CSU's Welsummer SOP

[Eissens]

Yes, that is the way to do the job!

 

[EweSheep]

our problem is finding a good quality bird to improve the flock - there just aren't that many around. I was interested - Dr Netland, did I read that some of the original stock brought to the USA had issue with comb and eye?

Am I understanding the history of the breed in the US correctly - there were only 3 original flocks in the US and everything has basically been bred from those three flocks?

Basically yes, if they are pure, non hatchery stock. We have NO pure Dutch. Somewhere down the line, the quality and consistency has been lost. Most of them got Barber lines.

The other stock, Cratty and Fugate, they are well known for their Marans, had raised Welsummers briefly but they sold their flock. Heresay, I've heard Barber birds have been bought out by hatcheries at the earliest time when they started to sell them.

 

[Dr Bjorn Netland]

Basically yes, if they are pure, non hatchery stock. We have NO pure Dutch. Somewhere down the line, the quality and consistency has been lost. Most of them got Barber lines.

The other stock, Cratty and Fugate, they are well known for their Marans, had raised Welsummers briefly but they sold their flock. Heresay, I've heard Barber birds have been bought out by hatcheries at the earliest time when they started to sell them.

I believe that the exact origin(s) of the Wellies here in the US is(are) difficult to determine. One breeder in Oregon (does not want to be identified) who supplied the two cockerels to Lowell and me also had imported eggs from the UK, and his birds were a much better show quality group than Lowell's and mine were. Furthermore, their egg color was as good as, or better than, the ones we had. When I talk about exhibition quality, I am referring to the APA standard, and not the Dutch or German standards.
There were also a couple of breeders in the Midwest who had Welsummers presumably unrelated to the birds that Lowell and I had, but I cannot remember these persons' names and do not know where these birds originated. I do recall, though, that they had overly large combs (cocks with "overgrown" combs down the beak, for instance) according to a couple of pictures I once saw. What their egg color was, I don't know. Other breeders in the Midwest got birds from Lowell and me, and they may have blended these with birds from those other breeders; I just don't know.
Getting new imports from The Netherlands may solve some of the problems we currently have, but there may be some unintended consequences as well. While we require pretty much the same coloring of the cock's breast (as opposed to the Germans), we want the hens with "a distinct lighter shaft" -- which is at variance with the Dutch standard though it is similar to the German, I think. Personally, I would hate to see us lose the deep, "terra-cotta colored" egg that many of our Welsummers we now have can produce (which is what I have always selected for). The Dutch exhibition strains lay a fairly light brown egg with dark brown speckles (or blotches), but their utility strains can also lay that dark, brown egg (I think...).
Mr. Eissens will have more specifics on those issues, I am sure.
A result of a "cleanup" of the Wellies in North America (at least for exhibition purposes) would probably inevitably lead to a APA standard revision for the breed. Perhaps that is a good thing? Yet, if it results in the development of two totally separate strains--one show strain and one utility strains--I think it would be regrettable. In this context, what comes to mind is what happened to the SC LF White Leghorns, many of whose breeders developed absolutely stunning exhibition birds with pullets that would lay 80-90 eggs in their first (and best) laying year. To me, that is a Leghorn that is not really a Leghorn...
These are questions beg answers, especially when it comes to the many breeders who go on the show circuit. I no longer show (or, extremely rarely, at least) as I have problems with my arthritis and bad back and have found that all the ignorance and politicking demonstrated by some (a few, but notable ones) judges makes it a worthless effort, especially with new breeds such as Welsummers, Barnevelders, and Marans. I will continue to breed birds on a limited scale, although many of my birds fall short in significant areas, yet I am hoping to improve what I have just so as to satisfy myself.
I do miss seeing input from Bryce in this discussion. He managed to produce some nice looking show birds a while back (but I don't know how he selected for egg color) with good color, comb, and leg color (though I like them with a higher tail set). Out of the ones I have seen (including pictures), Bryce's birds are the tops of what we have--in MY opinion, that is, and in MY interpretation of the APA's SOP.
I have to go out and irrigate my thirsty yard now, so I wish you all a happy, productive day. And remember, a little bit of tolerance and willingness to embrace our diversity may go a long way in keeping the peace.

 

[LisaBeth]

Here are pictures of my other two girls...please critique ruthlessly

So...we discussed the first young pullets comb...what is the verdict on these two girls....about a month older than the first but still quite young...combs? and...is the eye color more correct? Also, it seems that all of my girls have the little feather "fingerlings" by the comb and...what about wattles...?

 

[faykokoWV]

I really like the head shape on that second pullet - wattles are to be even and close together - so you've got that covered on those two. Still too young to see how big the comb and wattles will get - i don't like the "finger combs" either, but it seems to be prevalent in the US.

this is closer to the desired eye color, and shows the even narrowly spaced wattles

 

[LisaBeth]

oh WOW...I can see my girl's eye color definitely has more of a green/yellow tint - thank you for the picture for comparison!

 

[Eissens]

Quote:
The height of the combs is okay. The Welsummer hens are known for their small combs. But there is a little twisting in the comb of the first hen. And the serrations of both hens are a little bit thin. The serrations has to be even, wide at the base and end in a point(like a sawtooth) The first hen has the best wattles. Nice round and free of creases. I hope the eyecolour is better in real life, because on this pictures they are too light (I miss the reddish colour in the iris) The shape of the head and beak is fine for both.

 

[LisaBeth]

The eye color on my girls is definitely not what it should be...I don't know if it will change as they mature - could that happen? I will be looking at that...I have some new little ones from a breeder where the eye color seems to be much more correct so, if I would choose to see what these hens would throw, perhaps bred to the right cockeral with the correct eye color there might be some that would attain the proper color. Although, I don't know that I will do any breeding with these young pullets - we will see how the rest of the critique goes. At this time, these girls are just lovely Wellie girls for my layer house

 

[Eissens]

Quote:
That is not a problem, it is normal. When you show your birds than you cut this feathers a little bit. In the Netherlands it is allowed to do this, we call it conditioning.

 

[EweSheep]

That is not a problem, it is normal.When you show your birds than you cut this feathers a little bit.In the Netherlands it is allowed to do this, we call it conditioning.

LOL! Treat those Andy Rooney's brows with a comb and scissors LOLOL!