Issues breathing in almost 10 year old hen

[Eddie12109]

My Eddie is having a hard time breathing. To give background information: Eddie will be turning 10 in March. Around 3 years ago she had a heat stroke and ended up getting her head stuck between two cage bars. She has since recovered but has, what a vet is assuming, curled toes due to her getting her head stuck and losing some nerve connections and she is very sensitive to heat due to the stroke. The past 6 months breathing has become a real challenge for her. Especially during the summer she always needs a fan on her, as I live in Florida, since it is so hot. She has not been panting these last months but has instead been breathing rapidly and making rattling noises when she breathes. It does not seem to be the weather, she is always breathing very quickly. I have another hen with her and when I look at both, it seems Eddie takes two whole breathes when the other only takes one. She usually only gets very labored breathing when she over works herself and needs to be still for a few minutes. She will make odd noises during that time like she is gasping for breathe.

A few months ago she got Xrays done and the vet found scar tissue in Eddie's lungs. She might have called it fibromas, I can't remember but definitely scar tissue. I tried to pull up the xrays but it says it has expired, I will need to get the vet to send it again. Anyways her lungs are very cloudy and white in the xray. The vet thought it could be trauma from her heat stroke. So I put together that she is probably having trouble breathing due to her lungs having less room due to scar tissue build up.

Well she has been able to manage it but a few weeks ago she almost died from choking. It was very odd, I set her down in front of her food and water and went to shut a door, I heard her stop eating so I immediately went back to her and found her eyes closed and her neck twisted downwards looking like she was close to death. I thought she was choking so I tried to use a recommendation from a friend where she said when her hen was choking she held the hen by her legs and swung her between her legs as to let gravity dislodge the food. I did that then held her and she calmed down. Eddie usually does get a piece of feed down the wrong hole about once every three weeks but she did not even sneeze or try to get it out, it was like she just passed out.

Whenever she drinks she shakes her head. I used to not think anything of it but I do think it is important now. Whenever she drinks, it is like she took too much so she brings her head up and shakes out some water instead of just drinking it.

Tonight I am very concerned. She has been gaping, rattling, and breathing quicker than usual. She did not have any issues earlier today and acted normal. She is sitting 20 feet from me and I can her hear breathing heavily, but her mouth is not open. She sometimes sneezes and tries to dislodge something but I know she is not choking, it is just one of her weird things where she sometimes just sneezes until some water is expelled out of her nares or mouth. I have been monitoring her and she has been doing it for the past 2 hours or so. I am concerned her heart is working overtime.

I am already planning on making a vet appt but I am unsure of how soon I can get in. I am thinking it could be the scar tissue getting worse or also her metacam. I looked into it and couldn't find much on it but I am wondering if anyone knows if meloxicam raises heart rates? I have been to three separate vets. Two prescribed 1.5 mg of Meloxicam per dose but one gave us 7.5 mg per dose. This is for her arthritis. Since her arthritis is bad I have been giving her the dose that contains more but I am thinking that is too much for her. She gets it 5 days out of the week. I will attach some articles but they do not discuss heart issues much.

I am a little overboard with my treatments but Eddie also gets ginger and hawthorn to help with heart functions along with turmeric, dandelion, lily of the desert and milk thistle. In addition to some other things. What could be causing her to have these breathing issues? Old age, scar tissue, metacam?

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25815572/

@azygous @TwoCrows @Wyorp Rock @Eggcessive @coach723

 

[azygous]

Very good rundown of Eddie's symptoms. I wish all posters could be this thorough. I would say she's suffering mostly from old age. I would cut back drastically on the Meloxicam as it appears she started having the breathing issues after the latest higher dose.

Do you have a vaporizer or mister? That might help ease her breathing.

Considering her age, you need to prepare yourself that this latest breathing crisis may mean Eddie is getting ready to leave this world. I know. Not a concept that we want to face. I have gotten to love Eddie as if she were my own.

 

[azygous]

There's a point where we stop all treatment and leave our loved one at peace to die on their own terms without the intrusiveness of medical intervention.

Twice now, I've sat with a friends as they were dying. One was in the hospital dying of stomach cancer, and the other was at home dying from a stroke. In each case, all medical intervention was removed so they could die peacefully. The one in the hospital died in my arms. My cheek was pressed up to hers as her breaths became farther apart, and I was talking to her the entire time as she calmed down and left peacefully. The other was stubborn in life and just as stubborn in death and she died a few days after I'd had my last visit and chat with her.

Death is now something I do not fear, and having seen it so up close, and also had chickens and my cat die in my arms, I can understand on a very deep level how natural a process it is. Just as natural as when your two old ladies popped out of their eggs ten years ago.

When they leave, though, they aren't really gone. They are in you, having changed you with their presence and their little lives. Their bodies will soon cease to have the form that they now have, but the particles of matter that were assembled when they grew in their eggs won't actually go anywhere. Those particles will eventually be assembled into other forms and become new life forms eventually. While their essence no longer exists in a material form, it doesn't really leave either. It's present always in your heart. And beyond.

 

[Eddie12109]

Here’s a picture from Eddie’s walk tonight

 

[azygous]

A drop of Oxine should be okay. No, the Oxine and amoxy are two completely different things and won't interact. The mist should help her breathe easier, while it may not cure her.

Your goals, to be realistic, should be to make Eddie comfortable, not expect to cure her. If she does end up improving, you need to accept it may just be temporary.

I was pondering you and Eddie the other night. I realize Eddie has been your chicken since you were a small child. That's some powerful bond you two have. When you both have literally grown up together, it's very, very difficult to wrap your mind around the possibility that Eddie might not be with you into the years ahead, being as she's been a constant feature in your life as far back as early childhood. It's really tough, and I really feel for you.

 

[Wyorp Rock]

Ok so Eddie is currently getting amoxicillin. I wouldn’t mind trying doxy-tylan. The pill form hasn’t come yet but I do have the powder form. If I give her a capsule of amoxicillin tonight then start with the doxy-tylan in the water tomorrow morning would that be safe and fine? I can mix some extra powder with water and give her some in a syringe to make sure she is getting it. Or even mix the powder in something tasty to get her to eat it.

I'm not sure if going from one antibiotic to another is the answer.
If you have her on the Amoxicillin, then I'd continue with that until the Vet visit on Thursday, then ask the Vet what they would recommend.

I'd work on keeping her hydrated and comfortable. Love her up like you always do.

I'm so very sorry that Eddie is failing.

 

[Wot The Flock]

I tend to agree with Wyorp, not to keep switching antibiotics. At a guess, the antibiotics (combined with reduced food) could be making her droppings go like that. Meloxicam should not be given for more than 5-7 days.

Given her age, and symptoms, it probably is heart failure and lung issues, and really, antibiotics will not cure it. Nothing will cure her, just make her has comfortable as possible, cuddle her, talk in quiet soothing tones telling her you love her so much, and what a great chicken she has been all these years.

And as hard as it is, I suspect this is her nearing the end. I work on a 1:10 chicken to human years ratio, and she is the equivalent of a 90yo human. I have one of similar age, just over 9 years old. Every time she looks a bit down, I tell her she is the "best chicken" and she perks up again. There will come a time when she will return to the "big coop in the sky", and it is inevitable. Whether they are chickens, budgies, cats, dogs or other critters, it is always a hard loss.

Her time seems to be drawing near. Just be with her. Keep her comfortable, comfort her with your words. She will live on in your heart. Be glad you had so many years together. She is lucky to have had such a caring human in her life, and it will be hard for her to leave you too. Just be there for her at the end.

My heart goes out to you.

 

[Eddie12109]

Alright so the vet appointment was decent.

The vet overall said Eddie seems to be declining rapidly and he thinks she won’t recover.
He said it could be a number of things like heart failure or pneumonia. He listened and said her heart was going extremely quickly but didn’t hear any issues with the lungs. He felt her abdomen and thought the lump was Orange sized and was definitely not good, although he obviously couldn’t tell by feeling it if it was cancer or benign and all that. He gave her an injection of a diuretic, sadly I tried to read the bottle but couldn’t see what it said. I might call them later if any of you are interested to see but it’s definitely working someway. She’s had solid squirt liquid poops 5 times in the last 2 hours. She’s drinking quite a bit thankfully.
He gave us an antibiotic, I feel kinda duped about it. He said that it’s called enrosite and that it is so powerful that you can never consume their eggs afterwards. He sold me on it after I asked about doxycycline or tetracycline. Well I looked it up and it’s just baytril. I only heart it be called Baytril or enroflaxcin. Duh. Well I could’ve just given her Baytril at home since I have some. Do you think it will still help? This one has to be refrigerated which I thought was odd.

But anyways he said he is fine with euthanizing her because of her condition and will be able to help when that time comes. She’s still alive and has had her eyes open more after the visit. He said he didn’t think she was in a great deal of pain since she was not showing too many signs like eyes closed and gasping for breathe there.

So overall I’m glad I went. But he didn’t have much hope for her at all. Feel duped about the whole antibiotic thing though.

 

[TwoCrows]

I agree with everything that has been posted here. I too have lived through the deaths of many many chickens. Some died on their own, some were put down, some I was lucky enough to be with as they passed. My first chicken death (a bird too young to be losing her life) was so traumatic for me, I thought about jumping into the grave with this bird. Its easier now after losing so many, not that their lives have become insignificant, but as @azygous mentioned above, the deaths became less scary. I feel lucky be present at the time of their death, the one that gets to usher them out of their bodies and onto their astral journeys. We all know how draining and emotionally taxing it is to watch our beloved birds slowly slip away. My heart goes out to you @Eddie12109 there are no 2 birds on the planet loved more or taken better care of than your Eddie and Dev. I know this is tough, but we are all here to help you through this.

 

[Wot The Flock]

The abdominal mass, combined with the probable heart issues, fairly much confirms she does not have much longer. I had a much younger hen (4.5 years) with an abdominal mass (smaller than that), took her to an avian vet, and after much consideration, decided to have her euthanised at that visit, rather than risking a potentially drawn out and painful ending. I got to hold her and stroke her as she drifted off. I do not regret that decision, but of course, was still extremely sad at saying goodbye.

I do not think the antibiotics will be helping in any way, not with what is going on with her (I could be wrong) . I would be more inclined to help her with analgesics, to help with any pain or discomfort she may be having. Frankly, if she were my girl, I would stop the antibiotics. They may even be making her feel worse.

Sadly, the only decision you have now, is to let her pass on her own, or if in pain or distress, have her euthanised. I found the decision to euthanise with some of my cats, they gave me "the look" of "it's time". Chickens are even more stoic, so you may not get a clear signal.

If she looks truly miserable, help her on her way (euthanise). Ask that you can hold her as she passes. The final goodbye is near, and the best you can do for her now is not let her suffer or be in pain.