Chick Pics for New 2 and Our Chart

[AugeredIn]

But, but, but, there is no Black Shoulder anything in that pen! Unless the IB Pied WE cock is split Cameo?

Would that make him a BS also? Is it even possible to be a IB Pied WE Split Cameo split BS? The only hen in there that could even remotely be split BS also came from where those two mystery cocks came from and appears to be a IB Pied.

Are you saying that I need a SP cock to produce SP chicks? I knew that this pen would produce some interesting chicks, I just didn't expect that it would be so hard to figure out WHAT they are. The only thing I was sure of was that they should all be double factor WE except for the ones that come from the IB Pied hen.
And we are not even up to the head scratcher that I alluded to in my first post.

They are definitely blackshoulder. What else they may or may not have is hard to tell right now. There is some white mixed in so I would suspect pied as Othman suggests. They are also light so they could be cameo but it is real early. White eye will also lighten them.

Cameo hens cannot produce any cameo chicks unless the cock is cameo or split cameo. Cameo hens can only produce split cameo cocks by themselves.

I believe that both parents must carry SP to have a chance to get SP chicks. That is my opinion based on what I have learned and personally seen.

 

[AugeredIn]

Did you mean 'without' ? I thought that you could produce female Cameo chicks from a Cameo hen but it would take a Cameo or split Cameo cock to produce a Cameo cock?

ETA; Then what would I expect to get from my Cameo SP and Cameo WE hen in that pen if he isn't split cameo?

Yes, I meant without and I corrected it. Those cameo hens will just make the cocks they produce split cameo. The hen chicks from those birds will just be purple due to your purple cock. They will not have any cameo.

Sex linked birds only carry the color mutation on the male sex chromosome. Males need two mutated genes and the hens only need one to express. So a male cameo is Zc/Zc and a female cameo is Zc/W. If you breed a purple cock Zp/Zp to a cameo hen Zc/W this is what happens:

Zc W
Zp Zc/Zp Zp/W
Zp Zc/Zp Zp/W

Zc/Zp is an IB split cameo and split purple cock. Zp/W is a purple hen.

Z/Zc would be an IB bird that is split cameo. Hens cannot be split to any sex linked color since they only have one Z chromosome.

 

[KsKingBee]

OK, just to check, should I call those cuties "Pied" on the chart?

Would loud pied be a more accurate or helpful description?

I think Loud Pied would be correct (?) I know that both parents carry WE so they should be double factor WE, but of course that is not something that can be seen at this point.

 

[KsKingBee]

Many of my silver birds have that dark streak, but I think it's not necessarily a sign of silver pied, you mean like this right?


If you are referring to the yellow chicks in image #5 they look cameo black shoulder to me, the one in the front look pied, the one in the back I can't tell. I had cameo bs silver pied male peachick that are between 8 to 10 weeks now, he looked white at hatch with three or four tan feathers color on his wings, after about 6 weeks he start to show some color in his neck, with black should pattern you will get really confused.

Yes, exactly like that! Ok, so it is not a qualifier for being SP. I guess according to @AugeredIn I can quit looking for SP in any of my chicks as I don't have a breeding age SP cock yet. darnit!

Of the Black Shoulder chicks; I have suspected in the past that my IB Pied WE was split to Cameo but we have not determined that to be certain yet. I am SO confused at this point. Let me ask again this question about him; Can he be IB Pied WE AND split Cameo AND Black Shoulder?

 

[Peafowlssssssss]

Yes, exactly like that! Ok, so it is not a qualifier for being SP. I guess according to @AugeredIn I can quit looking for SP in any of my chicks as I don't have a breeding age SP cock yet. darnit!

Of the Black Shoulder chicks; I have suspected in the past that my IB Pied WE was split to Cameo but we have not determined that to be certain yet. I am SO confused at this point. Let me ask again this question about him; Can he be IB Pied WE AND split Cameo AND Black Shoulder?

Yes, he can, i have almost the same patterns in a peacock but its split peach.

 

[KsKingBee]

Yes, he can, i have almost the same patterns in a peacock but its split peach.

I feel like I hit the lottery and don't know what to do with it. Would you call it IB Pied WE split Cameo BS? (If we determine it is split Cameo, we KNOW it is split BS)

 

[Peafowlssssssss]

I feel like I hit the lottery and don't know what to do with it. Would you call it IB Pied WE split Cameo BS? (If we determine it is split Cameo, we KNOW it is split BS)

Yes, split cameo and black shoulder, he has some great genes, its always great to have bird like this so he will always surprised you with the offspring.

I have a splading bronze peacock split white, white eye and black shoulder, last year he almost hatched everything: bronze, bronze w/e, bronze black shoulder, white(bronze), silver pied bronze, spalding hens split pied(from spalding pied hen), spalding split white, white spalding, spalding pieds. and all the spalding were split bronze for sure, and some of the bronze chicks were split black shoulder and split white.

 

[AugeredIn]

Yes, exactly like that! Ok, so it is not a qualifier for being SP. I guess according to @AugeredIn I can quit looking for SP in any of my chicks as I don't have a breeding age SP cock yet. darnit!

Of the Black Shoulder chicks; I have suspected in the past that my IB Pied WE was split to Cameo but we have not determined that to be certain yet. I am SO confused at this point. Let me ask again this question about him; Can he be IB Pied WE AND split Cameo AND Black Shoulder?

Yep, The cock has to be SP or split SP. You will know a SP chick when you see one. They have very little color at all.

He is technically IB Pied WE split Cameo split BS. IB/IB:Znc/Zc:W/P:Nbs/BS:WE/WE. Nomenclature is my own.

 

[KsKingBee]

Yep, The cock has to be SP or split SP. You will know a SP chick when you see one. They have very little color at all.

He is technically IB Pied WE split Cameo split BS. IB/IB:Znc/Zc:W/P:Nbs/BS:WE/WE. Nomenclature is my own.

Wow, I knew I had a diverse gene pool from the guy I bought out last year but not like this. I really appreciate the help identifying not only the chiks but the breeder cocks, thank you both!

So for the record, Pied Piper is an IB Pied WE split Cameo, split BS. I checked the older chicks that are four and five weeks old and I definitely have Cameo offspring from this year.

The one I call Elvis is an IB BS split Cameo, he has thrown with Cameo hens Cameo BS and Cameo hens and one cock.

Now for the third pen, and I don't have many chicks from Rocky, an IB BS WE cock with IBWE hens. I am hesitant to say what color they are after blowing the Silver Pieds earlier in this thread.

These are yesterdays hatch, a BS and an IBWE?






Here are two that hatched on 6 - 17







Now the same two birds just four days later.

 

[Peafowlssssssss]

Wow, I knew I had a diverse gene pool from the guy I bought out last year but not like this. I really appreciate the help identifying not only the chiks but the breeder cocks, thank you both!

So for the record, Pied Piper is an IB Pied WE split Cameo, split BS. I checked the older chicks that are four and five weeks old and I definitely have Cameo offspring from this year.

The one I call Elvis is an IB BS split Cameo, he has thrown with Cameo hens Cameo BS and Cameo hens and one cock.

Now for the third pen, and I don't have many chicks from Rocky, an IB BS WE cock with IBWE hens. I am hesitant to say what color they are after blowing the Silver Pieds earlier in this thread.

These are yesterdays hatch, a BS and an IBWE?






Here are two that hatched on 6 - 17







Now the same two birds just four days later.

The first chick is white next to india blue, and the second group the one on the left has a big chance to be silver pied, even the other one it **COULD** be black shoulder silver pied but i'm not sure.

Don't loose the hope yet, are any bird from this pen is split white?