why its not a good idea to allow people to vist new born puppies

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I have intimate experience with Parvo virus. One litter I lost all the puppies. The other I had all survivors, they were very lucky.

It is extremely hard to socialize dead puppies. I now err on the side of caution. Maybe too far on the side of caution, but have had no issues in my last 2 litters. Here is what I do:

I DO allow visitors. ONLY people who have been approved for a puppy from the litter, or friends selected to come and help socialize the puppies. ONLY in clean clothes. NO shoes come inside the house, and the first thing is hand washing. For myself and other frequent visitors, either no shoes in the house, or shoes get sprayed with a bleach solution. If I go to the vet, I take bleach solution with me, and disinfect my shoes and my hands before I get back in my van, and strip my clothes immediately upon return home and wash them.

My puppies are vaccinated at 7, 10, 13 and 16 weeks of age with ProGard Modified Live high titer vaccines for Parvo and Distemper only. These vaccines have been specifically developed to over ride maternal antibodies and get serum immunity in breeds known to have issues with this such as Rottweilers and Labrador Retrievers.

My puppies do NOT go out socializing until 15 weeks. My puppies do not go on grass at any time until 15 weeks. I will CARRY them so they don't touch grass, and take them to visit in the homes of friends who do not have dogs. I do invite people into my home to socialize with the puppies, I start this at 4 weeks of age with a particular emphasis on children. I do start early imprinting and positive obedience training, I do this VERY early, 6-7 weeks of age, using the clicker and positive reinforcement only.

I have had no issues with puppies being reticent of having any appearance of a lack of social skills. I will not risk my puppies getting Parvo Virus, ever again. These protocols, while they may not be suitable for everyone, are currently working very well for me, and I plan to stick to it.
 
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I have intimate experience with Parvo virus. One litter I lost all the puppies. The other I had all survivors, they were very lucky.

It is extremely hard to socialize dead puppies. I now err on the side of caution. Maybe too far on the side of caution, but have had no issues in my last 2 litters. Here is what I do:

I DO allow visitors. ONLY people who have been approved for a puppy from the litter, or friends selected to come and help socialize the puppies. ONLY in clean clothes. NO shoes come inside the house, and the first thing is hand washing. For myself and other frequent visitors, either no shoes in the house, or shoes get sprayed with a bleach solution. If I go to the vet, I take bleach solution with me, and disinfect my shoes and my hands before I get back in my van, and strip my clothes immediately upon return home and wash them.

My puppies are vaccinated at 7, 10, 13 and 16 weeks of age with ProGard Modified Live high titer vaccines for Parvo and Distemper only. These vaccines have been specifically developed to over ride maternal antibodies and get serum immunity in breeds known to have issues with this such as Rottweilers and Labrador Retrievers.

My puppies do NOT go out socializing until 15 weeks. My puppies do not go on grass at any time until 15 weeks. I will CARRY them so they don't touch grass, and take them to visit in the homes of friends who do not have dogs. I do invite people into my home to socialize with the puppies, I start this at 4 weeks of age with a particular emphasis on children. I do start early imprinting and positive obedience training, I do this VERY early, 6-7 weeks of age, using the clicker and positive reinforcement only.

I have had no issues with puppies being reticent of having any appearance of a lack of social skills. I will not risk my puppies getting Parvo Virus, ever again. These protocols, while they may not be suitable for everyone, are currently working very well for me, and I plan to stick to it.

**stupid question alert***
so you say the puppies dont go on grass at any time till 15 weeks.. so when you are house breaking do you use paper or a special pen area?
 
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As do I. Lira, my avatar, got it at 14 weeks old. Stupid me took her to a TV interview filmed at a vet clinic at the worst time possible - her maternal antibodies were reducing and her natural ones hadnt been built up yet. It wasnt fun, but she lived and thrived and you would never know she was sick.
My last litter got not only parvo, but parvo type one, which ONLY strikes neonates, too young to vaccinate and there isnt a vacc for parvo type one anyway. That opened the door to parvo type two - the "normal" parvo to take hold as well. I was up for 7 days giving 7 pups fluids round the clock, sleeping in half an hour intervals. I did lose two, and the pathologist who did the necropsies said he was amazed I had any live. He had never seen puppies with both types survive before. I also spent almost $7000 saving them, and let the bank have my house back rather than give up on my puppies. The five that I saved are two years old now, and doing beautifully.

The silver lining to the nightmare is that survivors have lifelong immunity. If you are breeding, they also have superior natural immunity to pass on to their pups. I know this sounds harsh (and Redyre, this is NOT directed at you, but is a general statement) , but I think that if a dog or a line of dogs is so delicate that they have to be kept in a nearly sterile environment to survive, perhaps they shouldnt be bred. Reproducing dogs with weak immune systems doesnt improve the situation.
 
I vaccinate at 6, 9, 12, 15 an 19 weeks an tell people to talk to there vet but I dont take them anywhere till they are 20 weeks an hold them the whole time at the vet.
I do let people come an go in my house from day 1 though.

Mine are litter box trained at 4 to 5 weeks too so touching grass is not an issue but I usually give them access to a small grass lot (that only there pack has been on) at about 10 weeks an it takes a week or two to swap over off the litter box.

As for back to back breeding? Dogs are built for it an would if humans were not there to have an opinion. So no, assuming the dog is getting proper food an is staying healthy an there is nothing wrong with it. Its when people use cheep food or don't keep an eye on there dogs health that it becomes an issue. Breed probably has an effect on this too.
 
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I have intimate experience with Parvo virus. One litter I lost all the puppies. The other I had all survivors, they were very lucky.

It is extremely hard to socialize dead puppies. I now err on the side of caution. Maybe too far on the side of caution, but have had no issues in my last 2 litters. Here is what I do:

I DO allow visitors. ONLY people who have been approved for a puppy from the litter, or friends selected to come and help socialize the puppies. ONLY in clean clothes. NO shoes come inside the house, and the first thing is hand washing. For myself and other frequent visitors, either no shoes in the house, or shoes get sprayed with a bleach solution. If I go to the vet, I take bleach solution with me, and disinfect my shoes and my hands before I get back in my van, and strip my clothes immediately upon return home and wash them.

My puppies are vaccinated at 7, 10, 13 and 16 weeks of age with ProGard Modified Live high titer vaccines for Parvo and Distemper only. These vaccines have been specifically developed to over ride maternal antibodies and get serum immunity in breeds known to have issues with this such as Rottweilers and Labrador Retrievers.

My puppies do NOT go out socializing until 15 weeks. My puppies do not go on grass at any time until 15 weeks. I will CARRY them so they don't touch grass, and take them to visit in the homes of friends who do not have dogs. I do invite people into my home to socialize with the puppies, I start this at 4 weeks of age with a particular emphasis on children. I do start early imprinting and positive obedience training, I do this VERY early, 6-7 weeks of age, using the clicker and positive reinforcement only.

I have had no issues with puppies being reticent of having any appearance of a lack of social skills. I will not risk my puppies getting Parvo Virus, ever again. These protocols, while they may not be suitable for everyone, are currently working very well for me, and I plan to stick to it.

This is basically how I do it, although they don't go to anyone's house with me. This is the way you have to do things to do it right and I love breeders like you.

Here's what I read once and used to put in my pup packets.

If you were to walk through a park and come into contact with droppings from a dog with parvo, you could walk 350 miles and still carry the disease.



I lost my first litter of Rotties 25 years ago to Parvo. Before that one of the biggest worries was Destemper. Parvo was as rampant and most people had never even heard of it. Rotties tend to be extra suspetible, so I was oh so careful.

One thing I did that I had never done before was I waited until the litter was 7 1/2 weeks and instead of giving shots like I did to any other breed I ever bred, I took them to the vet. That wouldn't have been too bad, but instead of having him come to my car, he insisted on me bringing them in. Rotties weren't very common then and he had never seen one in person and was taken with the fact that they all had a call name and all came when called and that I knew who was who. Anyway, we got shots, went home, went back to the normal routine. The first pup left at 9 weeks. Two days later I had pups down. The buyer of the one that left called and their pup was down. Back then the chance of saving them was almost zero, but I didn't sleep much as I took care of them. They had to have food and water every hour. Nine pups, you get done wash with bleach and start again. A week later and costly meds and I had lost them all. I had never and have never again, had something this horrible happen. It was a terrible lesson.

I went back to vaccines being given at home. I start at 5 weeks and they are given at 3 week intervale insteed of 4. I also do wormings starting about the same time. I met a judge from Germany years ago, who's family had raise Rotties for decades. I went with her health and feeding plans and never would think twice about changing them now. I never had another pup or dog sick.

That being said, I had someone who had been pre approved for a home, come to pick up his pup. At the time, there were no PC to use for contracts, so it was type written and 6 pages long. He refused to sign and said he didn't want my contract. I gave a pup to my brother and he had signed a contract, no one walks out with a pup without one. He became beligerant and walked out. Three days later my pups started to drop like flies. Same symptoms as Parvo. I was devistated. It wasn't Parvo. He came back and dropped meat in the back and unlike the older dogs who knew not to touch it, they did. He laced it with Decon. I lost the rest of that litter. Ended up he was a big time attorney in San Francisco and the police wouldn't touch him. I even went to his house and confronted him. He said prove it and laughed.

After that the contracts had to be signed and they had 3 days to cancel before picking up the puppy.

I never let people touch my pups. I would set a table up at sliding glass doors, put them up one at a time and ask what they were looking for. I temperment test also and I never placed, say a drivey pup with a family with kids. You have to know the entire litter to know who should and who should't have a pup. I also required at least the equivelant for a CD if they wanted AKC papers, which most would want. I used the ADRK registry and those are the shows we used.

These pups were ALWAYS socialized. Having 6 kids helped with that.

Amyone going to the puppy area changed into rubber shoes which would go straight into a bleach and water mix. When they go into the area I have a mat that is saturated with either bleach or a product for kennels which kills the Parvo virus.

Watching my babies broke my heart. I never want to go through that again. No one from the outside touches my pups unless they are taking it home with them.

There is another reason for people to not want you to go to their homes. A couple of years, out here we had someone in Southern Cal selling Yorkies. Someone showed up and attacked the owners and stole the pups. Happens more than you would think. If a pup can be stolen it will be. People are just rotten.
 
Quote:
I have intimate experience with Parvo virus. One litter I lost all the puppies. The other I had all survivors, they were very lucky.

It is extremely hard to socialize dead puppies. I now err on the side of caution. Maybe too far on the side of caution, but have had no issues in my last 2 litters. Here is what I do:

I DO allow visitors. ONLY people who have been approved for a puppy from the litter, or friends selected to come and help socialize the puppies. ONLY in clean clothes. NO shoes come inside the house, and the first thing is hand washing. For myself and other frequent visitors, either no shoes in the house, or shoes get sprayed with a bleach solution. If I go to the vet, I take bleach solution with me, and disinfect my shoes and my hands before I get back in my van, and strip my clothes immediately upon return home and wash them.

My puppies are vaccinated at 7, 10, 13 and 16 weeks of age with ProGard Modified Live high titer vaccines for Parvo and Distemper only. These vaccines have been specifically developed to over ride maternal antibodies and get serum immunity in breeds known to have issues with this such as Rottweilers and Labrador Retrievers.

My puppies do NOT go out socializing until 15 weeks. My puppies do not go on grass at any time until 15 weeks. I will CARRY them so they don't touch grass, and take them to visit in the homes of friends who do not have dogs. I do invite people into my home to socialize with the puppies, I start this at 4 weeks of age with a particular emphasis on children. I do start early imprinting and positive obedience training, I do this VERY early, 6-7 weeks of age, using the clicker and positive reinforcement only.

I have had no issues with puppies being reticent of having any appearance of a lack of social skills. I will not risk my puppies getting Parvo Virus, ever again. These protocols, while they may not be suitable for everyone, are currently working very well for me, and I plan to stick to it.

**stupid question alert***
so you say the puppies dont go on grass at any time till 15 weeks.. so when you are house breaking do you use paper or a special pen area?

They go out to my patio area, which is fenced. It is concrete/pavers and easily disinfected.
 
I am a HUGE believer in not over-vaccinating. Puppy shots are the only ones my pups get, except for rabies. If it was legal to get a rabies titer, I would do that instead.
Parvo is a sneaky thing. And a horrible way to die

The problem with the dogs getting exposed and then building up a natural immunity is that you have to get them through the illness first. Not to mention the number of dogs that could get infected before the pup starts showing any symptoms.

Mine get puppy shots at 7 wks, 10, and 13. Exposure is still limited to known areas after that.

As for the vets office, mine is super diligent about cleaning the floors. Plus, any dog that has an appt for ANY kind of sickness uses the back door directly into the exam rooms. They bleach and disinfect several times a day. And IMMEDIATELY if a dog comes in that is ill. I mean, it's like taking your toddler into the ER and letting them lick the floor
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Socializing a pup is actually pretty easy while waiting for vaccines. You have friends. You have family. Just pop the pup into the car and take them on a drive - don't even have to get out of the car.
I've never met a breeder who didn't let the pups on grass, though any dog with a stable temperament will figure it out quickly
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I'd be more worried about what happens once the dog gets home. (Can you tell I'm going to be a wreck when I finally do start breeding??) I spent 3 years shopping for my last dog. Interviewing breeders, researching lines, then waiting for my chosen breeder to have a dog that would be a good match for me. You should have seen the confused expressions when people at work heard I was signing a contract to buy a dog! lol And one of them is a breeder
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My boy isn't on Limited Reg, and that is included in the contract. He can't be bred until he passes the minimum health tests and proves his working abilities. If all of that comes through, then all the breedings will be approved by my breeder (after all, he has way more experience in that than I do!) Discounts are given for working titles by the breeder as well. Anything to encourage people to get out and do SOMETHING with their dogs.
 
I have had personal experiences with parvo. I have to start off by saying I know you meant well by e-mailing the woman, but no matter how much you try to help other dog breeders, unless they know you personally they take offense to that. I have read stuff online SOOOOOOO many times and wanted to correct people so bad. But people believe what they want to believe. OK so personally I let people in my house when my pups are young. My females are up to date on vaccines and worming. I make people remove their shoes at the door and wash their hands before they handle my pups. I think that it's important for me to meet with prospective owners, and be able to ask questions and see how they interact with my dogs, before I commit to a contract with them. After they meet mom and dad and the puppies, they put a deposit on the puppy of their choice. I've never had a problem with this method. And it gives me the opportunity to educate people about my dogs. But I can see why you would be worried, parvo is very deadly and extremely contagious.
 
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**stupid question alert***
so you say the puppies dont go on grass at any time till 15 weeks.. so when you are house breaking do you use paper or a special pen area?

They go out to my patio area, which is fenced. It is concrete/pavers and easily disinfected.

Same here. I use newspapers in the whelping area and then when they start traveling we travel straight out to one spot outdoors. The newspapers are removed and I spend a couple of days giving them the idea, like every 20 minutes, out the door and to the spot. And yes I stay awake for at least 2 days in a row, so they get the idea. I don't use anything for them outside, just the spot they are allowed to use. And I do start early. An 8 week old pup can be completely housebroken in 2 days. I know because I do it all the time.
 
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Both of my boys have been completely housebroken when they came home. It only took a couple of days for them to learn where the doors were.
 

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