Teaching the dog?

[nzpouter]

all our dogs live and play with every animals we kept, they are also fed on raw diets (basically fresh meat of our culls).
They can stay unsupervised in the coop when we think there's predators about.
All in their training, some will take longer than others, some will have accident but as long as they don't make a habit of it, they stay.
Don't ever try to train more than 1 dog at a time as pack mentality can lead to slaughter, always on lead when you're unsure and most important of all, your dog have to know full well what "leave it" means even in your softest tone of voice.

 

[vanilla.exe]

Thank you for the replies everyone!!! He's doing well so far. We had the chicks on the table today and instead of trying to get at them he listened when I told him to sit and eventually became uninterested. Still a long way to go but it looks promising.

 

[Emmalion]

One of my dogs would eat a chick if given the chance. But then again he eats everything... even mice, frogs, snakes, well you get the point... But as for the older chickens he couldn't care less about them. They even sit/stand side by side in the yard watching the world go by. My hens only like my dogs for food and the roos will hang out with them... I think its a boy thing lol

 

[Chihuahuamom444]

It totally depends on the dog, if a dog is a chicken killer ( I unfortunatly own one ) I dont care how much training you do it will be hopeless, trust me, been there done that and if the dog is not a chicken killer , I have a few of those, they will be fine......It is an individual thing

 

[Keeter]

Quote:
so now, rather than go to all the trouble to answer the questions on forums, you charge people $30 for it. Dude.....this is SPAM. since you are really new here, it seems you ONLY joined the forum so that you can span. Is that it? Sorry...not too cool in my book.

Carolinagirl58, please accept my sincere apologies. I only today found your comment. I had done my best to follow rules of the forum, even inquiring first to administration on what to do. Even though I tried to do as recommended, a moderator--no doubt a different one that didn't know of my inquiry and instruction--immediately removed my post. I had no idea you or anyone else would have seen the post and could have responded, so I've not been checking.

My only wish is to help. I've not done this anonymously, like a spammer who can hide without a conscience. I've attached my name to it, so obviously I would not have wanted to offend. I have helped, without any charge, over the past seven years, a couple dozen people who have sought me out and found me, based on some old posts in an earlier attempt to answer someone's question in a forum. Helping each individual took a minimum of an hour on the first phone call, followed by many very long emails, and sometimes more phone calls. So, I've invested at least in the neighborhood of a hundred hours helping for free, and, to avoid an ongoing lifetime of similar requests, I've now spent a couple months of concentrated effort to make this information available online. And more is coming. I know there is no way to answer this issue in a forum without causing confusion, and possible personal injury. I tried, but there's just too much to share.

Because I regret offending, I'm going to give you 60-day access to the video library for free. The money is not of importance, but helping is. I will be sending you log-in credentials via the email system on this forum. But there may have been others offended, as well. All I'm interested in is helping. So if any other reader took similar offense, just write me and say so, and I will also forward you free log-in credentials, without any questions asked. I look forward someday to being able to release this entire video library to the world for free.

Whenever criticized, I try to learn. I've learned that if a dollar is attached to a solution, whether that solution would require selling a great chicken coop or selling a library of information, the person with the solution can't speak up on a forum to answer direct questions. Satisfied customers can, however. I learned I should have waited until the project had been around long enough that the public spoke up and answered the question by sharing what they found. But this leaves the person asking the question now, with a problem now, waiting, with very little chance of direct help. It's frustrating. But I get it. There is way too much advertising and self-promotion. Again, please accept my apologies for my error.

In all heartfelt sincerity,

Bryan

 

[Keeter]

Quote:
This is interesting - how many dogs have you trained? And how long have they been tracked for relapses? How well do other people do with the training?

And is there someplace we can hear (in general) from your customers? A specific program to help dogs lose interest in chickens would be very helpful to me, if I could be sure it was effective most of the time...

Hi, Mulewagon. You can see in my post above why it's taken me so long to respond, with my regrets.

How many dogs have I trained? I've worked with dogs since I was about 12, and I'm now 56. I've always had great success with them, garnering many comments of amazement from friends, but have never worked with dogs in high concentration. I only addressed the chicken issue about eight years ago, more or less. It seemed an easy and obvious solution to me, which has proven to be true. I have since trained a couple dozen with completely universal success, small to large breeds, aggressive known killers to simply overzealous pups. I've helped a couple dozen owners who have called and asked for long-distance assistance; of course, I can't track those, but know that some have had great success, some reported improvement before we quit corresponding, and I know of one lady in her sixties that gave up and rehomed the dog, but stayed in touch and later said she wished she had stayed with it and kept her dog. I believe any failures to be a result of my inability to adequately convey just what to do and how to do it through words alone. I believe the video would have helped ensure success for all. So not huge numbers, but, for me, overwhelming evidence of the universal applicability. I've been personally involved with various teachers of natural horse training, and no one today reasonably questions that there is one universal "horse language." I am a firm believer now, with experience, that the same can be said of domestic dogs relative to their kill behaviors. I have no doubt that there is a reliable "one technique, one result" that will fit all dogs. In fact, we have been fashioning a concept for a $1,000 reward to anyone who brings me a dog for which this does not prove true. I spoke of this on a recent radio interview. I plan on introducing it sometime down the road...but this project is not a main focus in my life, so it will take some time for me to get it pulled together.

Relapses? My experience is that the fix is good for life, and it makes sense to me to believe so. I have not tracked dogs of those people I've helped long distance. I have never known a dog I've trained to relapse to killing chickens. Once you remove the excitement element that any creature causes a dog, the dog has no reason to ever again respond to that creature with grab-and-kill reactions. However, I have had one small relapse in my own terrier. When we moved, the dog went about three years without exposure to chickens. When we finally got chickens again, one day within the first few weeks I caught her carrying one across the yard in her mouth. Previous to her training, she had aggressively killed chickens, but this time the chicken was unharmed, and one very brief, calm retraining period of just two or three minutes has resulted in a return to her protecting chickens rather than her earlier killing them.

The project is too new for me to have a read on how well other people in general do with the training. Until I was making the video, I had always trained with my steps in a particular order, which admittedly required a certain amount of timing skills with animals. And this is the order I taught others via phone and email. But in doing the video, I learned some things from an incredibly difficult dog that caused me to reverse a couple steps, and I believe the result is that those particular timing skills are no longer required. I will be attempting to track and report more on this question as the project matures.

We have considered establishing some kind of forum within the project for people to share their experiences. It's new, and we haven't gone there yet. Some of the people I have helped the most don't have the personality, ability, or perhaps the inclinations to be involved in social sharing, which hampers this element of the project a bit. But in time we'll begin to collect feedback that will put this into proper perspective. So far, I am willing to personally coach anyone who has difficulty with it, but since its release, I've not yet been asked for additional coaching.

Now, let me repeat what I said to Carolinagirl. I have not intended this as a commercial. I intend it as being helpful to someone who had a problem, and as a direct response to you. Any reader of this forum is welcome to a free sixty-day access to the library, until this post is sixty days old (I know from experience that if I don't limit it, this post will hound me for many years). I'll send you your credentials via email. Perhaps you can later start the feedback process.

--Bryan

 

[bryan99705]

Now that we're done beating up a pro that's trying to help.... I treated my dog like a kid and guns, remove the curosity and share the smells while reminding the dog to be nice when they get close and involve the dog in moving birds around the yard. Now he demands to help and guard and has fought several neighbor dogs who got too close. Now when a turkey chick runs away from the group, that the dog feels they should be in, he walks over and circles them till they move back to their dog designated area. Fun to watch

 

[mulewagon]

Bryan, thank you! This was something I had on my list to get, especially as my puppy is very huge, and wants to play with his good buddies, the chickens. We have to lock him up to let them out. So I'm very interested in training methods!

I'll be glad to try it out and review it for you. (Though I wan't the least bit offended by your posting - if you and your crew make a professional video, you have the right to charge for it. I'm delighted that I accidentally got a sample!)

 

[Keeter]

Bryan, you're right on track with my experience: Remove the curiosity, share the smells...all precisely in line with that "universal language" that will work with all dogs, and a good description of what we do. And, your dog's resulting behavior is again parallel to one of my dogs. Not all dogs will turn to this protective behavior, but many will. I believe what makes this the end result is directly related to how well the final steps of training go. If during the training you can be patient enough to work long enough to get the dog to actively follow a chicken and begin to smell the anus of the chicken, that is the moment when it is identifying the chicken as a member of its pack. That is the moment of true acceptance, rather than mere avoidance. And that is what leads to the rounding up and protective behavior. (The terrier mentioned above, with the small relapse, is one that turned to protective behavior, and will help me round them up when one is strayed.)

The "natural" horse trainers finally got the message across that there is indeed a universal horse language, and that old-fashioned "breaking a horse bronco style" isn't necessary. I feel a passion now about getting a similar message out about dogs' killing behaviors, that one technique can and will work for all, and that the bronco styles of tying dead chickens to dogs is no longer necessary. As far as I know, our project is the first to attempt this message. If you or anyone else wants to join and make similar projects, have at it. Let's get the message across, together.

Thanks for your kind commentary.

--Bryan

 

[Keeter]

Mulewagon, happy to have offered, and glad to help. I've had another thought along the path of this project, which I've talked about with staff and friends, and this string of posts opens the opportunity to bring it up.

There are lots of people who keep chickens not as a hobby, but as a means to try to survive. People with fixed, little or no income. Country life the hard way. And add the economic times we're facing on top of it...there's just lots of people who flat can't afford to pay for this help. But the truth is, they may be the ones who need it absolutely the most, in the worst way.

Last week I gave a free entry to a fellow from an Amish community, brought to me by a helpful neighbor of his, and she shared a comment that the fellow said he just couldn't swing the thirty bucks. He needed help not just with chickens, but with dogs killing all kinds of livestock. This technique will work for any animal. She was going to pay for it, but I didn't accept; if she was willing to help a neighbor get training that he needed and couldn't afford, I was willing to do my part.

So, here's an offer that I will put out exclusively to readers of this forum. If you write me and tell me that either you or friends of yours are struggling and can't afford the fee, but badly need the help, I'll gift it. On good faith and trust in humans only, no other questions or proof required.

But it simply can't be done in forum posts.

--Bryan