Silver Appleyard versus Snowy?

[bacres]

Do you have any ducklings for sale? I saw u have eggs but I would mind some ducklings?

 

[CityChicker]

I saw this thread yesterday and forgot to come back and respond when I had more time! Anyway, with Silver Appleyard and Snowy, if you are talking about true Appleyard color- they look completely different. There should be no confusing them. The Mini Appleyards in the US are Snowies. In the UK, they are light-phase restricted Mallard and look like the full size Appleyard. The ones that are what we call "Snowy" are called "Silver" there (not to be confused with "Silver Appleyard"). Whether called Silver or Snowy, the birds are harlequin-phase duskies. Some US sources will attempt to say that Snowy is wild-type harlequin-phase. It isn't (regardless of who tries to tell you that).

In the US, in bantam ducks, the following all have the Snowy color- Silver Bantams (what are sold as "Mini Appleyards"), Snowy Calls, and Snowy Mallards. They all look very similar. I breed both Mini Appleyards and Snow Mallards and honestly some of them look identical. There are small differences in size in all the birds, but there are a lot of birds that blur the lines. There are differences in temperament as well. My Silver Bantams/Mini Appleyards are some of my quietest, calmest birds and are in general a little more Call in type than the Mallards (they were developed from Calls so that makes sense). The Snowy Mallards, in general, are a little louder and some are a little more rambunctious. A lot are also more "racey" and streamlined in appearance, but you lose that trait very fast if you don't breed for it. The Snowy Calls, obviously if they are good quality, have a different body type and should be louder. Again though, I'm sure you could find birds of all three varieties that look identical unfortunately.

None of the birds above are true Silver Appleyard color (Silver and Silver Appleyard are different colors). In Europe, they do have Mini Silver Appleyards that are light-phase restricted mallard. In the US, we don't (or they are not at all common). As Mrs. Turbo said, there are also Silver Appleyard Calls. I have some, but I haven't done breeding tests yet and don't know their genotype, but they do look a lot more like the full size SA, than the US Minis do. In the US we also have Green Head Australian Spotteds, which are light phase Mallard, and can look almost identical to full size SA (editing to add- I mean that the ones that are light phase look like SA. The Aussies *should* though be bred for harlequin phase. If you breed two heterozygous harlequin phase together, you will get 25% light phase, hence the birds that look like SA.). Having bred them for several years now, I strong suspect that some of the Aussies also carry restricted Mallard genes. As it is, it is well known that there are at least 9 different genotypes for the Australian Spotteds depending on whether they have blue or not and are harlequin phase or light phase.

Anyway, I know this is probably the most confusing set of colors/breeds in the US ducks. Once you understand though the basic differences and how the breeds were named, it is easier to understand. The biggest difference between the birds that are the harlequin-phase dusky "Snowy/Silver" and the ones that are light-phase (or harlequin phase) wild type is the eye stripes and head coloration. If the bird has no eyes stripes and a shaded head, they are dusky based and therefore Snowy/Silver. There are other differences as well, but that is one of the easiest discerning factors and I know this post is already becoming a book, LOL. HTH.

 

[Mrs. Turbo]

the two top ducks are silver appleyard call duck hens and the bottom right is a snowy call hen.

this is also a silver appleyard call hen....the coloring can change a little from duck to duck until the breed is more established. They are also not as typey as the other colors becasue they are still a work in progress.

This is another picture of a snowy call duck hen....the snowy hens come with white or brown heads and the color varies. The silver appleyard hens have eyestripes.

silver appleyard call ducklings

 

[CityChicker]

OMG! Those are my birds! I bought some of those hens from you. I wondered if you might be a BYC'er, but kept forgetting to ask. I wasn't making the connection that you were Mrs. Turbo, LOL! How funny. Those girls are doing great. One of the big reasons I wanted them was to see how they compare to my other bantam ducks (because I'm not a Call breeder, I just have a few) and to do some test breedings with them to find out for sure what the genotype of the Appleyard Calls is. Anyway, they are beautiful and have settled in wonderfully. I put them in a larger cage with a pool a few weeks ago that they are sharing with some young mutation Mallard hens. They are getting along great (although I'm moving the Mallards out this week). They are always the first in that cage to greet us and are actually fairly quiet too.

Now that I know who she is, I highly recommend Mrs. Turbo!

 

[bacres]

So a Silver Appleyard it like a Butterscoch mixed with a snowy? Because thats what the coloration looks like to me.


Mrs. Tubro,
Do you have any Snowy calls for sale?

 

[Mrs. Turbo]

Quote:
Yes, you are right.....they are your birds now.....LOL I am glad you like them and they settled in ok.
We sold out of our appleyard, chocolate, and black call ducks so that my dear husband could find room for the ever expanding butterscotch call duck flock..

....The more colors, the more work I guess.

by the way, you can use those pictures if you want to.

 

[bacres]

So you do not raise Snowys any more? Do you have any breeders near PA that have Snowys that might sell some?

 

[Mrs. Turbo]

Quote:
That is a good question....not sure what went into making the appleyards. I do have a snowy/pastel cross drake that came out with a lot of appleyard pattern so I was going to cross the drake on my appleyard hens to improve the type and size and see what happens. There isn't many breeders for the appleyard calls so buying good ones to improve with is kind of out of the question.

I don't have any snowy for sale. I am working harder on improving them this year so I am down to my best trio to raise ducklings out of. I might have some this fall, but not many.

ETA: I can't find my call duck year book at the moment....I will look for it, but maybe someone else has their book?

 

[bacres]

Ok please let me know if you have any hens or pullets for sale im extremly intrested!

 

[CityChicker]

Quote:
I have heard that Butterscotch was created in part from Appleyard (and obviously Blue dilution, which can come from any number of colors), but I haven't found anything yet to say how the Appleyards were created (hence I want to do test breedings). Based on the eye stripes, the dusky of the Snowy would have been bred out if Snowies were used to create Appleyard. If a person was breeding for the same Appleyard color as the full size ducks, they would also probably want to breed out the harlequin phase as well, but that would be lower priority than the dusky, IMO.