The American Cemani Breeders Club...open forum

[maranfarmer563]

Cool steads,post some pics for us

 

[Pyxis]

Yes, others showed signs of sickness but not cocci. It was an upper respiratory thing, which is why I had to go the tylan route. Otherwise I normally do not like to use medication on my flocks, but sneezing, wheezing needed to be taken care of.

You should find out what it was that they have. I would send the dead one for a necropsy. Most respiratory things like that leave birds carriers for life. Worse yet, with certain diseases the disease infects the eggs, meaning chicks hatch with it. If that were the case, it would mean you'd no longer be able to sell birds or eggs without spreading the disease to others

 

[Pyxis]

Double post, sorry all!

 

[EpicBlueAcres]

Here are my 2 ayam cemani that I hatched out, they turned 3 weeks old yesterday. Do they seem like good enough specimens to start breeding (& culling)? I had a 3rd that hatched (assisted) with white breast & wing tips but it didn't make. Died at 4 days old, did autopsy, vet said un absorbed yolk and bowels not properly formed.
This thread has been so informative & many of you have gorgeous birds!

 

[maranfarmer563]

They are big for 3 weeks,most be eating good for you. They look healthy and well fathered. How are you wintering them. I have a greenhouse for winter babies that works pretty good. My cemani pullet's have just started laying.

 

[EpicBlueAcres]

They are big for 3 weeks,most be eating good for you. They look healthy and well fathered. How are you wintering them. I have a greenhouse for winter babies that works pretty good. My cemani pullet's have just started laying.

They are chowing down.like little fends! Never had babies grow this quick before. Running all over and jumping up on my hand and climb up to my shoulder and hang out (the one pic).On organic food but they did have some dewormer after a slight sign of coccidia on their first fecal (recheck is Thursday). They will be living in the loft for at least Dec so they can be handled often. Then I have a coop (still need to do the finishing touches) cor them in our barn than is fully climate controlled (heat & a/c) . It's also where my modern game bantam & her polish friend winter. Won't let them onto the outside run portion til spring breaks.

 

[DCchicken]

Here are my 2 ayam cemani that I hatched out, they turned 3 weeks old yesterday. Do they seem like good enough specimens to start breeding (& culling)? I had a 3rd that hatched (assisted) with white breast & wing tips but it didn't make. Died at 4 days old, did autopsy, vet said un absorbed yolk and bowels not properly formed.
This thread has been so informative & many of you have gorgeous birds!

They are way too young to select breeding pairs. I don't select until around 6 months for most of my breeds, although with English Orps, I wait and grow them out to 8 or 9 months. I know many breeders that wait until their chickens are a year or so old before they would even think about pairing them off for breeding. The reason for waiting for older is that they change dramatically as they age. You may have a pullet or cockerel that you think is good but develops issues as they mature. Some people cull at birth. That is fine as long as they wait and cull again once the birds are fully mature (6+ months). Personally I separate out the obvious flaws and those become layers. Then at six months, I re-evaluate. The boys that don't make the cut get processed. The girls that don't meet the Dutch or English standard live on as layers. Those that make the cut are separated out in to compatible trios and given their own breeding pens. Then I hatch chicks from each trio and see if how they work. Sometimes I will even move roosters around to find the best combinations.

You may want to grow out chicks to full maturity just to see how they will turn out. If your rooster is producing high numbers of culls or even ones that look good but mature with silver or gold leakage, it's time to open the wallet and buy a good quality one. Culling will only get you so far. Even the best breeders in the country source new roosters from each other.

 

[EpicBlueAcres]

Yes realize they will still change a lot but was wondering as steads was culling at just a few days old which got me nervous that maybe they only change for the worse not better. These 2 are just my jumping off point ....I plan to acquire more of these guys, this is what hatched from my first set of eggs (9 eggs) I will be buying older birds from now on then hatching here at the farm. Far to nervous with these shipped eggs to do that again

 

[DCchicken]

Yes realize they will still change a lot but was wondering as steads was culling at just a few days old which got me nervous that maybe they only change for the worse not better. These 2 are just my jumping off point ....I plan to acquire more of these guys, this is what hatched from my first set of eggs (9 eggs) I will be buying older birds from now on then hatching here at the farm. Far to nervous with these shipped eggs to do that again

That is the nature of FM breeds. If you understand the nature of hyper-pigmentation (or even just normal pigmentation in other animals), you will find that the pigmentation changes over time in individual birds. Cells get damaged, don't divide correctly, and are shed and replaced with age. For example, you need to learn the difference between clear toenails and white toenails. White toenails will NEVER turn black. But clear toenails break off (or are shed) and turn black when the bird reaches maturity. You have to look for the black soft nail underneath. That is just one example. So the best advice is to just grow out everything and then cull at six months.

I do know many breeders that cull at hatch. Usually it is done due to lack of space or resources to grow out every chick. Or maybe the breeder has developed their own specific formula for improving their line and knows that they must cull a specific percentage as part of that program. I prefer to grow out and learn as I keep notes with each hatch and record their progress growing out. No method is perfect or better than any other. It just depends whether you breeding as a business or as a hobby. I breed as a hobby. So I just assume that every breeding program is going to cost me more than I could ever recoup from selling eggs or chicks. I have even been known to give away eggs, chicks, and roosters. It just depends upon the goal of the program and the finances of that program.

 

[EpicBlueAcres]

That is the nature of FM breeds.  If you understand the nature of hyper-pigmentation (or even just normal pigmentation in other animals), you will find that the pigmentation changes over time in individual birds.  Cells get damaged, don't divide correctly, and are shed and replaced with age.  For example, you need to learn the difference between clear toenails and white toenails.  White toenails will NEVER turn black.  But clear toenails break off (or are shed) and turn black when the bird reaches maturity.  You have to look for the black soft nail underneath.  That is just one example.  So the best advice is to just grow out everything and then cull at six months.

I do know many breeders that cull at hatch.  Usually it is done due to lack of space or resources to grow out every chick.  Or maybe the breeder has developed their own specific formula for improving their line and knows that they must cull a specific percentage as part of that program.  I prefer to grow out and learn as I keep notes with each hatch and record their progress growing out.  No method is perfect or better than any other.  It just depends whether you breeding as a business or as a hobby.  I breed as a hobby.  So I just assume that every breeding program is going to cost me more than I could ever recoup from selling eggs or chicks.  I have even been known to give away eggs, chicks, and roosters.  It just depends upon the goal of the program and the finances of that program.

Thankyou for the great info, I will gladly grow them all out, that is what I was planning (i have lots of space, just converted the horse barn to juvenile "stalls" for the birds this past spring) .Breeding hasv been a hobby but I hope to make it a part of our farms income. I use the extra Roos from my other breeds for meat birds and sell (for backyard flocks that want tame birds) or keep the non quality hens for our eggs sales. I have been reading as much as I can on FM for the past yr probably but know I still have so.much more to.learn.