Two different 'come' commands? (esp. for those who show obed. dogs)

[Widget]

With my collie, Starbuck, I used "Front" for his recalls in obedience. I also trained him to hand signals too. I don't think it really matters what the word is as long as the dog responds. "Front" made sense since it isn't a word that is normally used in everyday conversations. Starbuck would also respond to "come" but he knew that if I said 'Starbuck, Front' I meant business. it worked since he did get his CD and his RN titles. He was one leg away from his RA title but due to health issues (myasthenia gravis) I had to retire him. He just couldn't make the jumps.

 

[wordgirl]

Oh, good, then, I'm not the only one who's ever thought of it.

'Front' - I'll probably use that. I was having trouble find a good alternate 'come.'

Thanks to everybody!

 

[RiverOtter]

With mine, Come means COME, come right this second, as fast as you possibly can and park it at my feet awaiting orders. I'm not doing competition right now and I prefer a Schutzhund type response to an AKC obedience type response so if the dog leaves skidmarks and crashes into my legs, I'm cool with that. And the command is <dog's name> Come.

But mostly I just want the dog near me. And for that I call their name and whistle. That means, "If your furry rump isn't within 5 feet of me quick Hoo, buddy you are missing out on something GOOD" And I start training them this by when they are pups, I walk them through field and forest and whistle every time I change direction - because there is always something GOOD when they come to me. They learn that a whistle means Find Mom! and they do.
Between 5 and 9 months is when they are not inclined to Find Mom, so I make certain to practice very structured obedience then and really at that age they can't be trusted off a long line anyway, so we do plenty of the formal Come command. But once they can be trusted they never have any confusion over "We're walking through the back field and I want you near me, but it's ok if you bounce over to me and then bounce off" and COME.
I think it actually reinforces the Come command because humans (me included) can get lazy and it is a command that you never want to say even ONCE without the desired response.

 

[Brody's Broodello]

I always use the word Front for the recall. That way my dog always knows that I expect him to come & sit in front of me. For the heel, and the finish after the "front" I always use the command "with me". That way the dog knows that I expect them to be on my left side,shoulder at my leg.

 

[pbjmaker]

Quote:
So that is why my 5 month old pups are being stinkers right now. One has been through a "formal" class and did well, but lately has been a little bit of a poo. I talked to a trainer on Saturday and she said to ignore the "bad" behaviors (jumping up for treats - big no no) and they will go away.

I did learn that you never call the come command unless you can enforce it as a puppy.
I think I will use the "Front" command though as we are looking into doing obedience/agility with the one dog (he takes great joy in leaping over 3 foot fences already and they are smallish dogs) and the other dog I want to guide to therapy work (he is chunky, fat and loves to be petted)

 

[patandchickens]

I've been using "C'mere" and "Front" with Russell and he seems to grasp the difference between them just fine ('git over here where I can touch you' in general, versus an obedience-style "arrive and sit in front of me"). (N.b. the reason I do not use "come" for either of these is because my idiot husband has a strong tendency to shout it at the dog under circumstances when there is zero chance that the dog will actually obey, and shout it over and over and over to boot, so I figure this way at least it's not undermining an actual cue word

)

Russell also does not seem to have any confusion between "let's go" (meaning 'walk with me on a loose leash, or within range of where you would be if you actually had a leash on at the moment') and "heel" (meaning, stay with your shoulder level with my knee and look at me as we go along).

Frankly I'm not sure that in either case the two actions are as closely-related and confusable to HIM as they are to ME

Pat

 

[pbjmaker]

I finally got my husband to see the light on why yelling Come at the puppies is not a good idea when they are in trouble. He has quit doing it. See I can train puppies AND husbands.

 

[Brindlebtch]

I've always used come. Agility, Obedience and in general. My dogs understand what is wanted by the situation. I do like schutzhund style recall and will take enthusiasm over points. Usually judges will award enthusiasm, anyway.

 

[GalloFino]

Dogs don't generalize well.

This is why you have to teach them to do something, then practice with them doing that something in a million different situations to get them to be really and truly reliable. You saying 'come' to your dog when you're in the house or on a walk or whatever looks and feels different to the dog than when you leave them on a sit-stay, walk away leading with your right leg, turn around, stand tall, look them in the eyes and say 'come' in an obedience ring. I'd guarantee the quality of your voice is different in this situation than it is in casual situations as well.

Use the same word, use different words, it really doesn't matter, the situation is different enough that the dog will behave differently in a practicing or competing in formal obedience situation than it does in a casual situation. What will matter to performance in the ring is that you do fronts and finishes in your front yard, in your back yard, out on the sidewalk, at the park, at training class, in the pedestrian mall, etc, etc, etc.

In terms of having a dog that always comes when called regardless of distractions, (independent of the issue of whether it just comes close to you or does a front), an argument has been made that you should use classical conditioning linked to a word that the dog is never going to hear under any other circumstances so as not to weaken the power of the conditioned response to that word. This is a theoretically sound approach, although I reckon most people would fail in doing the sheer amount of work to accomplish it.

Here is a link to Shirley Chong's instructions on how to carry out this conditioning:

http://www.shirleychong.com/keepers/Lesson6.html

Good luck and enjoy training your dog!

 

[GalloFino]

On preview, what Brindlebtch said.