The Natural Chicken Keeping thread - OTs welcome!

[CedarAcres]

Hey all.. just wanting some opinions on bumble foot. I have a few girls with very minor black scabs at the moment, most are so small that if you didn't look closely you'd think it was dirt. No swelling or redness or anything like that. My family has had chickens here for about 50 years (longer than I've been alive) all in the same environment & coops. The family patriarch has passed away so I can't ask his opinion on this. As far as I know and any other family members can remember, bumblefoot was not really treated here and ignored basically unless it was causing a problem. One girl flew into something yesterday and pulled her scab mostly off, so I ended up removing it and wrapping the foot, but there was not really any infection underneath it, just a very small area which came out attached to the scab but nothing like I've seen in the bumblefoot surgery photos (I've never seen one bad like that). Our yard is very rocky everywhere and the chickens seem to love the areas with the most rocks, naturally, but I think that is the cause (they free range most days).

So what is the consensus.. pull all the scabs, clean & wrap, or wait & ignore unless there is swelling/redness/limping? Just curious on other opinions! I'm not interested in treating something that doesn't need to be treated.

 

[bluebirdnanny]

For those talking about the hawk attacks (I lost one too a few weeks back).... I just started letting mine out again. Though I had been opening the door while I was working outside on the coop. They did not venture to come out until the last day or so and stayed right by coop side.

Today was the first day they cleared the yard to go to the woods where the attack occurred. He only let them stay out there about 15 minutes then brought them back closer to the coop/pen area. It is not fully fenced yet but two sides of what will be their compost to dig in yard area. He did introduce them to the flowering almond bush against the house today too. Going to do a root or stem division next year and put one in their pen as it does that droop over and stays shorter.

One good thing that came of it is it scared the roo out of him for several days and has MADE HIM VERY ASTUTE at watching the sky. If any girl gets out of sight or too far he starts after it scolding... he only lets them go if they run to the coop and go in. Then he will go back to the other girls in hiding and let them out until the "escape to lay egg" returns and runs back to him.

 

[Leahs Mom]

Wow Leahs Mom that's a scary article............I burned pallets last year as starter wood.

My friend thinks I am nuts because I won't burn colored newspaper in my wood stove or anything that's painted or varnished but I never thought of pallet wood. I am also the same way for outdoor fires when we cook

AFL - just remember that not all pallet wood is treated. You may have never had a treated lumber pallet. Just be careful to check. If in doubt, don't

 

[Leahs Mom]

BBN - interesting on your rooster. My husband opened the gate today when he was home and out and they didn't go out at all.

Then when I got home I opened it and was working around. Took them awhile and they went out. Rooster is acting a lot like you describe. And they were only over on the other side shortly. Unfortunately he came back before they all did. I was surprised because he was herding them on the way out and harassing them while over there. Then he came back with a few and didn't go back for the others.

 

[Leahs Mom]

On the bumblefoot - my philosophy:

If it isn't red and infected or swollen I have decided to leave them alone. I did bbf surgery in the winter on one of my girls. There were areas that were infected and she was obviously not feeling well when I discovered it. I have looked at the feet more closely since then and see spots on several of the feet that are small like you describe. I've observed them with no infection, swelling, or heat. Acting quite normal all summer long.

I think it's possible to cause an infection when there wasn't one. So now I just look for the real infection and only treat if I see that.

 

[aaggjg]

how are you using the wormwood? just curious, and how much cinnamon and how often? clearly, I have a long way to go!

I had 2 types of Wormwood ground and leafy ... The ground I just sprinkled a little bit on top of their food. I read that too much can be bad for them so I wasn't heavy handed maybe a Tbsp every week. With the leafy stuff I steeped it in warm water and made a tea. Cinnamon is an amazing antibacterial and fungal ... or so I've read ... I also read that it helps inflammation & soothes the stomach... I sprinkle it on their food ... I also sprinkle tumeric (antioxidant & anti inflammatory) from time to time but I am currently out ......

 

[aaggjg]

On the bumblefoot - my philosophy:

If it isn't red and infected or swollen I have decided to leave them alone. I did bbf surgery in the winter on one of my girls. There were areas that were infected and she was obviously not feeling well when I discovered it. I have looked at the feet more closely since then and see spots on several of the feet that are small like you describe. I've observed them with no infection, swelling, or heat. Acting quite normal all summer long.

I think it's possible to cause an infection when there wasn't one. So now I just look for the real infection and only treat if I see that.

I agree with LM.... I soak their feet in epsom salt bath when I have time. I haven't had one that had red & infected bumblefoot ... My bamtam cochin was limping b/c she ripped out her toenail and that was hurting her... the black scab is healing up and coming off on its own.

 

[ChickChickChicky]

WOOD ASH WARNING

Be sure you don't use ash from anything that may be treated lumber. LOTS OF PALLETS ARE MADE FROM TREATED LUMBER. BEWARE. If in doubt, don't burn it or be around a fire in which it may be....and DON'T USE IT IN YOUR CHICKEN DUST AREA!




Additionally... Please don't use treated lumber around your chickens or other animals. Even if the wood is free. It's not worth the risk.

This is a pretty quick read with other resources if you're interested in knowing more.
http://www.extension.purdue.edu/extmedia/HENV/HENV-100-W.pdf

CCA (chromated copper arsenic) treated wood is no longer used in residential applications, and treated wood is not USUALLY used in pallets. However, today's treated wood still has some heavy duty chemicals in it and really should never be burned. Here's a snippet of info from a wood products producers website...

Why was the use of CCA discontinued for residential and general consumer use?

In recent years preservative treated wood received negative publicity mainly focused on the use of arsenic in CCA. The increasing pressure to eliminate the use of CCA resulted in the treated wood products industry voluntarily transitioning from CCA to alternative preservative systems.
CCA is no longer being produced for residential or general consumer use.​

What products are still manufactured using CCA?

CCA treated wood products are still produced for use in some industrial, highway, and agricultural applications. These uses will include wood used as poles, piles, guardrail posts, and wood used in saltwater marine exposures..​

What products took the place of CCA-C?

A number of alternative preservatives are available. These include ACQ-C (Alkaline Copper Quat Type C), ACQ-D Carbonate (Alkaline Copper Quat Type D, Carbonate formulation), CA-B/ CA-C (Copper Azole Types B and C), µCA-C (Azole biocide), as well as SBX/DOT (Sodium Borate) and Zinc Borate preservatives. As mentioned earlier, each preservative usually has a number of variations available so care should be exercised when specifying treated wood.
It is expected that the formulations used in these products will continue to undergo periodic modifications so once again, care should be exercised when specifying any treated wood.​

 

[ChickensAreSweet]

Hey all.. just wanting some opinions on bumble foot. I have a few girls with very minor black scabs at the moment, most are so small that if you didn't look closely you'd think it was dirt. No swelling or redness or anything like that. My family has had chickens here for about 50 years (longer than I've been alive) all in the same environment & coops. The family patriarch has passed away so I can't ask his opinion on this. As far as I know and any other family members can remember, bumblefoot was not really treated here and ignored basically unless it was causing a problem. One girl flew into something yesterday and pulled her scab mostly off, so I ended up removing it and wrapping the foot, but there was not really any infection underneath it, just a very small area which came out attached to the scab but nothing like I've seen in the bumblefoot surgery photos (I've never seen one bad like that). Our yard is very rocky everywhere and the chickens seem to love the areas with the most rocks, naturally, but I think that is the cause (they free range most days).

So what is the consensus.. pull all the scabs, clean & wrap, or wait & ignore unless there is swelling/redness/limping? Just curious on other opinions! I'm not interested in treating something that doesn't need to be treated.

I have never treated bumblefoot, and all I have seen are the little black scabs with no redness or swelling on my birds before. I decided that it was a worse risk for infection to open those up.

 

[delisha]

Quote: All chickens have worms..it does not matter if you worm them or not.

IMO..if you worm your birds you end up with more worms and a body that no longer resists over load and worms that are highly resistant.

I do not worm..I do take two samples a year into the vet. Both dog and chicken. I butcher out my birds and eat them. I can't have worm over load. I have no idea what I would do if I ever did have it..
All anyone can do is the best they can. Figure out what works for them and where they live and the type of set up they have.
If worms are on your mind..buy a microscope online. Testing your own droppings is not hard to do. Eventually I will do that myself.

Silver Laced Wyandotte chicks

Hey all.. just wanting some opinions on bumble foot. I have a few girls with very minor black scabs at the moment, most are so small that if you didn't look closely you'd think it was dirt. No swelling or redness or anything like that. My family has had chickens here for about 50 years (longer than I've been alive) all in the same environment & coops. The family patriarch has passed away so I can't ask his opinion on this. As far as I know and any other family members can remember, bumblefoot was not really treated here and ignored basically unless it was causing a problem. One girl flew into something yesterday and pulled her scab mostly off, so I ended up removing it and wrapping the foot, but there was not really any infection underneath it, just a very small area which came out attached to the scab but nothing like I've seen in the bumblefoot surgery photos (I've never seen one bad like that). Our yard is very rocky everywhere and the chickens seem to love the areas with the most rocks, naturally, but I think that is the cause (they free range most days).

So what is the consensus.. pull all the scabs, clean & wrap, or wait & ignore unless there is swelling/redness/limping? Just curious on other opinions! I'm not interested in treating something that doesn't need to be treated.

I do not do anything for bumble foot. I have not had a bad case for over 10 years. Most of them are on my heavy birds and usually clean up pretty easy. I have a nail brush I scrub feet with soap and water if I see little spots starting. The scrubbing loosens dirt and debris and I can see if anything is lodged in the gland with flushing with the hose.
I like and use vet wrap.
My DH dropped a 12 lb rooster and broke his leg. I set it and wrapped it with vet wrap. I was glad I did not have to pin it with any metal. I took the wrap off and left it off after 4 weeks. He has a swollen hock from the wrap and some ruff scales, other than that..he is good to go.

On the bumblefoot - my philosophy:

If it isn't red and infected or swollen I have decided to leave them alone. I did bbf surgery in the winter on one of my girls. There were areas that were infected and she was obviously not feeling well when I discovered it. I have looked at the feet more closely since then and see spots on several of the feet that are small like you describe. I've observed them with no infection, swelling, or heat. Acting quite normal all summer long.

I think it's possible to cause an infection when there wasn't one. So now I just look for the real infection and only treat if I see that.

x2.