22% PROTEIN LAYER FEED

Discussion in 'Feeding & Watering Your Flock' started by cdbutler70, Dec 2, 2019.

  1. cdbutler70

    cdbutler70 Chirping

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    HELLO EVERYONE;

    I HAVE EIGHT 17 WEEK OLD PULLETS THAT ARE GETTING REALLY CLOSE TO START LAYING SO I CHANGED THEM OVER TODAY TO 22% PROTEIN LAYER PELLETS. DO YOU GUYS THINK THAT IS TO MUCH PROTEIN FOR THEM? I WAS THINKING IT WOULD BE OK SINCE THEY STILL HAVE SOME GROWING TO DO PLUS THEIR BODIES GETTING READY TO LAY IT WOULD BE FINE.

    PLUS I HAVE 3 20 WEEK OLD PULLETS; BUT ONE OF THOSE IS LAYING NOW SO THEY WILL BE FED THE SAME FEED.

    LET ME KNOW WHAT YOUR THOUGHTS ARE ON THIS PLEASE.

    SORRY FOR THE ALL CAPS BUT I LIKE TO TYPE THIS WAY BETTER.
     
  2. EggSighted4Life

    EggSighted4Life Free Ranging

    Hi there, hope you are enjoying BYC! :frow

    22% protein was shown to give the highest hatch rate for chickens. Beyond that decreased rates were experienced. 22% is about the maximum ever needed in a chickens life, even "starter". But most "layer" feeds are around 4% calcium. It may be good choice if you are going to be hatching. I know it has been said feeding "layer" too soon could diminish growth and even delay onset of lay... but I'm not sure if that was due to (usually) reducing protein or if it was because the calcium inhibits something else??

    I have had some not start until 28+ weeks. What breeds are you raising? How many hours of day light ya got? Are you using artificial lighting?

    Are they going to lay earlier than your 20 week olds or are they still a few weeks or more out, realistically?

    So what I gather is that 1/11 of your pullets is laying and 10 are not.

    I would suggest going with a grower or flock raiser (18-20% protein and 1% calcium) and offering oyster shell free choice on the side for the active layers. Others will sample ... but excess calcium fed long term to non layer *can* (doesn't mean will) cause kidney issues including on type of gout and even possible kidney failure and sudden death.

    While it's true that feathers are made from 90% protein and it amino acids. Too much is really a waste of $ as protein is quite pricey compared to other ingredients. Not all protein is created equal. Chickens require some amino acids derived from animal sources. These are added synthetically into our vegetarian rations many of us are using. Now the other flip side... excess protein fed long term to anyone *can* cause another type of gout, possible kidney issues including sudden death... Excess protein will not be utilized but processed through the liver and kidney and excreted as extra smelly waste. Both of the previous condition mentioned are most likely if a bird is somehow genetically predisposed AND also happen to get dehydrated or other contributing factor. Excess protein in breeder diets also appears to decrease hatch-ability causing early embryo mortality.

    I like to use the Purina flock raiser with 20% protein because it is readily available to me and serves my whole flock well with OS on the side free choice. I use this from hatch, to lay, to molt, to processing, to do it all for my dual purpose birds and others. Aside from the protein and 1% calcium it has more amino acids than most typical 16% protein layer feeds... I do not have a 22% layer available in my area.

    What I'm trying to say is... 22% protein may not be too much but 4% calcium would be... for MY comfort level and the investment I've made in my flock. I don't think it will truly harm your birds. I would rather see folks feeding 22% over the 16% if they are switching a little earlier to "layer". 15% is considered the minimum to maintain a chicken in good condition... I personally never aim for minimums, but strive for excellence to achieve a happy medium. :)

    I don't personally mind the all caps. Made it easy to read. :cool:
     
    Sequel, Shezadandy and penny1960 like this.
  3. Fairview01

    Fairview01 Songster

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    It depends on the breed. Some breeds will never reach their full potential and will be stunted on 22% plant sourced protein. I raise heritage large fowl cornish. They receive an average of 35% protein after the first 2 weeks. Most large fowl can handle more protein than the wannabe experts who believe that the commercial formulations are the bible as to the max protein that should ever be fed. The commercially available feeds have bern been developed by poultry nutritional experts for the commercial poultry industry. These formulations provide the best returns for the least cost. Thats why they are what they are.

    Protein is expensive and feeding higher levels of protein requires that a significant amount of the protein be animal sourced to overcome to overcome limiting essential amino acids such as methionine and lysine and limiting growth factors such as choline which prevents fatty liver disease and perosis in young chicks.
     
    Rooster G likes this.
  4. rosemarythyme

    rosemarythyme Free Ranging

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    Just FYI you might like typing like that but you might be getting fewer responses because of it... I skip posts that are too hard to read, I have to imagine there's others do too.
     
    ColtHandorf and aart like this.
  5. EggSighted4Life

    EggSighted4Life Free Ranging

    I know you didn't point any fingers... but I am NOT a wanna be anything and nor do I believe that commercial formulations are the bible. I have done a ton of research (including personal experience which I know can vary) and if 35% protein was a good choice for chickens it would be offered for those who want to spend more $. :confused:

    A few links...
    https://www.researchgate.net/public...he_Embryo_and_Time_of_Death_During_Incubation

    https://en.engormix.com/poultry-industry/articles/effects-nutrition-during-laying-t43074.htm

    https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/8ab7/566b083bbc1dc376621f509bd39d3afc1616.pdf

    http://www.scielo.br/scielo.php?script=sci_arttext&pid=S1516-635X2017000200231

    https://www.poultryworld.net/Breeders/General/2012/3/The-golden-secrets-of-male-fertility-WP010083W/

    @ChickenCanoe, I was hoping to share these links with you to review since nutrition is something we see questioned daily and many are feeding game bird or high protein rations... which I DID in the past. :caf
     
  6. DellaMyDarling

    DellaMyDarling Songster

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    I have a large mixed flock, chickens and ducks, all ages and sizes, including males.
    After much hunting, I have settled on Nutrena NatureWise 20% protein All Flock feed.
    It seems to make the happiest medium for all the birds with the least effort for me (such as separating various ages, breeds, etc, which I don't care to do at all.)
    Any less protein and my chickens were getting viscious with feather plucking their friends or eating eggs. This began after being penned up and no longer free ranging for extra proteins naturally.
    The All Flock is low calcium (I'd have to look for the number) so safe for males. Oyster shell is a la carte.
     
  7. Fairview01

    Fairview01 Songster

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    Maybe it was an oversight on my part but are any of those links you provided applicable to the noncommercial private poultry industry that is not necessarily raised for profit. The links are informative but not applicable imo.

    The commercial poultry industry is about minimum investment and profit margin. Im sure feeding a higher animal sourced protein content would improve commercial poultry industry production but it would also destroy their ROI. That's why feed formulations are are sourced from plant proteins with minimum synthetically created essential amino acids added during production. Minimum material costs that produce the best ROI. Thats what its all about.
     
  8. Cindy in PA

    Cindy in PA Crowing

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    The poultry feed at TSC etc. is made for the backyard flock, they are not just making feed for the commercial flock. You will be fine feeding your pullets the 22% layer feed.
     

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