Lets talk about layer feed...

[agedog1]

Would th flavour problem also affect my male Guinea's?

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Where do you get fishmeal?

It is hard to find. I get it through a feed co-op.

 

[Mosey2003]

Where do you get fishmeal?

It can be challenging. Your first move would be to call all of your local feed stores and see if they either carry it or will order it in. If that's a bust, you have to look online. One of the organic homesteading type stores online sells it, but I can't remember the name. I came across it while researching Fertrell feed additives, if that helps.

 

[rebrascora]

If you are considering feeding fishmeal, bear in mind that it can taint the eggs, so probably better to give it to birds that are growing out rather than laying birds..... unless you like fishy eggs.

 

[WickedChickensFarm]

I've read this entire thread once and I plan to go back and do it again. I recently lost a 5 1/2 year old Barred Rock who was still laying 5 eggs a week. She was my healthy boss hen with gorgeous feather and a strong red comb. She had two bouts of bumble foot which cleared up with treatment and no sx ( I know now that bumblefoot is also a sign of excess calcium and protein). She got a crop impaction and after surgery she got ataxic and could not eat and we had to euthanize her. I had a necropsy done and she was full of calcium deposits after eating layer feed for her entire life. (All the other hens that I have necropsied in the last 6 years have had some sort of visceral gout, calcium deposits and/or kidney damage except for one with a reproductive turmor at 9 months) I immediately stopped feeding all of my birds this because I have several older hens who do not lay anymore. So this girl, despite laying 5 times a week, was STILL over burdened with calcium.
After much research I have switched to an all flock feed (NatureWise from Nutrena) and also feed a soy-free broiler mix that is ground at a local mill (used to use the layer version) with water added twice daily. They also free range in my small urban backyard and compost anywhere from 1-14 hours a day (only when I'm home).

I've come to the conclusion that layer feed is good for commercial chickens who aren't going to be living much past 2-3 years but we are basically killing our backyard flocks with commercial layer feed.

I am curious if the extra calcium in commercial feeds is a more recent phenomenon because I had chickens who were born in the 80s who regularly lived to be 10-13 years old.

 

[Kayla's Lunch]

I've come to the conclusion that layer feed is good for commercial chickens who aren't going to be living much past 2-3 years but we are basically killing our backyard flocks with commercial layer feed.

Thanks for sharing. I find that very interesting. I am always skeptical when those making a product say it's complete and balanced and we don't need to feed anything else. Would never do that to a human and expect good results.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

I've read this entire thread once and I plan to go back and do it again. I recently lost a 5 1/2 year old Barred Rock who was still laying 5 eggs a week. She was my healthy boss hen with gorgeous feather and a strong red comb. She had two bouts of bumble foot which cleared up with treatment and no sx ( I know now that bumblefoot is also a sign of excess calcium and protein). She got a crop impaction and after surgery she got ataxic and could not eat and we had to euthanize her. I had a necropsy done and she was full of calcium deposits after eating layer feed for her entire life. (All the other hens that I have necropsied in the last 6 years have had some sort of visceral gout, calcium deposits and/or kidney damage except for one with a reproductive turmor at 9 months) I immediately stopped feeding all of my birds this because I have several older hens who do not lay anymore. So this girl, despite laying 5 times a week, was STILL over burdened with calcium.
After much research I have switched to an all flock feed (NatureWise from Nutrena) and also feed a soy-free broiler mix that is ground at a local mill (used to use the layer version) with water added twice daily. They also free range in my small urban backyard and compost anywhere from 1-14 hours a day (only when I'm home).

I've come to the conclusion that layer feed is good for commercial chickens who aren't going to be living much past 2-3 years but we are basically killing our backyard flocks with commercial layer feed.

I am curious if the extra calcium in commercial feeds is a more recent phenomenon because I had chickens who were born in the 80s who regularly lived to be 10-13 years old.

Bless you for having a necropsy done. Most people don't and then doubt the science.
I don't think it is a recent phenomenon.
Some lines are more tolerant of high Ca in the diet.
Even though she was currently laying well, the damage may have been done years ago.
Once kidney segments fail, there is no rejuvenation or reversal of the damage.

Did your bird exhibit any symptoms before she died?

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Thanks for sharing. I find that very interesting. I am always skeptical when those making a product say it's complete and balanced and we don't need to feed anything else. Would never do that to a human and expect good results.

It is complete and balanced if they are a productive breed of a certain age that are laying prolifically.
Most backyard flocks contain birds with varying levels of productivity. That's why the best approach is to provide calcium on the side. Layer feed is formulated for productive birds actively laying - like leghorn types on an egg farm. There is a dramatic difference between 1% calcium and 4% calcium. Most people's birds don't turn on full productivity and turn it off like a light switch.
Commercial poultry producers have their own mills and can produce runs of feed conducive to and formulated for the million+ birds they have in a particular barn.
They have all the same breed and age in a barn that are photostimulated at the same time to be able to utilize that nutritional balance effectively - and even they get it wrong.
But at feed stores, we only have starter, grower, finisher, all-flock, layer, game bird starter and game bird maintenance. Most stores don't even have that variety.
One size doesn't fit all.
Some people have flocks consisting of Silkies, Seramas, Australorps, Spanish, Jaerhons, Games, etc.. If I had a single breed, all the same sex, all the same age, I could formulate the perfect feed for them. But a feed company has to come as close as they can not knowing what breeds/species will be fed and still have a product they can sell to the masses.

 

[Cindy in PA]

So then all the companies like Purina & Nutrena that make feed aimed at backyard flock owners are just lying to us about feeding layer feeds during the laying season? Seems they must be losing millions by producing feeds that no one should use ever. Doesn't make any sense.

 

[Molpet]

So then all the companies like Purina & Nutrena that make feed aimed at backyard flock owners are just lying to us about feeding layer feeds during the laying season? Seems they must be losing millions by producing feeds that no one should use ever. Doesn't make any sense.

Most of the processed people food is not good for us... but people buy it