Who Has the Best Marans?

[gojira]

Yes you are right high standards and consistency . I don't know why some people have wide swings in type. I guess that's their thing.
for myself I'll take a balanced gene pool and pull virtue in from both sides of the pedigree everyday of the week. hopefully removing fault as I do that.
The phrase " balanced gene pool" is "the middle of the road".

A balanced gene pool is mediocrity. If a gene pool were balanced, they would have the same virtues on each side, and you woukd not remove faults, because they would be fixed into the line. That is what the middle of the road is. You could have a clean gene pool, and have more consistency, and less wasted effort.

 

[3riverschick]

most Marans in the United States are not pure French genetics. the first Americans came from Belgium by way of Mr. Fugate. then Marans were imported from England. it is arguable that English Marans have no French blood in them. there is documentation on that back around 2001-2002.
The English strain Marans came to America They also came to America from aEngland down from Canada. then they were all bred together. so we had the Belgian birds and we had the British birds used to make U.S. strains. I am not sure off hand the source for the genetics in Mr Ripley's flock. Have to check back on that. then the pure French genetics came over by way of Little Peddler.

 

[3riverschick]

No, one would improve depth ,breast profile and station staying within the SOP requirements including weight.
A balanced gene pool could be mediocre I guess , but that's not what I'm talking about . I'm talking about "stability ". a balanced gene pool is stable . it has an equilibrium. the wise small breeder will add to that equilibrium in small amounts from both sides of the pedigree so they improve the quality of the gene pool while keeping it still stable.

 

[3riverschick]

Oh my goodness it's late. I have to get up early tomorrow morning .
good talking to you.
I'll see you later.
Karen

 

[The Moonshiner]

I tend to type so that elementary school students can understand, and I can't make it any simpler than that.

I appreciate you dumbing down your posts so even hillbillies like me can follow along.
I did re-read your posts and to be honest all you really ever post is how everyone else is wrong and you want everything to be an argument.
Always a lot to say but in the end you really don't say much of anything.
Egg color is just another trait and there's no reason it can't be bred for and bred for successfully as any other trait.
Every breeder deals with strengths and weaknesses in their lines and should be breeding to improve all aspects of the breed. If They choose to put egg color as a lower priority then that's what they choose but it doesn't mean its impossible to have quality birds and quality egg color.
Your posts make it out like you have to pick one or the other and there's no reason that has to be the case.
Of course if you don't worrying too much about one trait or another then you can concentrate your efforts more on the traits you do choose as important and get further on them but I still say that's not doing the breed as a whole justice.

 

[The Moonshiner]

@eggexcitedforlife
I get it too.
Maybe you're not a know it all breeder and maybe you're not striving to be a top show breeder that's name gets in publications but that's alright. There's tons of breeders and tons of ideas about breeding.
I've learned from show breeders that breed for their egos and I've learned from breeders that just make a living raising layer breeds and selling chicks. Its all good.
Now days all I breed for is myself and I love it. I can spend all day evaluating my breeding stock, getting excited about what I hatched that week, future breeding plans and projects, learning genetics, etc etc.
Imo you have it figured out. At the end of the day I'm guessing you're getting the same joy out of it as I do.

 

[3riverschick]

I 2nd all that Moonshiner wrote. I used to think people would buy my Birds because I knew how excellent they were. I found out that's not the case. so now I just breed for myself. I love the joy of seeing my research manifest itself in the chicks. I love the research that enables that. I love using cutting-edge research to advance my breeding program without having to worry about somebody saying, " huh? you did what?". I just enjoy having a beautiful thing and making prettier. I get it .
What is greatness? I studied years to figure that out . I finally found the answer in the quotes of Frank Lloyd Wright the great architect . He said," Form follows function _ that has been misunderstood. Form and function should be one, joined in spiritual union.". That's fine but where does greatness come in in this? For me, the measure of greatness in something is the measure of the perfection of that spiritual union between Form and Function. The degree of perfection of that Union results in perfection of symmetry and design. It creates an object which fills the eye. you want to keep looking at it. the balance is riveting, the symmetry a delight to the eye. For me, that is greatness.
In addition, there is also the X Factor . That compilation of nuances in the breed or the object which states it definitely " is " what it is.
Take my Sussex for instance. the Sussex breed has a singular charm, like many other breeds . I can look at a bird colored like a Sussex and say, " that's a nice bird.". I can look at another bird and say *that's* a Sussex! it oozes the charm and the nuances of the breed that make you know it's a "Sussex".
Best ,
Karen

 

[EggSighted4Life]

you have something else to cull for, the beetle green sheen. The Standard only mentions beetle green sheen in Wheaten Marans males.

Guess it turn out you don't know it all after all. But thanks for your input anyways. The green sheen is part of the standard for BCM but not required. I like it I select for it.
http://www.maransofamericaclub.com/black-copper-marans.html

Hen : Black with red hackle markings but without the typical Birchen breast lacing. Very slight red breast marking is acceptable. Green sheen is not required.

Yes, I still have lots of culling to do. My hens are a little black and the hackles in my rooster are lighter than preferred.

Either way, you appear to just want to argue. I already said we agree to disagree. You think my birds are meh, and that's OK. I'm not trying to sell them to you.

"On the other hand, green reflections in the black plumage are not required previously in the Marans Black-red. The absence of bright reflections (also known as "green beetle") is a quality that is considered to be correlative to the presence of a gray down instead of black, red-orange rather than black or brown or eyes tarsi pinkish-white ie a relatively mild amount of melanin in the skin and throughout the body to promote the maintenance of quality standard."

Hey, by looking into this I learned something new! That selecting for the green sheen can actually help get rid of the light down on one of my birds.

If I was randomly mating I wouldn't care about the standard. Just because you aren't satisfied with how many birds I've raised or culled or what I select for has no bearing in my outcome. I do my best and forget the rest.

I'm here to learn something new everyday. And to chat with people who have the same interest as me. Not to have my individual words picked apart and twisted into what I didn't say.

It's too bad when a thread becomes an argument and pushes others away. Not really what BYC is all about.

Now days all I breed for is myself and I love it. I can spend all day evaluating my breeding stock, getting excited about what I hatched that week, future breeding plans and projects, learning genetics, etc etc.
Imo you have it figured out. At the end of the day I'm guessing you're getting the same joy out of it as I do.

Exactly! Just yesterday I was excited and thinking/planning/watching the flock and completely lost track of time. Then I realized I must really be enjoying what I'm doing.

Thank you and @3riverschick for you support and encouragement!

 

[3riverschick]

Right on eggsighted4life !
My pullets started laying last week
Egg size nothing to crow about (medium) but the color is really nice . I was so excited. I'd rather see the right color than the size. Size can always be improved .
hey did you know that if you add Alltech All-G-Rich to your birds feed that they will lay eggs that have three times as much DHA ( Omega 3 ) as a regular egg? global.alltech.com nuts,my phone is not showing the whole URL , sorry.
pretty cool huh? All-G-Rich is a specialized strain of microalgae that Alltech has developed for this purpose.
Best ,
Karen

 

[gojira]

Guess it turn out you don't know it all after all. But thanks for your input anyways. The green sheen is part of the standard for BCM but not required. I like it I select for it.
http://www.maransofamericaclub.com/black-copper-marans.html

Hen : Black with red hackle markings but without the typical Birchen breast lacing. Very slight red breast marking is acceptable. Green sheen is not required.

Yes, I still have lots of culling to do. My hens are a little black and the hackles in my rooster are lighter than preferred.

Either way, you appear to just want to argue. I already said we agree to disagree. You think my birds are meh, and that's OK. I'm not trying to sell them to you.

"On the other hand, green reflections in the black plumage are not required previously in the Marans Black-red. The absence of bright reflections (also known as "green beetle") is a quality that is considered to be correlative to the presence of a gray down instead of black, red-orange rather than black or brown or eyes tarsi pinkish-white ie a relatively mild amount of melanin in the skin and throughout the body to promote the maintenance of quality standard."

Hey, by looking into this I learned something new! That selecting for the green sheen can actually help get rid of the light down on one of my birds.

If I was randomly mating I wouldn't care about the standard. Just because you aren't satisfied with how many birds I've raised or culled or what I select for has no bearing in my outcome. I do my best and forget the rest.

I'm here to learn something new everyday. And to chat with people who have the same interest as me. Not to have my individual words picked apart and twisted into what I didn't say.

It's too bad when a thread becomes an argument and pushes others away. Not really what BYC is all about.


Exactly! Just yesterday I was excited and thinking/planning/watching the flock and completely lost track of time. Then I realized I must really be enjoying what I'm doing.

Thank you and @3riverschick for you support and encouragement!

So you follow the French Standard, not the American? Why is that?

You said your birds are meh. You said you want only good birds. I thonk the poster wanted excellent birds, as the poster appears to be a junior interested in exhibition.

You say you want average birds, then say you go by the standard, which now you say is the French Standard. I go by the American standard, as that is what is used when I exhibit birds. You are the one that claimed to cull hard. I was just calling you on it. Say what you mean, and mean what you say. So many people, particularly on here, talk about culling hard, seemingly trying to impress others, when they really don't. From what YOU say, if you culled hard, you would have no birds.