International Black Copper Marans Thread - Breeding to the SOP

[Chooks man]

thanks.

the marans chikens are so cute with a nice character so breeding them is worth anyway.

I might introduce blue marans who lay dark eggs. the person who got them has very few of them so I will be on the list for 2-3 pullets.

that will be good for you if you can get a Blue copper marans .especially if they lay dark eggs .

good luck my friend

chooks man

 

[baunlee]

Thanks for your replies.
I don't want to show birds but I like having great looking birds. I want to improve the breed with the help of chooks and others.

Greenfire has chicks for $60. That's way more than what I'm willing to pay. I was hoping to get second hand green fire birds, or from someone with good lines that doesn't charge that much.

I don't mean any disrespect by my last comment.

Hi Richard, this thread quite frequently has people POP in to ask "where can i get xyz" and I would argue this is common of any breed thread. I have noticed that these requests tend to get ignored because of the frequency and the effort in response (by effort I mean listing all the potential breeders). But that is just a guess. And I'm also not justifying it because I've asked the same question before and have been frustrated.

Anyways, to answer your question, I have some questions to best assist you:
where are you located? are you looking for a breeder nearby to you? or are you willing to ship chicks? do you have an incubator to hatch eggs?

BCMs are not that rare in my opinion. As soon as a couple real photos of dark eggs popped up on the internet, it spread like wildfire so to speak. I'm exaggerating here but you catch my drift. The problem is a lot of people dont have hens that hatch a dark enough egg consistently and I'm still not sure what the consistency has to be for one to have confidence in one's hen laying abilities (chooksman cue you in here).

Basically a take away point for you: if it looks like a dog and smells like a dog, it might not still be a dog. You have to be careful because there are a lot of shady chicken people. And I hate to say that speaking against my own "group" but honestly, there are. The sunny hope in this is that we can turn the trend and be good chicken people. But in the mean time getting there, be careful. Getting the shaft from a few breeders like I have recently can really mess with you emotionally and psychologically when it comes to your hobby. Due to my recent misfortune with chicken people I have personally felt less connected to what was once a very happy hobby for me. I blame those people, but to be true, I must also blame myself for letting myself fall into dealing with these "businesses". I have taken a step back at a time where I thought I would be doing a lot. However, chicken businesses are taking advantage of customers and this makes me very unhappy and upset.

Sidenote to others in the thread reading this, I have always been very active in this thread. I am an under 30 years old. A country girl, and former 4-H chick - that by the way, kept my hobby despite pursuing two degrees at an ivy institution. My chickens have always brought me joy and I have truly enjoyed speaking with you all here. This thread is great and the people who comprise it are class acts. Despite this, the negativity of poor transactions where I have spent A LOT of money has really gotten me down lately. I actually logged on today to regretfully say I will be stepping back from the chicken world for awhile. Still raising my birds, just doing so more low-key and not using breeders. Shoutout to those who have helped me get here in this reticent state: JLC from rarebreed auctions that sent me birds (I have yet to identify) that are NOT black birchens (I was partially refunded). Shoutout to heather gift of giftschicks (you can read my review on GoodEgg BadEgg facebook where she also has reports of sending birds with lice). Lastly, and most upsetting since I referred many people here, shoutout to Brinkhaven acres where I placed an order for over a hundred dollars hoping to get 4 Blue birchen marans and INSTEAD THEY SENT ONE. They have since changed the listing and are now trying to send me the other 3, (after I sent more money to pay for the other chicks to meet shipping minimums).

I dont know how people can treat others like this in good conscience. Hopefully I will cheer up soon and be back. In the meantime, be good to one another, and be good to those you do business with. xox

 

[chickengr]

Hi Richard, this thread quite frequently has people POP in to ask "where can i get xyz" and I would argue this is common of any breed thread. I have noticed that these requests tend to get ignored because of the frequency and the effort in response (by effort I mean listing all the potential breeders). But that is just a guess. And I'm also not justifying it because I've asked the same question before and have been frustrated.

Anyways, to answer your question, I have some questions to best assist you:
where are you located? are you looking for a breeder nearby to you? or are you willing to ship chicks? do you have an incubator to hatch eggs?

BCMs are not that rare in my opinion. As soon as a couple real photos of dark eggs popped up on the internet, it spread like wildfire so to speak. I'm exaggerating here but you catch my drift. The problem is a lot of people dont have hens that hatch a dark enough egg consistently and I'm still not sure what the consistency has to be for one to have confidence in one's hen laying abilities (chooksman cue you in here).

Basically a take away point for you: if it looks like a dog and smells like a dog, it might not still be a dog. You have to be careful because there are a lot of shady chicken people. And I hate to say that speaking against my own "group" but honestly, there are. The sunny hope in this is that we can turn the trend and be good chicken people. But in the mean time getting there, be careful. Getting the shaft from a few breeders like I have recently can really mess with you emotionally and psychologically when it comes to your hobby. Due to my recent misfortune with chicken people I have personally felt less connected to what was once a very happy hobby for me. I blame those people, but to be true, I must also blame myself for letting myself fall into dealing with these "businesses". I have taken a step back at a time where I thought I would be doing a lot. However, chicken businesses are taking advantage of customers and this makes me very unhappy and upset.

Sidenote to others in the thread reading this, I have always been very active in this thread. I am an under 30 years old. A country girl, and former 4-H chick - that by the way, kept my hobby despite pursuing two degrees at an ivy institution. My chickens have always brought me joy and I have truly enjoyed speaking with you all here. This thread is great and the people who comprise it are class acts. Despite this, the negativity of poor transactions where I have spent A LOT of money has really gotten me down lately. I actually logged on today to regretfully say I will be stepping back from the chicken world for awhile. Still raising my birds, just doing so more low-key and not using breeders. Shoutout to those who have helped me get here in this reticent state: JLC from rarebreed auctions that sent me birds (I have yet to identify) that are NOT black birchens (I was partially refunded). Shoutout to heather gift of giftschicks (you can read my review on GoodEgg BadEgg facebook where she also has reports of sending birds with lice). Lastly, and most upsetting since I referred many people here, shoutout to Brinkhaven acres where I placed an order for over a hundred dollars hoping to get 4 Blue birchen marans and INSTEAD THEY SENT ONE. They have since changed the listing and are now trying to send me the other 3, (after I sent more money to pay for the other chicks to meet shipping minimums).

I dont know how people can treat others like this in good conscience. Hopefully I will cheer up soon and be back. In the meantime, be good to one another, and be good to those you do business with. xox

sorry to hear your story but please don't give up.

 

[chickengr]

@Chooks man I have just seen photos of just hatched marans on the french forum. I can see that at hatch they have more yellow down. it was the very first time in my life I saw a just hatched marans chick when I got worried she had too much yellow. still learning.

sorry but I cannot take pics of my second batch. they have too much space to escape and the broody protects them well. it is week 2 and they still have small combs. I hope there is no late bloomer in there.

 

[kcrandall]

Hi Richard, this thread quite frequently has people POP in to ask "where can i get xyz" and I would argue this is common of any breed thread. I have noticed that these requests tend to get ignored because of the frequency and the effort in response (by effort I mean listing all the potential breeders). But that is just a guess. And I'm also not justifying it because I've asked the same question before and have been frustrated.

Anyways, to answer your question, I have some questions to best assist you:
where are you located? are you looking for a breeder nearby to you? or are you willing to ship chicks? do you have an incubator to hatch eggs?

BCMs are not that rare in my opinion. As soon as a couple real photos of dark eggs popped up on the internet, it spread like wildfire so to speak. I'm exaggerating here but you catch my drift. The problem is a lot of people dont have hens that hatch a dark enough egg consistently and I'm still not sure what the consistency has to be for one to have confidence in one's hen laying abilities (chooksman cue you in here).

Basically a take away point for you: if it looks like a dog and smells like a dog, it might not still be a dog. You have to be careful because there are a lot of shady chicken people. And I hate to say that speaking against my own "group" but honestly, there are. The sunny hope in this is that we can turn the trend and be good chicken people. But in the mean time getting there, be careful. Getting the shaft from a few breeders like I have recently can really mess with you emotionally and psychologically when it comes to your hobby. Due to my recent misfortune with chicken people I have personally felt less connected to what was once a very happy hobby for me. I blame those people, but to be true, I must also blame myself for letting myself fall into dealing with these "businesses". I have taken a step back at a time where I thought I would be doing a lot. However, chicken businesses are taking advantage of customers and this makes me very unhappy and upset.

Sidenote to others in the thread reading this, I have always been very active in this thread. I am an under 30 years old. A country girl, and former 4-H chick - that by the way, kept my hobby despite pursuing two degrees at an ivy institution. My chickens have always brought me joy and I have truly enjoyed speaking with you all here. This thread is great and the people who comprise it are class acts. Despite this, the negativity of poor transactions where I have spent A LOT of money has really gotten me down lately. I actually logged on today to regretfully say I will be stepping back from the chicken world for awhile. Still raising my birds, just doing so more low-key and not using breeders. Shoutout to those who have helped me get here in this reticent state: JLC from rarebreed auctions that sent me birds (I have yet to identify) that are NOT black birchens (I was partially refunded). Shoutout to heather gift of giftschicks (you can read my review on GoodEgg BadEgg facebook where she also has reports of sending birds with lice). Lastly, and most upsetting since I referred many people here, shoutout to Brinkhaven acres where I placed an order for over a hundred dollars hoping to get 4 Blue birchen marans and INSTEAD THEY SENT ONE. They have since changed the listing and are now trying to send me the other 3, (after I sent more money to pay for the other chicks to meet shipping minimums).

I dont know how people can treat others like this in good conscience. Hopefully I will cheer up soon and be back. In the meantime, be good to one another, and be good to those you do business with. xox

Baunlee,

Two years ago I was in the same spot you are now. Two years prior I discovered Marans on vacation / holiday in France, I became completely enamored with the breed so my journey began. Within a couple of months of returning home I found a Marans Breeder within a couple of hours of my home. The breeder had represented that her BCM Line was show quality. Being a former 4-H and FFA Member I knew not to expect show quality chicks (genetics just don't work that way) but I did expect birds that I could reasonably work with. So I purchased 15 BCM Chicks at $10 per chicks. They're just chickens right, how hard could it be! Well, while the chicks were technically BCMs, they had just about every fault and DQ that you could imagine plus they didn't even lay a #4. I was so disappointed. I discovered after the fact that this breeder had mixed several different lines of US BCMs merging the faults of each line into a single line. I also found out the breeder had never showed their birds so I could only conclude they were only trying to cash in on the BCM craze and did not have a clue about how to breed Marans.

At first I was mad at the breeder then I got mad at myself for not doing my homework. It took me a couple of months but eventually I decided to let go of my anger figuring that karma would catch up with the breeder. I cannot control unscrupulous breeders but I can control with whom I choose to do business. So, I put my disappointment / anger aside and got down to work, I spent a year or so learning all I could about Marans and researching Breeders in the US. I started with the Marans Club websites in the US, France and Australia and reading the various poultry forums and Marans Breeders websites.

I will say that when I first got on some of the Marans forums I was disheartened by the bickering amongst the various Marans Folks. I am very appreciative of RedBanks for starting this forum and all of the members who contribute their knowledge and experience -whether it be a seasoned Marans Breeder or someone new to the breed. IMO, this forum is truly a support group that provides a positive environment free from judgment.

But I digress, anyway, in doing my research I asked myself what it was that I wanted from my Marans. For me, in order, I wanted to focus on egg color, type, color and breeding to the French SOP (I want to honor the origin of the breed). My research eventually led me to Fitz Farms (Oklahoma). Dave Fitzgerald has been raising Marans for 15 plus years and his breeding practices mirrored what it was I wanted in my Marans. It didn't hurt that Dave's Marans are one of the top dark egg laying lines in the US and he has won several egg shows with his entries. Dave further disclosed the known faults within his line. So I purchased a dozen each of BCM and BLCM eggs (color ranged from #6-8) plus he gave me a half dozen eggs for good measure. I now have good Marans to work with, they are not without fault but the faults they do have can be corrected in future generations with a good breeding program. My hens lay #5-6 with an occasional #7. Dave helped me select my future breeders and suggested pairings to correct faults. This spring I hatched several chicks from my breeders. In one generation, I have improved upon type, combs and added copper hackles to my 2017 pullets. I'm liking their color so far but they still have growing to do and whether or not the pullets will lay darker eggs than their dams remains to be determined but I should have my answer in about 4 months (fingers crossed).

This is my long winded way of saying I understand your disappointment, frustration, etc. but please don't give up.

Take Care,
Keith

 

[Chooks man]

@Chooks man I have just seen photos of just hatched marans on the french forum. I can see that at hatch they have more yellow down. it was the very first time in my life I saw a just hatched marans chick when I got worried she had too much yellow. still learning.

sorry but I cannot take pics of my second batch. they have too much space to escape and the broody protects them well. it is week 2 and they still have small combs. I hope there is no late bloomer in there.

take it easy with a parasitic white .is going to confuse you .
the chicks hatch down is evaluated after are dry and fluff out .not when they just hatch still all wet .

I only can really comment on photos .easier to see no interpretation .

chooks man

 

[chickengr]

take it easy with a parasitic white .is going to confuse you .
the chicks hatch down is evaluated after are dry and fluff out .not when they just hatch still all wet .

I only can really comment on photos .easier to see no interpretation .

chooks man

I am already confused with parasitic white.

luckily none of my chicks looks like penguin. if my friends come to visit me today I will ask them to help me to take some pics.

 

[Chooks man]

I am already confused with parasitic white.

luckily none of my chicks looks like penguin. if my friends come to visit me today I will ask them to help me to take some pics.

that is good enough if they are not Penguin type .

chooks man

 

[Chooks man]

here some photos taken today of my chooks . they are all happy and healthy .
they did a lot growing almost adult looking now

5 month old BCM pullet .great type , Zambezi X Sue
copper only on the bottom end of the hackle.

Birchen pullet . Viking X Stockholm

Silver Cuckoo pullet and a white Ara cockerel

BC and a Black Tail Buff pullets

chooks man

 

[orrpeople]

Sorry that its kind of blurry. His comb has a tiny wrinkle in the front...

We are thinking about processing him (he's a little naughty), but wanted an opinion first. Thank you!