Failure to thrive in my new chicks. Please help.

[Eggcessive]

If your chickens have canker, then meteonidazole or ronidazole would be the best treatment. I would cull hens with canker, especially if I had chicks coming up who would get exposed in the waterers or feeders. Once canker is in a flock, it will continue to spread. If you cull a sick hen, a necropsy with histology by the state poultry vet would tell you what exactly the hen had. Since you had coryza several years ago, other hens could still test positive for that because most respiratory diseases make carriers of the whole flock eventually. Those diseases keep getting passed on. You have really had your hands full dealing with the multiple problems over the last few years. I admire you for trying to learn what was going on and getting some vet help to deal with the issues. But when the state vet does a necropsy, they will usually test for the usual respiratory diseases, which kind of gives you an idea what might be hiding in the flock. The lesions you are dealing with inside the beaks could be canker, wet fowl pox, or candida (fungus,) but the necropsy could be of help.

 

[azygous]

I don't see why you can't treat for yeast at the same time. Medistatin for pigeons is a non-prescription med that contains nystatin. That's what I suggest. https://www.jedds.com/shop/medistatin/

Are any of these hens showing signs of crop yeast?

 

[MixedFlock23]

Thank you all.
Here is a new thread I started today with more info:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...about-a-year-now-spreading-to-others.1414195/

I have had a lot to deal with in the last 4.5 years of having chickens. It all started with that auction hen too. I'll never buy from an auction again. Lesson learned.

Necropsy is cost prohibitive in my state ($75 per bird plus $50 in overnight cold pack shipping), or driving 5 hours, so that's out. I'm up for examining a sample under a microscope myself though. I will try to google what I should be looking for later today.

There is no smell at all to these hens' lesions. I'm really thinking it must be candida/thrush (this was my original thought many months ago, but it didn't go away with apple cider vinegar, garlic, or a run of fluconazole in January. It's getting worse with metronidazole (now on day 13 of those meds).

The hens are definitely thinner, but their crops aren't sour and there isn't any vomiting or diarrhea that I've seen. Just weight loss, mouth lesions, and trouble breathing because of them.

I will see if I can get Nystatin. If it doesn't completely go away on Nystatin, then I will cull them.

Here is a comparison photo (before metronidazole and today after 13 days of it):

 

[azygous]

Have you tried miconazole vaginal yeast cream directly into the mouths of these affected hens? The stuff is easy to get over the counter here in the USA. It's something I would definitely try.

ACV and garlic are preventatives not treatments.

 

[MixedFlock23]

Thank you! I put some Clotrimazole cream at the edges and a bit in their mouths about 2 hours ago. I had found that it helped in another forum online. I will add miconazole cream to my shopping list and pick that up tonight or tomorrow. Perhaps I will give both of them, alternating between them. Should I stop the garlic and ACV then? I called my vet, but they do not have any nystatin in stock. I don't want to wait another 3-4 days on shipping if I order online. Poor Rapunzel can hardly breath. I need to cure her or cull her by this weekend. The other two are not doing as poorly and could probably wait.
My current plan was to give garlic, ACV, vitamin water, and antifungal cream for three days, then drop the garlic/ACV and give yogurt and probiotics with the antifungal cream continuing for a week or 10 days or so. Just seems like an okay plan, I have no real reason for this though. I'm trying to save these girls if they do just have a yeast overgrowth (and not an ongoing nasty parasite). I still plan on getting out our microscope and seeing if we can see any flagellated protozoa. (hope not!)

 

[azygous]

Your approach to treatment under uncertain diagnosis is very similar to mine - throw stuff at it and see if anything sticks. I can't find any fault in any of your decisions. In fact, I like to see bold attempts like you're doing.

Also, preparing yourself to euthanize if there's no improvement is right in line with my own protocols. Relying on intuition is valid as far as I'm concerned. We have a connection to our chickens, and we "know" when they aren't going to get better.

I have one in a crate in my garage at present that's been failing in a general way for weeks, and this freak Rocky Mountain snow and freeze following just hours after weeks of high 90s heat is very hard on chickens, but the ones that have issues, it can put them over the edge.

 

[MixedFlock23]

Azygous, thank you. The three hens are doing better, I think! I've made them each eat a third of a clove of garlic three times today, along with a squirt of ACV honey water, and then a pea sized amount of anti-fungal cream. The patches were definitely not growing, and I think they could have even been less! I pulled off more with the hemostat tool again and I'm hoping for the best. Tomorrow I will go get groceries and the vaginal cream. I hope no one sees me shopping and thinks it's for me. ha ha.

It's still in the upper 80s here. Wow! Snow! That does sound tough on people as well as critters.
I hope your chicken pulls through! Thank you for the encouragement.
We hatched two of these three from eggs and we would hate to cull them, but also hate to see them do poorly. I sit out there with them and try to decide if their quality of life is good or not. Yesterday I said no and decided to have my husband cull them this weekend... but today they seem so much better (since I stopped the antibiotic/anti-protozoan med and changed my treatment plan). Rapunzel didn't gasp for breath at all today that I saw. Hurray!

 

[MixedFlock23]

Hen update:
I removed the lesions multiple days in a row and they kept regrowing overnight.
I took a sample from two hens and viewed each under our microscope (all three magnifications) and found nothing that moved on its own (no flagellated protozoa), but I did see bubbles (in the tissue, not only in the spit), so I do believe it was a yeast.
(The results from the lab/vet in January said the same. Inconclusive, but they believed it was a type of yeast.)
I don't know why it didn't respond to antifungals, but it did get worse on antibiotics/anti protozoan meds. Their breathing was audible this morning and I know we made the right decision...
With heavy hearts, we culled these hens today. We cuddled them and thanked them one last time and then put them down.

Chick update:
They had steadily gained weight after their meds for cocci & respiratory issues... until Wednesday when I saw a decline in the rate of weight gain/weight loss across the board. I then remembered seeing posts about repeating the Corid two weeks after the initial treatment! Tuesday marked the 2 week mark since I did the 5 day run beginning on Aug 25th! I wish I would have remembered that before they lost weight for a day, but they all seemed to be gaining steadily again today except for my little Jersey Giant. I think I will give her a drop of undiluted Corid twice tomorrow and the next day since her weight has only increased by 60%, whereas all the other chicks' weights have increased 100-286% since Aug 19th. My current plan is 3 more days of Corid, then the preventative dose (0.5 t/gallon) for another 2 weeks. They will be outside full time by then. (I let them stay a bit outside now, but they sleep inside still since they aren't fully feathered yet and are under 6 weeks old.)

Does anyone know if I can give them Nutri-Drench drops in their mouths while on Corid? What about yogurt? I only gave them two days of vitamins/electrolytes/probiotics (Rooster Booster) in their water after the first Corid five day run followed by a 5 day run of antibiotics. The Nutri-Drench does have thiamine in it. Maybe I'll continue the last 3 days of the 5 day treatment dosage (2 t/gallon) without anything else except chick crumble and then when I switch to the preventative dosage for another week or two, I'll add in vitamin drops to those who are still sneezing or not gaining weight as much as the others and give them all plain greek yogurt. (Currently, two are sneezing when they eat and another is not gaining much weight comparatively.)

 

[MixedFlock23]

Tried doing my first fecal float test and saw some worm like things under the microscope in a fresh sample from my jersey giant chick who only weighs 100g at five weeks old. (Her sister Jersey Giant weighs more than twice that-same age-same hatch.)

I have Safeguard de-wormer paste and I'm heading to Tractor Supply for Pour On Ivermectin also. I'm not sure if I can use either of them on five week old chicks. Thoughts?

 

[MixedFlock23]

Here is what I saw. Bad pic with my phone, sorry!