The IMPORTED ENGLISH Orpington Thread

[galanie]

Christabelle here is a picture of her a about a month before I show her. She was posing on the backporch. I am looking for the photos I took when she was on Champion Row and her plaque she won.If I find it I will pm it to you.

This was a blue hen I showed at the same show

Same! Gorgeous!

 

[Reyvaughn]

I don't show, but if I did I have 75% English and 100% English, so I would be showing what I have. What I have is what I like and what the breed was originally meant to look like. In my opinion, many of the APA SOP birds look like Australorps and I feel the US ruined a perfectly gorgeous bird. I bought birds off a APA SOP breeder & exhibitor and she told me which of my cockerels looked the best. She told me to keep one that looked like my Australorp roo! I didn't keep any of them and switched to English imports.

You can't accuse someone of cheating when they are showing their bird in the class they are supposed to be. They can't help it if the judge likes the imports better than the home bred birds.

 

[galanie]

I don't show, but if I did I have 75% English and 100% English, so I would be showing what I have.  What I have is what I like and what the breed was originally meant to look like.  In my opinion, many of the APA SOP birds look like Australorps and I feel the US ruined a perfectly gorgeous bird.  I bought birds off a APA SOP breeder & exhibitor and she told me which of my cockerels looked the best.  She told me to keep one that looked like my Australorp roo!  I didn't keep any of them and switched to English imports.

You can't accuse someone of cheating when they are showing their bird in the class they are supposed to be.  They can't help it if the judge likes the imports better than the home bred birds.

Absolutely. They are all supposed to be judged on the APA standard regardless. If I see a bird I consider stunning lose to one that I consider not so stunning, then that is my opinion and has no reflection on the judge. It's nice when the "UK" type win but if they didn't, we'd still have them. Most of the original importers didn't show these birds either at all, or at least didn't until they'd had them a while. But funny, suddenly some of the ones that originally were very against anyone having or showing the UK type now uses those very birds to improve their own flocks.

There actually is very little difference in the UK and APA standards, mainly dealing with the underfluff and the head size. Now, you take an otherwise stunning bird to a show and the fact that their hocks aren't showing might not be enough of a point difference to cause them not to place or win.

 

[Goose and Fig]

I like my imports just fine. And so do plenty of other people by the way they are selling my birds offspring on RBA.

But I would not show mine as APA birds. They are not. All this time spent talking about how NOT American type they are. God forbid somebody mistake anybody's pricey birds for American Orps...Yet you will put them up against them at a show? What a complete DOUBLE STANDARD.

 

[galanie]

I like my imports just fine. And so do plenty of other people by the way they are selling my birds offspring on RBA.  

But I would not show mine as APA birds. They are not. All this time spent talking about how NOT American type they are. God forbid somebody mistake anybody's pricey birds for American Orps...Yet you will put them up against them at a show?  What a complete DOUBLE STANDARD.

We get it. You are free to do as you wish as is anyone else. Let me repeat what has been said at least 4 times now: They are being judged using the APA standards, no matter what you feel they are. If they do not comply closely enough to the APA standards as stated in the SOP then they will not win. Simple. No one is trying to "cheat" anyone else.

 

[rebel yell]

I think I will change my name to "CHEATTING DOUBLE STANDARD" Seems to fit me better .
Ha Ha.
Carry on !!

 

[thedragonlady]

Coming from ME? I don't know what that is supposed to mean. I run a charity farm.
But I would not hire Mario Andretti to design my kids soap box derby car. What about all those children that work with 4H and on their own every year to strive for APA type Orps? I know I am not the only person that finds it unethical. It is cheating. No question about it.

There is no cheating involved here. The APA has the Standard of Perfection for all Orpingtons shown in this country. It is up to the judges to find the best bird that fits that standard. The Orpington is a breed that is in the English class, which designates original country of breed origin, just like all Wyandottes are in the American class.

Many breeders are using imported Orps in their breeding programs today to add new blood, rather than to use Rock, or Wyandotte blood. It makes much more sense to go back to the English lines of the SAME breed.

Most 4-H children show at fairs, and most show hatchery birds. None of the hatchery birds really fit the SOP, an they have had Leghorn blood infused in them. They are small, shallow and narrow bodied, and have improper combs, in addition to lacking proper buff color. It is unfortunatethat many 4-H leaders do not encourage the children to buy from Heritage breeders who breed to the SOP.

 

[melodie_a]

We get it. You are free to do as you wish as is anyone else. Let me repeat what has been said at least 4 times now: They are being judged using the APA standards, no matter what you feel they are. If they do not comply closely enough to the APA standards as stated in the SOP then they will not win. Simple. No one is trying to "cheat" anyone else.

Well said. I don't show birds, and I am new to all of this but I don't understand how it could be termed "cheating" if everyone is being judged to the same standard. It actually seems it would be a slight disadvantage to the English imports, they would have to be even better to overcome any differences. A beautiful bird that fits the criteria of the standard should win no matter what line it comes from.. At least that is how it seems to me as a newbie. I just don't understand the bitterness and provoking attacks.

 

[Goose and Fig]

I like my imports just fine. And so do plenty of other people by the way they are selling my birds offspring on RBA.

But I would not show mine as APA birds. They are not. All this time spent talking about how NOT American type they are. God forbid somebody mistake anybody's pricey birds for American Orps...Yet you will put them up against them at a show? What a complete DOUBLE STANDARD.

I know what the APA says. If you are going to continually emphasize how NOT American APA type your birds are, then you should NOT COMPETE AGAINST THEM. That is a double standard.

Put them up against other UK birds! They are SO COMMON now- you shouldn't have any problem finding other UK birds to compete against.

I am not bitter. I just don't have any reason to slather praise on somebody that I feel is competing unethically.

 

[galanie]

We get it. You are free to do as you wish as is anyone else. Let me repeat what has been said at least 4 times now: They are being judged using the APA standards, no matter what you feel they are. If they do not comply closely enough to the APA standards as stated in the SOP then they will not win. Simple. No one is trying to "cheat" anyone else.

Well said. I don't show birds, and I am new to all of this but I don't understand how it could be termed "cheating" if everyone is being judged to the same standard. It actually seems it would be a slight disadvantage to the English imports, they would have to be even better to overcome any differences. A beautiful bird that fits the criteria of the standard should win no matter what line it comes from.. At least that is how it seems to me as a newbie. I just don't understand the bitterness and provoking attacks.

I and many others here don't understand it either but it does happen here from time to time. And Welcome, by the way.