they are a non-standardized mix between Cochins and Silkies. Frizzles aren't necessarily mixed breeds and no one said they were.

 

[Christyna8]

In no post did I ever said that a frizzled chicken should be called a smooth Satin… In fact I have continued to say that the word frizzle doesn’t refer to any breed it just means curly feathered.

My point is so simple.. that these are just first generation. And exactly what you were saying that one hatchling of chicks can produce both frizzled and smooth satins in the same bunch, so they are not a purebred -at least the first generations are not.
they start to breed the smooth feathered either in or out of the next hatchlings depending on what the breeder wants.

 

[pipdzipdnreadytogo]

Yes, but you are also applying the term Sizzle to smooth feathered birds, which by most definitions is incorrect. Even the site you refer to in screenshots contradicts itself on its definition of Sizzle on the very same page, at one point saying Sizzles are frizzled and at another point saying they are the same as Satins and smooth. When you posted about smooth and frizzled coming from the same parents, I simply assumed that you thought they were all Sizzles because they had the same parents and thought I would try to clear that up. That's why I brought up frizzled Cochins and the color Blue.

Frizzling won't ever breed 100% true unless you breed birds with a double dose, also known as frazzled birds, and that's not done because frazzled birds not only have brittle feathering and are often partially or fully naked as a result, but they also have a tendency toward having metabolic and heart issues associated with the frizzling gene. Breeding frizzled to frizzled results in approximately 25% frazzled birds, so it also isn't done by knowledgeable breeders. Typically, you would breed frizzled to smooth, resulting in about equal numbers of the same in the offspring. Thus, you will get both Satins and Sizzles from any hatch out of these birds. There is no breeding out the smooth feathered individuals.

Regardless, the standard considers any trait that breeds true at least 50% of the time to be true breeding, hence how Blue and Frizzle can both be standardized despite producing some birds without those traits when bred with like birds. You are correct, the first generation is not true breeding, but that has more to do with the overall combination of traits and not just frizzling, which is inherited pretty predictably. You have to worry about the comb, the crest, the extra toes, the beard, feathering type, feathering color, skin color, etc. Since the vast majority of these traits are heterozygous in your first generation, the second generation has a huge amount of variability even when that second generation is produced by breeding the first generation back to one of the parent breeds. This is why it takes many generations of selection for specific traits to get to a 'true breeding' flock, and as I said before, even that 'true breeding' flock will produce some frizzled individuals and some smooth individuals because of how the gene works.

Anyway, I guess that's far beyond the point of your thread and I can't really answer any of your original post's question beyond this Satin vs Sizzle stuff, so I guess I'll check out here. I would suggest you post about your bird's leg in the Emergency / Diseases / Injuries forum if you haven't already for more answers focused on that. As you've seen, here in the breeds section, we tend to focus on breeds and genetics so your other question was not really tended to as much. Best of luck!