wild quail

[zajh6fd]

Good luck, with your controlling statements, I am sure they are serving some purpose but it is a lost to me.

Thanks to all that have answered positively, in private. I agree that commercial breeders have caused a change the type of birds available. Obviously, commercial breeding has resulted in heavier, slower birds more dependent and less able to defend themselves in the natural world. Gene manipulation works! Commercial breeder have obtained the goal of a larger more docile bird suited to be more profitable when brought to the table or sold to preserves. My point is --- that this is "commercial" breeding --- a for profit endeavor.

Most all birds in the wild now have some degree commercial bred genetics in them, simply because game farms sell them as flight ready release birds. In fact most all quail and pheasants grown on commercial farms are raised and sold for release into the wild for hunting purposes. Few are sold as table fare.

I have to say, that the ones who do survive must have inherited some survival instinct that is valuable. Maybe different and more survivable. In any case, today's habitat is some what different than the one I grew up in. The "natural world" is changing and will continue to do so.

Some bird farms are attempting to breed a more survivable bird. I think that is a positive endeavor.

That is my purpose in this thread.

 

[Ntsees]

As a licensed gamebird breeder myself, I agree with those who are explaining about the need for a license. They are disclosing valuable and helpful information so that you won't be surprised if you are keeping birds. No one wants to be in a position when a game warden is asking to see your breeders license and you don't have one. I also agree with your above post. Commercial breeding has led to man-selected birds that produces more eggs than normal within the year as well as losing brooding and wild instincts. I do not raise bobwhite quail and I have no idea what they are like, but if they are in any way similar to my valleys and mountains, I would say having the wild behavior is part genetics and part learning from the mother bird (i.e. mother bird teaches the chicks to fear people) based on my experience.

As an fyi, mountain quail have once been abundant in eastern Washington but now there are none or few of them only. The local wildlife agencies have trapped and relocated mountain quail into suitable habitat in eastern Washington to help re-establish the population. In contrast to most bobwhites, please note that these relocated mountain quail were wild-caught and untainted with man-selected traits. Those quail have all of their wildness and breeding instincts intact but their success to repopulate eastern Washington was less-than satisfactory. Therefore, I wish you much luck (I mean it in a good way) to be able to produce survivable and reproducing quail in the wild (upon which licensed individuals and clubs may purchase your stock for release/re-introduction).

As for you deciding on the bobwhite, if you manage to acquire from someone who has birds that are wild and can successfully brood and raise the chicks to adults (which I'm guessing it's a hit or miss since you can't see those inherent traits), I recommend that you not cross them with less satisfactory birds. I understand that you would like to increase the wildness/survival in the birds, but it is just my opinion that crossing it with a less quality bird may be able to produce a more wilder bird, but that bird will also have those not-so-good traits. For example purposes, it's like if you somehow got the "wild" bobwhite, why cross them with let's say jumbo bobwhites? I wouldn't. I'd keep those wild bobwhites to themselves so their valuable genes don't get mixed up with some man-selected jumbo bobwhite (and that is assuming you raise those wild birds naturally otherwise they'll just become like the rest).

 

[chrishw]

I have some of the same ideas as you, and am currently licensed BUT probably NOT licensed enough.... I'm near a large at research university and sure i could get some partnership *if* I can even find enough wild breeding population to work with.

That said, besides the dream, I am stuck locating some non-domesticated eggs or breeding population yet. I am going to do this legally, and I believe there is enough public support and money available to fund a project. I know there are several projects going to establish habitats here in VA, we just don't have any wild quail in this perticular area to repopulate.

My major concern, IF I FIND THE BIRDS/EGGS, really is the hawk (falcon/eagle) population, dang DDT ban, thats really the major or only change in several of the old habitats that I used to hunt. It might not be the hawks, but that's what research is for....


LETS NOT PISS ON ANYONES PARADE, RATHER GIVE ADVICE HOW WE CAN DO THIS! Sorry about the yelling but I really miss those dang birds. I could even find coveys 15 years ago, and there is more habitat now than then.

Good luck figuring out a way to do this!

I am looking for some wild Bobwhite quail. I have not had very good success with the incubator hatched and pen raised Bobwhite that I have raised and released. I have raised in isolation from most human interaction -- also I am using larger and taller flight pens --- am using more seeds etc that are available in wild --- all of these have helped but I am now looking to add some wild caught quail genetics to the flock . in the hope to further improve a the "wild side"
Any suggestions would be welcome.

 

[James the Bald]

Any suggestions would be welcome.

REALLY??? You had several members here with plenty of experience make their suggestions, and then you get combative with each one? Really??? If you think you know more than Don or Fat Daddy, then why did you stop by and solicit suggestions if you weren't going to listen to them? I am fascinated on your statement that the permit "is easy to obtain".... I read the WRD NBW Translocation Application, and I'm thinking you missed the part where it explains that a Wildlife Biologist must oversee the capture and release of Bobwhites... yet here you are soliciting birds to "improve a the "wild side"". Hmmm?

Anyway, now that I've just earned myself another infraction, here's a suggestion. Just me (and you are more than welcome to disregard my suggestion since you've done it so well thus far), but what I would do is to contact the Georgia Department of Natural Resources, and see if they have a listing of Bobwhite donors in the state (or maybe in your area). Or you can post a request at your local Co-Op in your neck of the woods.

According to the translocation application on GA DNR's website, "pen released quail are prohibited" (which would include any bird that you currently have in your posession or / or are soliciting here), so you would need to have quail captured nearby to release.

James

Edited to add: I really don't know how I put up with myself.

 

[chrishw]

Perhaps I'm nutz here but I think we've got a few rocket scientists talking to a molecular biologist, all smart folk, but just different backgrounds and those differences have caused confusion and frustration.

Zajh6fd, you may be able to do what you want but it will require you scrapping all captive genetics and starting over. It also will require both extensive licensing and permissions. Some permits anyone can get for $25, but others take years and PhD's to approve them.

To release our current captive genes for hunting is OK because between hunters, and "untrained" birds most will be eaten or starved before they reproduce. If a female lives, she won't "go broody" and sit on eggs. The very rare male that survives will produce offspring not suited for wild life and Darwinism (hawks et. Al.) will take care of the rest.

Additionally, almost any intentional release for purposes other than hunting is illegal, and once a person learns all the bad crap (diseases, competing with wild stock...) They will begin to see it is immoral also. Its hard to explain just how immoral it is without making you read a few dozen research papers, but as you can see many of us are passionate about it.

It may be possible but must involve partnerships with state biologists, and cost a bunch. Its sort of like collecting wild eggs, its not illegal for people with special licence here in Va, but you got to pay lots of money and jump through lots of hoops.

I would much rather have a positive discussion so hopefully all those lurkers PM'ing you are not afraid to join in and hopefully both learn and contribute. I think it can be done, its just going to take a lot more work than you where thinking it was.

 

[zajh6fd]

"Passionate about it"

I believe that! But you have no answers to "no wild bird" situation

 

[Invision]

It seems to me that zajh6fd is trolling, I would suggest not replying to this post anymore.

 

[Fat Daddy]

It seems to me that zajh6fd is trolling, I would suggest not replying to this post anymore.

YES! AND WE HAVE A WINNER! Step up Sir, you may pick any prize from the middle shelf!