lavender (self blue)

[Boggy Bottom Bantams]

Quote:
but couldnt the self blue gene be breed out?

Yes you can breed it out IF that is your goal by doing the opposite of the out line above. But you are intending to work WITH self blue, no it's not just going to be lost or any thing like that. Those split birds each carry 1 copy of lavender in them, so it's there, all they need is to be bred to a visual lavender bird or another split and you will have the color visible again.

Now if you intend to get rid of lavender in a line... Say you have porcelains you want to make back into milles, you can breed it out if you want. Breed the porcelain to mille, all will be mille fleur split for lavender, now take these back to milles, and repeat, only a few will be splits then, repeat one more time and you pretty much have eliminated the gene from that line. A few random birds will still carry a copy but you'd have hard odds of getting 2 together to any more porcelains.

So yes , you can breed it out if that's your goal, but no it's not going to be mysteriously lost on you. Just keep records of who hatched from who and you'll always know where your genes are for it.

 

[HallFamilyFarm]

Quote:
but couldnt the self blue gene be breed out?

Yes you can breed it out IF that is your goal by doing the opposite of the out line above. But you are intending to work WITH self blue, no it's not just going to be lost or any thing like that. Those split birds each carry 1 copy of lavender in them, so it's there, all they need is to be bred to a visual lavender bird or another split and you will have the color visible again.

Now if you intend to get rid of lavender in a line... Say you have porcelains you want to make back into milles, you can breed it out if you want. Breed the porcelain to mille, all will be mille fleur split for lavender, now take these back to milles, and repeat, only a few will be splits then, repeat one more time and you pretty much have eliminated the gene from that line. A few random birds will still carry a copy but you'd have hard odds of getting 2 together to any more porcelains.

So yes , you can breed it out if that's your goal, but no it's not going to be mysteriously lost on you. Just keep records of who hatched from who and you'll always know where your genes are for it.

 

[hdowden]

if i crossed my lav with my porcelain, how many if any would come out full lavender? i have asked this before but how could you get deadly genes from this pairing? i didnt really know there were deadly gene combinations...

. i also have a mille fluer that has porcelain hertage (would that be a split?) does anyone know what colors the chicks would be? i have seen some pics but some of them didnt have good coloring but did also see some really nice looking colors.

 

[Boggy Bottom Bantams]

Quote:
on the first question

well, see both lavender and porcelain are expressing lavender visually, so every one of those would be lavender chicks, they would also be split to mottled (as mottling is recessive also)

So all your F1 chicks will be lavender split mottled. Now if you back breed these, you will get both mottled and split mottled chicks. The result will be
lavender, lavender mottled, porcelain, lavender based buff columbians, and possibly a few lavender based duckwings. The mottled will be obvious, the non mottled colors should be splits for mottling.

I have heard of this so called lethal gene in lavenders. I personally have bred lavender to about every pattern I have and in various lavender to lavender combos. I've never once had any random deaths from any sort of lethal gene...Personally I dont put much faith in it. I feel it has more to do with inbred lines than color . One thing with lavender though that I have seen while working in the longtails especially is, it has a feather type altering effect. It can at times make them brittle, some seem to stay in pin feather around the wing bow area all the time too. It's easily corrected by culling and breeding the ones that dont show this. But that is the only effect I have ever run into with the lavender color in general.


Now for the mille fleur question,

Yes it could be split for lavender, all depends. You say it has porcelain in it Heritage, that's the big question. Where in it's heritage? If it had a porcelain parent, then yes it no doubt is 100% split for lavender. If it was 2-3-4 generations back, it may or may not be carrying it (refer back to my breeding the color OUT post) On the F1 cross, all will be split
if you take these again back to mille, it cuts the ratio of splits in half, then again and again with each generation. AND all this assumes one of the parents was always a split, if it wasnt, then there is no longer any chance of lavender being in the line.

On lavender F1 splits, it's easy... They are ALL splits. From there on those you will be getting both split and non split black phase birds. There is no way to VISUALLY tell these apart. You have to breed them and see if they throw lavenders when bred to another lavender. If so they were splits. I never bother with splits outside of the first generation due to this, you end up test breeding them a year to find out what it was.

Now as to what it will produce ( your mille that is) all depends on what you are breeding it to?
Bred to milles = all milles
bred to porcelain (if a true split) = 50% porcelain and 50% milles ( all these milles will again be split lavender.

If you plan to breed it to another color, let me know and I will be glad to post the possible results.

 

[hdowden]

thank you!! that was the most help on my questions i have ever gotten

i wont be using any other colors besides the mille and porcelian with a lavender rooster. as for the mille both of her parents were milles but my hatching went bad and my 6 other babies drowned in shell from high humdity, they were fulley formed and feathered and they all looked different with different colored feathers (not the mille looking feathers that i have seen on both dry and wet hatched chicks).

 

[Boggy Bottom Bantams]

hum, that's odd if they all came from true milles. They should have all been mille chicks, even if they were splits. It wont effect the phenotype ( what they visually look like) by being a split.
For that one though, if it had both mille parents, and one of the parents came from a porcelain mille cross. Then you are in that iffy window I was talking about. On those 50% will be just mille, and 50% will be mille split to lavender. So the only way to know if it carrys lavender will be to breed it to the porcelain. If it does, 1/2 will be milles split to lavender again and 1/2 will be porcelain. Or if you breed it to the lavender you have, all will be black split to mottled if it doesnt carry lavender. If it does carry lavender you'll get 1/2 lavender and 1/2 black, all will be split for mottled.

Hope that helps.

I just wonder what was going on with the others color wise? Did they look like porcelains, wet they'd looks sort of muddy blue grey over all til they dry. If so, both your milles could be splits and just gave a lot of porcelains that time. Otherwise you must have a few other genes at work in them somewhere.

And no problem, any time you have a question, feel free to ask. Some stuff I know, some I dont...will do my best to help you out or at least point you in the right direction at least

 

[hdowden]

some looked white with black spots. hmmm if i still had the pics i would put it on but i deleted them

 

[Boggy Bottom Bantams]

that is odd?? wish you had the pics

 

[hdowden]

this is my sb d'uccle

 

[Boggy Bottom Bantams]

h's a good looking bird, with nice feathering. Those would look awesome in a mottled version. Put those porcelains back to him!