Denagard Dosage

[casportpony]

So is one tablespoon per gallon the treatment or prevention dose?

I think it's this:

8 ml per gallon = treatment
4 ml per gallon = prevention

-Kathy

 

[casportpony]

8 ml = a little more than 1/2 tablespoon
4 ml = a little more than 1/4 tablespoon

-Kathy

 

[sonshine15]

8 ml = a little more than 1/2 tablespoon
4 ml = a little more than 1/4 tablespoon

-Kathy

Thank you Kathy. As always you're a lifesaver! Math and I do not get along!
I have 5 separate watering areas with 4 coops/runs. This stuff has been a nightmare to get rid of. What does NOT make sense is you can eat off the coop floors etc. The wild birds we are having a real issue with. And they are nesting high above in the shop. By now they should all be dosed from the chicken watering stations! It comes in today and will get them going on it.

Oh and the Bielefelder roo and BO are walking again! Heads up on using colloidal silver for some bad issues. His leg at his joints down to his foot were swollen and hot. She got it first, same thing. Couldn't walk. She's laying regularly again and he's not limping as of yesterday.
I ran into a guy here (made a quick trip family and personal stuff, hubby is dosing) in NM at TS. We talked about chickens here. I asked him if he knew how much myco has infected flocks. Yep! He is very familiar with it. I guess it's just everywhere and will remain so.

Are people just breeding and selling with myco these days? I was totally thrown off. Someone on BYC said if you don't ever have sick chickens..........just wait........well, year 4 in CO and after many in TX, sick flock with crazy junk over the past long winter months.

 

[sonshine15]

After using those nasty antibiotics, am wondering if chickens do ok with stevia or xylatol. They're not safe for dogs etc. Seems giving them that much sugar, molasses etc is sure going to cause candida/bad bacteria. In between Probios dosing....

 

[Sydney Acres]

Additional dosages for Denegard that I have found include:

Adult Poultry: 30 mg/kg by mouth once daily for 7 days
Poultry Chicks: 60 mg/kg by mouth once daily for 7 days
Poultry and pigeons: 225 - 250 mg/liter of drinking water for 3-7 days
Game birds: 300 - 400 mg/kg of feed for 7 days
Poultry Eggs, used as a dip: 1,000 mg/Liter of dip water (there are published techniques for getting medications into eggs via dips -- I think it involves having the water cold and the eggs room temperature, but it's been a long time since I read that and may be remembering it wrong).

Source: Exotic Animal Formulary, 3rd edition, by Carpenter

Casportpony, I have apparently misplaced my more recent edition of Carpenter. Do you have one? If so, is there additional information available from it?

I think that some of the confusion as to whether to use 8 ml/gallon or 16 ml/gallon for treatment stems from a dosage that I didn't include in the above information, which is "Most species, 25-50 mg/kg once daily." What that says is that there is really a wide dosage range that can be given. When using medication in water, there is also the question of how much the bird is actually drinking. If it's hot in the summer the bird is probably drinking much more water, and thus taking in more medication, so it can be more dilute. If it's cool and the bird isn't drinking much, or the bird is sick so not drinking much, the medication needs to be more concentrated in the water to get the same amount of medicine.

So as a real life example, I have a sick turkey that is approximately 10 pounds, or around 4.5 kg. I have the 12.5% Denagard. If I want her to have the low end of the dosage range (25 mg/kg), and I use 8 ml/gallon concentration (a hint over 1 & 1/2 teaspoons/gal), she needs to drink almost 2 cups of water per day, which I don't think she does. If I want her to have the high end of the dosage range (50 mg/kg) and use the 8ml/gallon concentration, she will need to drink almost 4 cups of water per day, which I know she doesn't do. On the other hand, if I use the 16 ml/gal concentration (essentially 1 tablespoon plus a smidge over), she only has to drink 1 cup a day to get the minimum dose, or 2 cups a day to get the maximum dose. The problem, unfortunately, is that she doesn't feel well, and the last thing I want to do is make her water taste bad so that she stops drinking and gets dehydrated. So my plan is to start with 8 ml/gal and see if she will continue to drink. If she does, then the next day go to 12 ml/gal, and the next day go to 16 ml/gal. If it seems like shes drinking really well, then I can also decrease the concentration a bit.

Using medication in water will never give you a 100% accurate dosage, because you have no control of how much an individual animal drinks. That's why the only medications that can be used in water are the ones that have a wide dosage range.

 

[Sydney Acres]

Another thing to consider is that, while all syringes that measure in mls (or ccs) are the same, teaspoons and tablespoons that are made for cooking tend to be more variable in their accuracy, and are not recommended to use for measuring medication. You will get your most accurate measurement if you go to your local pharmacy or local veterinarian and ask for a syringe (without a needle) to measure out the medication. Most feed stores will also have syringes for sale. Ideally, get a 6 ml, or a 10-12 ml size, but nothing larger than a 20 ml. Given the wide dosage range, it is unlikely that using a cooking teaspoon/tablespoon would be problematic, as this is not a medication that has to be dosed perfectly, but using a syringe for measurement will provide better accuracy, and eliminate the need to convert from ml to teaspoons/tablespoons for people that are not comfortable with math.

 

[rlhagan56]

I think it's this:

8 ml per gallon = treatment
4 ml per gallon = prevention

-Kathy

I researched on here and the dosages given the most especially by DAWG53 is 8cc/ml or app.1 1/2 teaspoons per gallon for 3-5 days for prevention and 16cc/ml or 1 tablespoon per gallon for 3-5 days for a treatment dose. It's very easy to buy syringes and use them to convert dosages, and also much more precise, Sydney Acres post is accurate. this is how I learned years ago to give vaccines and oral meds. I personally would never use Xylitol (or however it is spelled) for my poultry since it is found to be toxic when given to dogs or horses. I had the idea to use sugarfree mints for training until I found this out, just a thought.

 

[casportpony]

 
I think it's this:

8 ml per gallon = treatment
4 ml per gallon = prevention

-Kathy

I researched on here and the dosages given the most especially by DAWG53 is 8cc/ml or app.1 1/2 teaspoons per gallon for 3-5 days for prevention and 16cc/ml or 1 tablespoon per gallon for 3-5 days for a treatment dose.  It's very easy to buy syringes and use them to convert dosages, and also much more precise, Sydney Acres post is accurate.  this is how I learned years ago to give vaccines and oral meds.  I personally would never use Xylitol (or however it is spelled) for my poultry since it is found to be toxic when given to dogs or horses.  I had the idea to use sugarfree mints for training until I found this out, just a thought.

Did you not see the dose recommendation from the mfg?
http://www.thepoultrysite.com/focus/contents/novartis/novartis_poultry1.pdf

Just because a bunch of people say the dose is 16 ml, doesn't mean it is. Ask those that say it 16 ml where they got that info, and I bet they'll just say "it's what everyone says".

-Kathy

 

[casportpony]

More on Denagard


The 0.025% amount = 946.25 mg, which is 7.57 ml. So fine, increase the amount if they aren't getting their 11.36 mg per pound from drinking the water.

-Kathy

 

[casportpony]

Anyone interested in knowing how much 1 to 2 week old peachicks drink?

-Kathy