Chickens tongue keeps almost going down her throat

[Wyorp Rock]

Poor girl

I know you had another thread or 2 (?) about her over time, let's do a run down of treatment(s) you have tried and/or are now currently doing so we can see if there's anything missed.

Her facial swelling has been ongoing for years, right?

No lice/mites? Have you ever treated with Ivermectin regardless?

You're currently giving (or now finished) with Amoxicillin. What other antibiotics have you used?

Every used Metronidazole?

No yellow/white pasty material inside the beak or bad odor.

Crop is emptying.

She's eating the same food as always - no changes in food or environment that would have exacerbated her issue.

Currently applying an anti-fungal/yeast medication to her face and in her ears (miconazole). How long have you applied the cream? Is she more "itchy" since you've been using it? BUT you've seen improvement with the cream(?)

The vet gave you drops for the ears? What is that I can't seem to find the name of the product.

All I can think of right now, but I feel like I forgot something...

 

[OwO]

Poor girl

I know you had another thread or 2 (?) about her over time, let's do a run down of treatment(s) you have tried and/or are now currently doing so we can see if there's anything missed.

Her facial swelling has been ongoing for years, right?

No lice/mites? Have you ever treated with Ivermectin regardless?

You're currently giving (or now finished) with Amoxicillin. What other antibiotics have you used?

Every used Metronidazole?

No yellow/white pasty material inside the beak or bad odor.

Crop is emptying.

She's eating the same food as always - no changes in food or environment that would have exacerbated her issue.

Currently applying an anti-fungal/yeast medication to her face and in her ears (miconazole). How long have you applied the cream? Is she more "itchy" since you've been using it? BUT you've seen improvement with the cream(?)

The vet gave you drops for the ears? What is that I can't seem to find the name of the product.

All I can think of right now, but I feel like I forgot something...

Thanks for this, I am guessing you were able to see the videos I linked to?

She has had facial swelling for years, especially on the eyelids, and I've thought she has shown MG symptoms for a couple years too

I looked for permethrin online but it seems to be difficult to get in the UK unless I just completely missed it, is it okay to do ivermectin while she's on all this other stuff? I was going to use it but I didn't want her to be completely overloaded with medication when I haven't seen much sign of mites

She has only had Amoxicillin which is now finished, yes

I have used clotrimazole in the athletes foot cream prior to this current one with miconazole. I do realise she seems to be trying to itch her face more often now that I've started using miconazole, though I feel like it's made her skin better than the clotrimazole did. I will stop using it for a couple days and see if it helps - never used metronidazole

The only differences with food is: I took her off 100% layer pellets in favour of layer/grower pellets 50/50 as she isn't laying and I've heard they can get kidney problems with excess calcium, also I am giving her flubenvet wormer layer pellets right now, and I soak all her pellets in water while she is ill or she won't eat it (and I can mix small amounts of treats in with it to encourage her to eat)

The eardrops are Isathal eyedrops. The vet says they are fine for ears, but I can't find a lot of info online about them being used as such.

Thanks a lot once again for all of this She is really going through it at the moment

edit: One thing I just remembered: the times before that she's been like this (albeit not as bad) I have given her aspirin (I think 75mg a day), but this time the vet prescribed her metacam so I've been using that instead. Could this make much difference?

 

[OwO]

Post to You Tube and paste the link her. It will then embed. It's the only way everyone here can access a video.

Have you been treating this hen with daily vitamin E 400iu? It must be given with a sliver of selenium or a bit of egg for absorption.

Will post to Youtube tomorrow morning when I get on my laptop again. Thanks for the info on selenium, I am giving rooster booster already which should cover Vitamin E. Not getting many eggs currently as the others are moulting, but apparently online bread is high in selenium? I could give her small amounts as I don't like giving them bread, but could that help with absorption?

edit: the one on my rooster booster is vitamin E (E3a700), is this still okay?

 

[azygous]

I recommend a higher dose than 400iu for wry neck, actually. 1000iu or 670mg. for therapeutic purposes. I tried to look up how much vitamin E Rooster Booster contains, but it won't say. I use people vitamins when I need to give my chickens vitamin therapy for a disorder.

Your hen looks to be suffering from one of the many versions of wry neck and it almost always improved within a day or two of a hefty dose of vitamin E.

 

[OwO]

I recommend a higher dose than 400iu for wry neck, actually. 1000iu or 670mg. for therapeutic purposes. I tried to look up how much vitamin E Rooster Booster contains, but it won't say. I use people vitamins when I need to give my chickens vitamin therapy for a disorder.

Your hen looks to be suffering from one of the many versions of wry neck and it almost always improved within a day or two of a hefty dose of vitamin E.

Thank you so much for the info, I will definitely get her on more vitamin E. I still have a feeling that it could be ear related because she had the same symptoms before while she had visible ear infections, but it won't hurt to give her extra vitamin E to cover all bases right, even if its 1000iu? Once you notice they're back to normal do you take them off vitamin E or keep them on for a bit?

Here is the video btw, in case the link still didnt work for you:

 

[azygous]

My heart goes out to this hen. She sure is trying hard. But she's a beautiful girl. When I am treating a chicken with the E, I just do it for one or two days longer after they appear to return to normal.

Even if this imbalance originated with an ear infection, E can treat residual neurological issues. High doses won't hurt short term. Then I would use the Rooster Booster for another few weeks after that.

 

[OwO]

My heart goes out to this hen. She sure is trying hard. But she's a beautiful girl. When I am treating a chicken with the E, I just do it for one or two days longer after they appear to return to normal.

Even if this imbalance originated with an ear infection, E can treat residual neurological issues. High doses won't hurt short term. Then I would use the Rooster Booster for another few weeks after that.

She is such a good girl, I feel so bad for her but I am glad she is still eating a lot even if it takes her a long time. She seems so alert and alive but just so wobbly and itchy She is getting old now too which makes me feel even worse for her, I think she is around 8 now

Thank you so much, if I get the 1000iu one how many tablets do I give per day? If I can only get 400iu do I just give double the amount? And do I need to give a lot of selenium?

 

[azygous]

One capsule at the higher dose per day. Two per day at the lower dose. Selenium needs only be a sliver of a tablet. Or a little egg as it has all the selenium she would need.

I did notice she has the worn countenance of an oldie-but-goodie. Hopefully, the E will give her balance back to her. I'm rooting for the old girl.

 

[OwO]

One capsule at the higher dose per day. Two per day at the lower dose. Selenium needs only be a sliver of a tablet. Or a little egg as it has all the selenium she would need.

I did notice she has the worn countenance of an oldie-but-goodie. Hopefully, the E will give her balance back to her. I'm rooting for the old girl.

Thank you, hoping I can get everything tomorrow and I'll keep you updated

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Ideally, getting some cultures ran would be best to see if the problem is bacterial, fungal, protozoal, etc.

Looking back at some of the photos you have posted in the past threads she's had that crusty/scabby skin going on for a good while, not just on her face, but on her body too (right?).
This is most puzzling, I think @azygous may want to go to your profile page and look at the images as well and give her thoughts on those images. I have to wonder if she may just benefit from bathing in a dandruff shampoo but may be going in the wrong direction.

Ear Canker still really comes to mind. My understanding is that Ear Canker can be bacterial, fungal or protozoal - so we are back to figuring that out - so this is where the culture would really help so we don't continue in circles.

I would "assume" the Amoxicillin would have treated bacterial ear infection, but that's also dependent on if the bacteria are responsive to Amoxicillin. You've also been applying Clotrimazole which has helped, so there's likely a fungal component or it may just be that the cream is soothing and healing the skin (coincidental?). That leaves protozoal.(?) Big questions and I don't have the answers, I'm surely no vet.

I understand if having more testing is not possible, we all have to be mindful of our budgets and of course some vets are better than others.
If the testing isn't possible, then you can try the Ivermectin and/or Metronidazole to see if either of those make a difference. Sort of trial and error or throw everything you have at the problem and see what happens.