What’s important to you about feed?

[Weeg]

I see, thanks for clarifying! It just shows how much info there is to learn/unlearn.

GMOs are supposed to be banned here so, it makes sense not to look into them too much.

It also makes perfect sense though, that that one Monsanto product (glyphosate) would act differently when sprayed on another of their products (GMO plants). If sprayed just before the harvest, would there be enough time to kill the weeds in the crops?

I think the point of spraying before harvest, non gmo plants, is to dry them. The glyphosate causes the plant to dry faster than if left to dry naturally. Then they sprayed crop is going into chicken feed.

 

[saysfaa]

I would be interested to know more about why you would choose the non-organic, all else equal.

The roots of why:

I was a new mom when the Alar scare happened. This is a pretty concise description of it. Both sides of my family were primarily fruit farmers at that time. Not apples, so the effect wasn't direct but it hit pretty close to home anyway. The article says the apple industry was saved from collapsing. Maybe so, but a lot of apple farmers went bankrupt. For an error in one study. Despite solid published evidence from several sources over many years prior to the errorous study.

And it didn't end with acknowledging the error. It ended with the makers of Alar going bankrupt and federal regulation of the term "Organic."

This source has a sketchy name but it describes the history of organic certification pretty close to how I remember it (as an interested observer) from Rodale's Organic Gardening Magazines from the sixties and seventies (which included some history) on. So I used it to save a lot of typing here. I haven't read what else it says about anything and I don't necessarily agree with all of the author's goals.

 

[high5]

I think the point of spraying before harvest, non gmo plants, is to dry them. The glyphosate causes the plant to dry faster than if left to dry naturally. Then they sprayed crop is going into chicken feed.

It's incredible, and just shows that they don't give a damn about people or animals!

 

[Weeg]

It's incredible, and just shows that they don't give a damn about people or animals!

Agreed. That counts for dogs, cats, chickens, etc. I switched to homemade raw for the pups 3 years ago because of it.

 

[3KillerBs]

I want 18-20% protein and no calcium because I have a mixed flock.

After that, price per pound.

I don't care if it's pellet or crumble unless I'm feeding chicks too young to eat pellets. I don't care about the brand name.

Just feed the chickens.

 

[Iluveggers]

The roots of why:

I was a new mom when the Alar scare happened. This is a pretty concise description of it. Both sides of my family were primarily fruit farmers at that time. Not apples, so the effect wasn't direct but it hit pretty close to home anyway. The article says the apple industry was saved from collapsing. Maybe so, but a lot of apple farmers went bankrupt. For an error in one study. Despite solid published evidence from several sources over many years prior to the errorous study.

And it didn't end with acknowledging the error. It ended with the makers of Alar going bankrupt and federal regulation of the term "Organic."

This source has a sketchy name but it describes the history of organic certification pretty close to how I remember it (as an interested observer) from Rodale's Organic Gardening Magazines from the sixties and seventies (which included some history) on. So I used it to save a lot of typing here. I haven't read what else it says about anything and I don't necessarily agree with all of the author's goals.

I agree that the government control/regulation of organic farming has become extremely complex. However the control Montsano has over the farming industry is insane. So many corn farmers were out out of business and sued because they saved their own seed, yet a corn crop miles down the road would cross-pollinate with their field, and Montsano would come and accuse them of stealing. The lawyers would fight them til they had nothing left. It is extremely difficult to find non-gmo corn or soy, and the expense is getting worse. It is a risk for farmers to try to keep a “clean” field. I will support those who grow non-gmo and organic corn and soy.

I understand how the apple scare could make you upset as a fruit farmer, for sure.

 

[MysteryChicken]

My choices:

Higher Protein

Prebiotic/Probiotic

Meets Basic Nutritional Needs

Pellets

Crumbles

.......Fats is one thing that I look for in my feeds, & the Nutrena feeds have a good amount, but not excessive fats.(Not a Listed Choice)

For calcium I offer oyster shells in a separate feeder for the hens. I don't waste my money on layer feed anymore, plus I have roosters.

 

[saysfaa]

I would be interested to know more about why you would choose the non-organic, all else equal.

The roots of why...

The growth of why...

One branch is:
Time after time, there is another Alar-type scare.... unsupported claims part; not so much the scale.

Pine as bedding is latest one I came across... Here is the context thread. The person making the case gives lots of references but the sources she cites don't support her position that pine bedding is toxic. Like this one about dieldrin in pine...

"Owls died... which were fed mainly on laboratory mice...Analysis of the livers of these owls revealed the presence of dieldrin at concentrations of 7-30 p.p,m, [the mice] were also found to have dieldrin in their livers...the sawdust used at the suppliers was found to contain [high] concentrations of dieldrin...This sawdust came from a factory specialising in the manufacture of window and door frames, which are treated to protect the wood against woodworm infestation. One of the insecticides used for this purpose is dieldrin...."

Another branch is:
The idea that there is no safe level of whatever-is-being-villeinized. Our neighbor went out of business because "safety concerns" caused the EPA (edit to correct or clarify - whichever agency it was, could have been the FDA). Probably to require him to refrigerate his canned picked asparagus.

EWG doesn't say how they picked 150 parts per billion as "an adequate margin of safety." As opposed to the 30 parts per million the EPA uses - which does say how they determine safe levels of such substances: They find what level gives no effects in lab animals and add an additional margin of error of 100 time or 1000 times.

Edit to add: for perspective, the testing EWG commissioned found 126 - 2837 parts per billion depending on which product... for sample 1. So less than a tenth the legal requirement.

My math skills are weak - isn't 30 parts per million equal to 30,000 parts per billion?

EWG says, "just because something is legal doesn’t mean it’s safe." I agree with that. At the same time, just because something can be measured doesn't mean it is unsafe.

 

[saysfaa]

I agree that the government control/regulation of organic farming has become extremely complex. However the control Montsano has over the farming industry is insane. So many corn farmers were out out of business and sued because they saved their own seed, yet a corn crop miles down the road would cross-pollinate with their field, and Montsano would come and accuse them of stealing. The lawyers would fight them til they had nothing left. It is extremely difficult to find non-gmo corn or soy, and the expense is getting worse. It is a risk for farmers to try to keep a “clean” field. I will support those who grow non-gmo and organic corn and soy.

I understand how the apple scare could make you upset as a fruit farmer, for sure.

Yes, I detest Monsanto. That happened to wheat farmers too. Worse, they went to Mexico? to collect seed from tribes that had raised it for centuries, patented it (or derivatives of it), then sued the farmers they got the original seeds from because the original was close enough to the patented version that they could. I don't have a source for that - I read about it long ago and couldn't find it last time I looked.

 

[Auntiejessi3]

Kalmbach 20% Non GMO flock raiser crumbles. I like the higher protein for feather quality and all around health, and for when I have chicks. Crumbles because my ladies won't eat pellets (unless wetted into a mash) also easy for the chicks. I provide oyster/egg shell on the side because I also think they know when they need it and how much they need. I've been feeding this for almost 2 years and won't change.