The Heritage Rhode Island Red Site

[Irishhenman]

He #3 does seem to have that small hump on his back. No matter what angle I took his picture. I appreciate the feed back. It is obvious to me that these four males I kept are strong in some points and weak in others. Trying to learn as much as possible before putting breeding pen #1 together. Everyone has told me it takes a year for this old strain to mature. I had to cull fourteen to four because I couldn't afford to feed them all through the winter. These next two are my top picks but I really want more feed back from the knowledgeable here. I am a beginner with this breed. Bob started me out last year by private messages and a breeders list that he had and gave me. I chose Ron F. birds because I love their looks and dispositions. Bob and Ron F. told me not to be in a hurry to cull. #1 choice is on the right. He has been with the layers for four days and was a real pain to catch. (for me and him both) He is riled up and his wings are askew. I had to really struggle to hold on to him and get him in the cage. He would like to take the head off of boy #2 on the left. #2 choice on the left is alpha cockerel of all others. He crows all day and is the largest of all the males. I keep him in the barn so he remains safe and leaves the hens alone. His comb comes up in back. All four have good and not so good points. Which should go with my pullets for 2014 is the question.

I am only new to this breed but I want to try and learn as much as I can. From what I can see the one on the left ( no. 2 I think ) is a better bird. there is something funny about the way #1's hackle meets his back and while the comb isn't a major problem now I think it might become a problem in future generations, his back also seems to get narrower towards the tail. # 2 looks like a nice stockier brick shape to me. This is just my novice opinion while I am trying to learn about the breed.

 

[har]

Mumsy, I like #2 considering everything he would be my pick. He also just looks the part of a flock rooster more so then the other ones.

Scott

 

[RedRidge]

Quote: Thanks Jim...
a few things... just to show what funny things a camera can do...
#1 and 2 are the same bird.
#3,4, 5 and 6 are the same
and #7 and 8 are the same

I simply wanted to begin to whittle away... these three each had some things I liked... and some things I didn't.
We all have our hot buttons and the middle bird here needs to mature up but has caught my eye for some time as he has some decent width all the way back.
The first bird is smaller than the other two and more compact... yet what I would call more "correct" than those who are growing still.
I worry that the first boy is simply to short backed.... but not sure his current lack of tail feathers isn't contributing to that.
Ironically the largest bird I have is the last one... but in pictures he looks.... weird... almost not enough substance.
Can quite put my finger on it as he is changing a lot right now.
I have 2 who are actually what I would think of as too leggy, they need "more".... of everything. If they get "more" that could be a wow... if not, they will be butt ugly. LOL

That said... until this morning I had the 10 remaining boys all together.
They are simply getting too "cocky" (for lack of a better word)... but there days of freedom are numbered.
They are beginning to square off (as you can tell) so I need to think about providing the "potentials" with their own hotel room.
I fear too many of my decisions are based on maturity right now and not on basic type... since it's frequently hard to see the forest for the trees (or in this case... the lack of trees LOL).
I wanted to ask those who see the potential better than myself.
I have 7 other boys out there, but only 3 others are in the running to stay. I'm just now beginning to pick them apart and the pictures really helped me see better than looking at the birds themselves... they made me wonder "I he really like that"?
I'm counting on some of these guys to look a lot better about Feb or March... but can only keep 4-6 thru til then... 4 would be better as I can run them instead of pen them.
These are May birds and you can bet I will be hatching much earlier than May this coming season.
My setup is limitless until Nov 1st each year, but cozy during the winter months...
I will make due this year, but need to have my extras gone by Nov next year or the coziness could turn into problems.

So... back to the pens... I have a few others I am keeping an eye on... but I feel pretty safe at this point letting the 4 bottom feeders go...

Question... is it normal for the long backed birds to also be the ones who begin to narrow towards the rear?
Seems like when you add a little extra length you sacrifice width... is that true or is just my untrained eye.

 

[FOGELLY]

I lean toward #2 also. The top view being the final decider. As for his comb, I have not put a lot of emphases on combs yet, I have seen several this year that have this trait showing.
I am still picking by type first and working toward the smaller issues.
It is good to see the color on these birds and others that I sent out. Earlier this spring I got all stressed out on my young birds color and about stroked out. After some reflection and a look at what was different than the year before I realized my preferred feed had dropped animal protein. A change of feed got them back inline.

You have a good base to work from.
Start looking at your pullets in relation to your cockerels. Gauge their strengths and weaknesses and match them up that way.
I hope that does not sound to simple minded, but that is how my grandpa brought me up, no matter what animal we were breeding.

Ron

 

[immyjay54]

Thanks Jim...
a few things... just to show what funny things a camera can do...
#1 and 2 are the same bird.
#3,4, 5 and 6 are the same
and #7 and 8 are the same

I simply wanted to begin to whittle away... these three each had some things I liked... and some things I didn't.
We all have our hot buttons and the middle bird here needs to mature up but has caught my eye for some time as he has some decent width all the way back.
The first bird is smaller than the other two and more compact... yet what I would call more "correct" than those who are growing still.
I worry that the first boy is simply to short backed.... but not sure his current lack of tail feathers isn't contributing to that.
Ironically the largest bird I have is the last one... but in pictures he looks.... weird... almost not enough substance.
Can quite put my finger on it as he is changing a lot right now.
I have 2 who are actually what I would think of as too leggy, they need "more".... of everything. If they get "more" that could be a wow... if not, they will be butt ugly. LOL

That said... until this morning I had the 10 remaining boys all together.
They are simply getting too "cocky" (for lack of a better word)... but there days of freedom are numbered.
They are beginning to square off (as you can tell) so I need to think about providing the "potentials" with their own hotel room.
I fear too many of my decisions are based on maturity right now and not on basic type... since it's frequently hard to see the forest for the trees (or in this case... the lack of trees LOL).
I wanted to ask those who see the potential better than myself.
I have 7 other boys out there, but only 3 others are in the running to stay. I'm just now beginning to pick them apart and the pictures really helped me see better than looking at the birds themselves... they made me wonder "I he really like that"?
I'm counting on some of these guys to look a lot better about Feb or March... but can only keep 4-6 thru til then... 4 would be better as I can run them instead of pen them.
These are May birds and you can bet I will be hatching much earlier than May this coming season.
My setup is limitless until Nov 1st each year, but cozy during the winter months...
I will make due this year, but need to have my extras gone by Nov next year or the coziness could turn into problems.

So... back to the pens... I have a few others I am keeping an eye on... but I feel pretty safe at this point letting the 4 bottom feeders go...

Question... is it normal for the long backed birds to also be the ones who begin to narrow towards the rear?
Seems like when you add a little extra length you sacrifice width... is that true or is just my untrained eye.

NO. to the question. I have 7 boys right now that are 7 months old. They are almost all the same as for back length and 3 of them are almost perfect from hackle to tail and 3 I can see the narrowing from quite a distance. The other one is just so so. I don't know if it happens more often with the longer backs or if it is just a trait that we have to try and breed out.
Have fun
Jim

 

[MumsyII]

I am only new to this breed but I want to try and learn as much as I can. From what I can see the one on the left ( no. 2 I think ) is a better bird. there is something funny about the way #1's hackle meets his back and while the comb isn't a major problem now I think it might become a problem in future generations, his back also seems to get narrower towards the tail. # 2 looks like a nice stockier brick shape to me. This is just my novice opinion while I am trying to learn about the breed.

#1 with the odd hackle is younger by a month than #2. His neck and hackle feathers are still coming in from the molt. I saw it when I caught him and he got all stirred up.

These side by side images really helped me re-position these birds in my estimation. Especially with the awesome commentary here. Observing them while free ranging or hanging out on the roost was not getting me anywhere. And the pictures I took with them in the yard were almost worthless. They never quit moving.

All four went into the barn to further grow out. I will re-evaluate them again in another two months. Right in time to set up my breeding pen.

My attempt with the poster board helped me visualize their size better. All have excess of seven inch backs and all are fourteen and fifteen inches tall at the shoulder. The poster board is 20"x30".

 

[immyjay54]

I lean toward #2 also. The top view being the final decider. As for his comb, I have not put a lot of emphases on combs yet, I have seen several this year that have this trait showing.
I am still picking by type first and working toward the smaller issues.
It is good to see the color on these birds and others that I sent out. Earlier this spring I got all stressed out on my young birds color and about stroked out. After some reflection and a look at what was different than the year before I realized my preferred feed had dropped animal protein. A change of feed got them back inline.

You have a good base to work from.
Start looking at your pullets in relation to your cockerels. Gauge their strengths and weaknesses and match them up that way.
I hope that does not sound to simple minded, but that is how my grandpa brought me up, no matter what animal we were breeding.

Ron

So true Ron. I feel that exact way with any/all animals. To many are hung up on the males and not enough emphasis on the females. Funny, I was just reading the page that Bob had on his site "The Secret's in The Dam". Read the whole thing and I liked and agree with it.
Jim

 

[MumsyII]

I lean toward #2 also. The top view being the final decider. As for his comb, I have not put a lot of emphases on combs yet, I have seen several this year that have this trait showing.
I am still picking by type first and working toward the smaller issues.
It is good to see the color on these birds and others that I sent out. Earlier this spring I got all stressed out on my young birds color and about stroked out. After some reflection and a look at what was different than the year before I realized my preferred feed had dropped animal protein. A change of feed got them back inline.

You have a good base to work from.
Start looking at your pullets in relation to your cockerels. Gauge their strengths and weaknesses and match them up that way.
I hope that does not sound to simple minded, but that is how my grandpa brought me up, no matter what animal we were breeding.

Ron

Thank you Ron. My four males have excellent color. I had changed my grain and noticed some of my females are now lighter in color than others. Going back to a higher protein again. My pullets are all good size. No runts at all. Some have better brick shape than others. Some have better tails. One is very cushion-y in shape. I can choose three best of the seven pullets to put in the breeding pen with the best male which is looking like Male #2 as of now.

A group shot was easy by throwing some scratch out. Little bantam Red hen in the foreground. A couple of layers in the mix too.


All have nice broad backs.


A side by side with a bantam RIR and a HRIR pullet. Those little bantam hens have been laying machines. An egg a day.

I've shared my pictures of these three little bantam RIR girls since I hatched them. I adore these little bittys. Wish I had a male for them.

 

[budsbirds]

Thank you Ron. My four males have excellent color. I had changed my grain and noticed some of my females are now lighter in color than others. Going back to a higher protein again. My pullets are all good size. No runts at all. Some have better brick shape than others. Some have better tails. One is very cushion-y in shape. I can choose three best of the seven pullets to put in the breeding pen with the best male which is looking like Male #2 as of now. A group shot was easy by throwing some scratch out. Little bantam Red hen in the foreground. A couple of layers in the mix too. All have nice broad backs. A side by side with a bantam RIR and a HRIR pullet. Those little bantam hens have been laying machines. An egg a day. I've shared my pictures of these three little bantam RIR girls since I hatched them. I adore these little bittys. Wish I had a male for them.

I have several extra bantam males if you really want one. I'll be at the chehalis show November 16. I took reserve SCCL at the PNPA with a cockerel I raised.

 

[Rancher3535]

Great idea putting them in side by side pens.
I have 4 show pens next to each other in the barn... will have to do that and pull up a chair for a while.
I've just been doing the free range observation thing... I know I am missing things.

Years ago when judge Bill Holland was alive he sat me down and said..."The only way to learn and cull birds is by seeing them side by side." He encouraged me to purchase a large amount of show cages to set up and look at them. You can not look at them for a few minutes or hours and get the true picture so give them a couple of days to relax. It helps them to settle down if you leave them there a couple of days then the real pluses and minuses come out. He also said to invite someone who knows the breed if you can to come and look at them with you. They will see things you do not. For years now I have a good friend that has "The Eye" for chickens Al Erquiaga come and go through them once I have culled down to the last 30 or so. It has helped me a lot to do it this way.