Necropsy results, is not coryza or CRD--parasites are rampant!!!

[dawg53]

I've dealt with E Coli. Just because the bird you had necropsied had E Coli doesnt necessarily mean that your others have E Coli (as a problem.) As I stated before and others have mentioned, worms open the door for other problems. After you worm your birds; give them buttermilk (probiotic) mixed with scrambled egg (extra protein) and poultry nutri drench mixed in their water. The buttermilk coats their digestive tract and is absorbed whereas yogurt has a tendency to pass through them. The buttermilk will help the good bacteria in the gut flora, rebuilding the immune systems. The extra protein in the scrambled egg will help build their strength up. Poultry nutri drench restores all the necessary vitamins and minerals that your chickens need to fight back the E Coli. It's normal to have E Coli in their system. It's when it gets out of control, caused by stressor(s), that it becomes a problem. If it becomes a bad problem, neomycin and/or baytril may be necessary to add to the probiotic mixtures.

 

[dawg53]

Quote:
Not in meat or eggs eh?

 

[southerndesert]

Quote:
Here is a link to a journal article: http://japr.fass.org/cgi/content/full/16/3/392#T1

Summary of study findings and how a flock was managed:
1. There was a high incidence of worms in this 1 year old flock, maintained on litter. Incidence:
o Ascaridia galli (roundworms)—73% adults; 80% larvae,
o Heterakis gallinarum (cecal worms)—100% adults; 73% larvae
o Capillaria obsignata. (capillary or thread worms)—100% adults; 100% larvae
o Raillietina cesticillus (tapeworms)—53%

2. There were no adverse effects of albendazole treatments on bird appearance, behavior, apparent appetite, and weight gain.

3. Good control was seen at 10 mg/kg for all worms except tapeworms, which required 20 mg/kg for control.

4. Through other medical websites, I found that albendazole is used to treat humans with worm infections.

5. Conclusions:
o Since there is a very high incidence of worms in chickens raised on litter, I plan to worm my chickens 2 times per year, or more frequently if I observe worms or weight loss.

o I will use 10-20 mg albendazole/kg body weight, which translates to:
- 2 pound chicken ~0.1 ml Valbazen
- 4 pound chicken ~0.25 ml Valbazen
- 7 pound chicken ~0.5 ml Valbazen

Still we only worm with chemical wormers when a fecal test shows positive and we test twice a year. We use a preventative the rest of the time called Verm-X. We are in AZ where it is very dry and can't remember the last time we had worms in either flock....

 

[dawg53]

Quote:
I wonder.....I find that when I give a chicken oral liquid medications that not all of it gets down the hatch, I wear some of it. So....do you use something special? I have used a curved tip syringe in the past and that seems to work good, but that doesn't have a vaccuum to keep the liquid in the syringe so I have to be careful about the loaded syringe not dripping all over. I am not good at wrangling a chicken in one hand with a messy dripping syringe in another. any tips? I have also drawn up extra to account for the loss, but I hate feeling like I gave an inappropriate dose, especially when it is for a sick chicken who may pass if not properly medicated.

I also noted that someone earlier mentioned Ivermectin...do you inject it? give it orally? I read that that also can be put in the water, any thoughts on that?

I have been deworming twice yearly with Wazine and you have all made me a little weary of it's efficacy. I have the ability to run fecals at work and I need to bring a sample in to check.

Does the valbazen do anything for coccidia? I am about to search for the technical drug info on that drug. I have not heard of it before.

to the people that do not aggree with putting meds in th water....it's better than nothing. BUT if you have a dehydrated, ill chicken it will drink less and worsen the dehydration. I love meds in the water, but you must use caution with that. And if it's a rainy day and they are allowed to go outside you are wasting your time. The chickens will drink the droplets from the rain and not the medicated water. I think it has good efficacy though, just as good as oral dosing. just my opinion though

As you yourself mentioned about not giving an appropriate dose orally to a sick chicken, a sick chicken wont drink medicated water on its own as you seem to think by your last sentence. Have someone hold the chicken for you. Pull the wattles down, the chicken will open its mouth. Squirt the liquid in her mouth, she will drink it on her own. If it's a full syringe, squirt in a cc at a time.
Ivermectin injectable is useless in chickens, it'll still kill mites, but not worms in chickens. Ivermectin pour on will not kill tapeworms nor lice. Eprinex doesnt kill all worms neither.
Valbazen and cocci? Here's a link from a long time expert: Post #12.
https://www.backyardchickens.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=1180647

 

[Ksane]

I'm one of the ones that eats the eggs. Safeguard & Valbazen are safe wormers and are given in tiny doses to chickens. The EGG from that chicken isn't going to have a measurable amount of anything in it. Some people crack me up-they smoke a pack a day and have a drink every day (I do neither) yet they won't eat an egg from a wormed chicken lol
To each his own

 

[dawg53]

http://www.peafowl.org/ARTICLES/21/

This is about peafowl. Experts: will it also work with chickens????

Safeguard liquid goat wormer and/or valbazen liquid cattle/sheep wormer will take care of capillary worms. The OP that started this thread was dealing with capillary worms and was verified by an official necropsy.

 

[dawg53]

When you get the valbazen, dose them orally 1/2cc for standards and 1/4cc for smaller birds. Redose them again in 10 days to kill larva hatched from eggs. There's a 24 day withdrawal from start to finish.

First want to say Thanks for all the helpful info you have posted. Do you by chance know the dosing for the Safeguard goat liquid wormer for Chickens?

It's the same as valbazen as stated above.

 

[Randykr]

Dang it Dawg.... I had my heart set on making Chocolate Covered Feces treats with red Sprinkles for the Mother-in-law this Christmas. Have to figure out something else now.

 

[yellowchicks]

So...I was surfing web for a pumpkin recipe, which led me to the BYC threads about using raw pumpkin seeds as a natural de-wormer, which then led me to this post. WOW! I am completely gross out by the pictures but better educated with the importance of de-worming the chickens regularly. Guess the pumpkins seeds should remain as treats not cure.

I have 4 healthy white Leghorns which we got since a day-old. I have been meticulous about cleaning out the poop trays and scope out all poop in the coop everyday, and rake the run daily. My chickens are 18 weeks old, not laying yet, they have always been either inside their "co-op" or in their "gated community". There is no sign of worm or any sickness, but I now understand that they can contract worms anyway by just walking on dirt and eating off the ground. While we have been looking forward to their first eggs, seems like now is a good time to get them de-wormed with Valbazen, wait another month to eat the eggs, then repeat the process with Safeguard in the spring. Does this sound right?

Thanks for this informative thread. I read all the posts and took tons of notes.

 

[Elsa1986]

Just out of curiosity...what is going to happen when the worms become immune to all these chemical wormers? When the chemical has to become so strong it kills the bird? When the birds we raise have been so coddled that they genetically are weakened to the point of no return in the sense of surviving against anything? heat, cold, stress, parasites, etc? I'm all for protecting my flock, but I am also for protecting the survival of a species that I've come to love and I have to say that raising animals that form no resistance themselves to these enemies is like bringing about their own downfall. I wonder why no one sees the bigger picture. When it comes to doing natural, unfortunately it tends to be an all or nothing battle. Many wish to do "natural" and think that they can do it the way chemical wormers are used, twice to four times a year. Nuh uh. The thing about "natural" it is a misnomer, instead we should call it "methods requiring intensive use and dedication" because many times it takes a while to see results and in this attention deficit society that runs on instant gratification people can't handle using a method for six months or so to wait to see results. You can't expect miracles in the first hatch or two of birds, especially if the chicks were gotten from somewhere else. The medicated chick feed that is most often fed to chicks sets them up for total annihilation of their personal bacteria and this is difficult if not impossible to correct. So if you're going to invest the time and energy in doing "natural" just realize that it is a holistic viewpoint that includes getting rid of and not reproducing animals who have a tendency towards disease, raising your own chicks or investing in ones that have been organically raised so as to avoid the medicated feed, buying organically or non pesticide treated feed (really important to keep the bacterial balance) and spending inordinate amounts of time with your flock, not just limited to the time it takes to feed and change their water a couple times a week. If you will persevere though and continue to fight the tears that come when you lose animals to terrible diseases along with some parasites and related issues (a bird to a loose dog from free ranging as opposed to being penned up all day, you will be rewarded with a flock that is beyond what is considered healthy and the eggs and meat they produce will show the difference as well as the birds ability to live when other birds drop like flies to new and dangerous "super bugs".