Egg weight loss questions...

[pillageTHENburn]

I have what feels like a bit of a problem. I have two emu eggs that are on day 26 of incubation. Their temperature has been 97.0 (with minor fluctuations when turning the eggs etc.). I have been trying to slow their weight loss since day one! Based on a 48 day incubation they should be losing around 1.77 and 1.73 grams respectively each day... however they have been losing between 2g and 3g every day! I have been adding tape (avoiding the ends) since day 3 and I've kept the humidity between 38-45% (I know, 45% is "too high", but I'm trying to stop weight loss!). They are covered with tape (still avoiding the ends), today is the first day their weight loss was actually below the original daily goal.

I know they need to "breathe" but I don't want to suffocate them with tape! Do they get their oxygen from the air sack only? If that's the case then the tape shouldn't hurt O2 levels (as long as I avoid the air sac end)... Somewhere I read you can tape them "up to 10%"... mine are currently closer to 60+% covered.

Now that I've slowed weight loss is it dangerous to keep weight loss low for a while until their weight is within the target 14%-17% window? Right now one is on the cusp of 20% loss and the other is underweight by 4g!!

Is it dangerous to increase humidity (like to 60%) to help slow water loss without as much tape?

They started at:
577.0g and 566.0g
They are currently (day 26):
514.6g and 497.9g

Please help!!!
-Logan

 

[ChickenCanoe]

They get oxygen through the entirety of the shell. I wouldn't use tape.

Have you read this on emus? The incubation information is toward the bottom.
https://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/poulsci/tech_manuals/emu.html

 

[pillageTHENburn]

They get oxygen through the entirety of the shell. I wouldn't use tape.

Have you read this on emus? The incubation information is toward the bottom.
https://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/poulsci/tech_manuals/emu.html

Thank you. Yes, I have read that... many, many times. Plus countless others. None answer my questions though.

My eggs are underweight and if they continue on this track by day 48 they will have lost more than 20% weight since setting.

The article you cite says "...relative humidity in the 24 to 35 percent range..." however at 35% humidity my eggs were losing 4 grams per day (target is 1.7g). So then what do you do to slow weight loss if you're at the "max" humidity? That article does not cover that problem. Other articles and other people's personal experience suggests to cover some of the shell with tape or wax or paint.

They are losing too much weight which suggests that the gas exchange through the shell is happening too fast. Logically the only way to slow that process is to either increase humidity or reduce the surface area of pores through which the gas exchange happens (or both). I have already increased humidity, it's been around 45% for the last two+ weeks. I have also covered pores with tape.

Should I continue to increase humidity? I'm already well above any "suggested" humidity level that I've seen. I understand that a risk of high humidity is drowning the chick because not enough water can leave the shell, however I don't appear to have that problem. So it seems like a much higher humidity is the safest way to proceed (covering more of the egg doesn't seem safe).
Thoughts?

 

[ChickenCanoe]

I wouldn't consider myself the go to expert but if it were me, I'd increase humidity.
You're right, you don't have the problem of not enough water transpiring through shell.
I don't even check humidity. I incubate solely by weight loss. But that is just me.

One other thing you could try is to use liquid bandage to coat some of the egg. I use that with cracked eggs. I once had an egg that I dropped and it had cracks on about 60% of the egg with over a week to go and it still hatched. I don't know what would be the difference between that and tape.

 

[pillageTHENburn]

I wouldn't consider myself the go to expert but if it were me, I'd increase humidity.
You're right, you don't have the problem of not enough water transpiring through shell.
I don't even check humidity. I incubate solely by weight loss. But that is just me.

You're certainly more of an expert than I!!

When you say you incubate by weight loss and that you don't check humidity what do you mean? What do you do if an egg is over or under weight?

 

[ChickenCanoe]

If the eggs, on average, are too heavy I empty out the water reservoirs and briefly open the incubator once in a while for a few days till the eggs are in an acceptable range. If they are too light, I increase humidity by filling more water reservoirs or even put a bubbler in the reservoir or a mister in the incubator.

I now only hatch one breed/variety of chickens so they mostly lose weight in unison but occasionally there is one that has lost more than the others. I just consider that an outlier and usually from a hairline crack. If I can't find a flaw, I may put it in its own space in the incubator for a while with enhanced humidity but that is only possible if the incubator is large enough.

 

[pillageTHENburn]

Thank you for the input ChickenCanoe!
As you can see from these charts I started drastic measures around day 26 and it appears to be helping. I decided to ignore the 20-30% humidity rule and I have it cranked up to 70%+. I figure they are not in danger of drowning/bloating if they are still losing more water than they should! I live in Nevada (high desert) so it's much drier here than other places (plus this has been an extremely dry winter for us). I'm not entirely certain what effect that has on the eggs and humidity in a controlled incubator, but it's a hunch.
I'm a little worried that they'll still be under-weight at hatch but I'm doing my best.

It's interesting to note that on the first day they lost 6 and 7 grams respectively Since then they have averaged just over 2g (which is still above the goal of 1.7g) but their loss has been generally consistent since then. If I ignore the data sample from day 1 then their Actual Loss (blue line) comes much closer to the normal range. (Ignoring day 1, both eggs are still a little bit low but MB is within the 17% range and GG is close to 18.5%)

I've been removing tape and increasing humidity in an attempt to give them enough O2 and still keep them from dehydrating. Yesterday I could have sworn I saw GG move when I set it on the table and whistled to it... one daughter corroborates that but my wife and other daughter didn't see it. It could have been hopeful eyes seeing things that weren't there. Time will tell.

EDIT: It should be noted that I have weighed them every single day. I know that's overkill but I'm possibly a little paranoid and I figured more data points gives me more time to correct/adjust without making abrupt changes.

 

[casportpony]

Following.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Thank you for the input ChickenCanoe!
As you can see from these charts I started drastic measures around day 26 and it appears to be helping. I decided to ignore the 20-30% humidity rule and I have it cranked up to 70%+. I figure they are not in danger of drowning/bloating if they are still losing more water than they should! I live in Nevada (high desert) so it's much drier here than other places (plus this has been an extremely dry winter for us). I'm not entirely certain what effect that has on the eggs and humidity in a controlled incubator, but it's a hunch.
I'm a little worried that they'll still be under-weight at hatch but I'm doing my best.

View attachment 1270857

It's interesting to note that on the first day they lost 6 and 7 grams respectively Since then they have averaged just over 2g (which is still above the goal of 1.7g) but their loss has been generally consistent since then. If I ignore the data sample from day 1 then their Actual Loss (blue line) comes much closer to the normal range. (Ignoring day 1, both eggs are still a little bit low but MB is within the 17% range and GG is close to 18.5%)

I've been removing tape and increasing humidity in an attempt to give them enough O2 and still keep them from dehydrating. Yesterday I could have sworn I saw GG move when I set it on the table and whistled to it... one daughter corroborates that but my wife and other daughter didn't see it. It could have been hopeful eyes seeing things that weren't there. Time will tell.

EDIT: It should be noted that I have weighed them every single day. I know that's overkill but I'm possibly a little paranoid and I figured more data points gives me more time to correct/adjust without making abrupt changes.

Good job.
Ambient humidity does have an effect.
You say high desert, that can have an effect too. What is the elevation where you are?

 

[pillageTHENburn]

Good job.
Ambient humidity does have an effect.
You say high desert, that can have an effect too. What is the elevation where you are?

I live in Reno which is at the base of the Sierra Mountains (Lake Tahoe, Nevada). The elevation at my house is about 5,000'. The incubator is in a room with no draft and a constant temperature.