New Breeds, Genetics and Showing section coming soon

[sumi]

As BYC grew it attracted many chicken keepers from all ages and levels of experience and interest. Up until now when these members wanted to start or participate in a breed discussion they got together in the Breeds, Genetics, & Showing forum section and members breeding to the Standard and newer chicken owners simply wanting to talk about their chickens often ended up participating on the same threads, causing some confusion and in some cases unhappiness and hurt feelings. The Staff have been discussing this problem and the lack of clear definition, which is serious Standard of Perfection (SOP) related discussions and which are more general discussions and it was decided to split the Breeds, Genetics and Showing section into two. We will be creating a new section for discussions relating to the Standard of Perfection, showing and genetics and the existing section will be the catch all section for all other breed related discussions and FAQ. Both sections will be titled to reflect the content of each section. Existing discussions relating to the SOP and breeding to the SOP will be moved to the new section, so please give us a little time to get everything reorganised before starting new threads there

If anyone has any questions regarding this, feel free to post here or PM any Staff member.

 

[3riverschick]

BYC has always been about inclusion for everyone. Personally, I don't think this new split into 2 forums is about an us vs them mindset. I think it's about helping people more easily find the info most pertinent to their quest for knowledge. Now it can easily become the former however I think it would be best for BYC if it was viewed as the latter. Poultry people should always be welcome everywhere on BYC. We all started somewhere. A notable number of us stumbled onto Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl thread and were warmly welcomed and made to feel at home regardless of our novice questions. A good percentage of those now are breeding or getting ready to breed heritage fowl. This forum split is about making BYC easier to use, not excluding one segment over another. BYC's strength has always been it's all inclusiveness. One can roam the threads and forums at will, always knowing one will be welcome wherever one decides to "light".
Best Regards,
Karen

 

[Nifty-Chicken]

NYREDS is probably right about it not keeping all the riff raff out

Let me be clear: NONE of our members are "riff raff" and regardless of how things are setup on BYC, we'll never allow members to refer to one-another in that manner.

One of the reasons BYC is the largest and fastest growing communities (online or off) about raising chickens is because we have a strong sense of friendliness and "pay it forward". All of us needed help, direction, kindness, etc. at one point in our progression of chicken knowledge and experience. Over the years we've loved seeing people, who started out with zero knowledge who were helped by friendly and patient experts, become experts themselves and "pay it forward" to a new wave of experts.

We often hear complaints from people who "expertly" breed and exhibit poultry that there aren't as many people, especially proportionate to the growth of the trend, who are interested in breeding / showing at a higher level. IMO, the best way to encourage people's interest is to mentor them in a very friendly, patient, and respectful way that will encourage them to want to participate and pull them in.

We're excited for seeing how this new section goes and look forward to our more seasoned and expert members being friendly and helpful with all our members.

 

[speckledhen]

Sounds like what the Breeding, Genetics & Showing section should already be, but maybe that will undergo a name change?

Glad to hear BYC is finally waking up. Hopefully it's effective. NYREDS is probably right about it not keeping all the riff raff out but if some sort of standards are actually enforced maybe the newcomers and casual people that come there might actually learn something which would be a big improvement over now.

Excuse me, but this is exactly the attitude that BYC does NOT need. Chicken mommies? riff raff? REALLY???? That is NOT the intent of the division of the thread! I do expect that from some of you folks, certain ones in particular who have already posted in this thread, but this division was only to help, not to divide.
If someone wants a serious breeding question answered, they would know it would be better served in "Breeding..." than in "Breeds". That's where the more knowledgeable folks would be to help them. It is not to KEEP PEOPLE OUT, for crying out loud. Oh, my gosh, please don't go there. That is the height of snobbery and rudeness, not what BYC is all about. Everyone started from Square One, but some of you have forgotten, apparently.

I'm sorry, Rob, but I had to say it. This is one of my pet peeves, this attitude. Just because I have pet chickens, and I do, does not mean I don't know anything about genetics and breeding or that I don't have some high quality birds, which I also do.

 

[Yard full o' rocks]

I'm going to be very careful not to offend and I am going to reply only one time because at the present time I am beginning to feel a bit unwelcome based upon the posts regarding my comments (and others) concerning this move and I am beginning to question my association with BYC and/or the need to continue my association here.

FIRST, I have always tried to respond with kindness and respect to any post on a thread to which I subscribe. I believe those that know me can attest to that. Whether or not the guidelines for this thread changes or not, the manner in which I, personally, respond to posts will not change. If I might overstep my bounds and speak for Matt and Bill, I would expect that they feel quite the same way.

SECONDLY, if the intent of this thread change is to encourage the participation of breeders/exhibitors WHO ARE NOT CURRENTLY BYC MEMBERS, we, the entire BYC community, myself included, must accept the fact that "in perception lies reality". One doesn't have to look far to see that most serious breeders view BYC as a community of "chicken huggers" and these individuals do not take BYC seriously. Not for the point of excluding anyone, but my point(s) regarding "casual poultry owners" or "pet owners" were not meant to be derogatory in any way, but moreso to identify the fact that there are several groups of people raising chickens....those that do it for enjoyment only and those that breed more seriously. I'll liken this to something I am very familiar with....youth baseball. In youth baseball there are several groups as well....those that play "Little League/Dizzy Dean, etc" simply to learn the sport and for enjoyment and those that play "Travel/Competitive" baseball who's intent is to GROW in their ability...neither is meant to be derogatory not segregational, there are simply 2 groups with differing objectives and the manner in which they engage in the sport is different. My point is that if we don't change for the purpose of encouraging the participation of those you wish to engage, we will make no progress, and the members you have will be the members you continue to have. Exhibition poultry folks are definitely a close knit, cliquish, sometimes snobbish, "good ole boy" group....we can either accept that and adapt as best we can to encourage their participation, or acknowledge the likelihood we will never get them to assist. Remember, "a tiger doesn't change his stripes"

FINALLY, I am quite disturbed to see that comments were allowed to continue, even after Matt publicly apologized for his comments and choice of words; and I quote Matt... "Wasn't intended to be insulting, ESPECIALLY to newcomers, so my apologies. I love helping newcomers along their journey into true poultry and sharing the limited amount of knowledge and experience I have." I believe to continue to berate him after a heartfelt, PUBLIC apology, is distasteful

Perhaps we all could have chosen a better words....but at least from me personally, it was not intended to be derogatory, belittling, or in any way critical of others.

 

[rancher hicks]

I hope I won't be stepping on any toes to offer this. I keep chickens for a number of reasons. The way I see it, I can keep hatchery or I can keep the good stuff. Whether I show or breed shouldn't matter. I have a reputation for having nice birds. Birds that others may choose to keep and show and perhaps work to improve too.

Right now I have one other person and only one other person in NY that keeps Birchen Marans like me and we work together. I do keep other breeds too.

However, I'd hate to see this thread die, because while I may not have the time and resources to devote to the "fancy" as the British would say, it will have an affect on what I keep in my yard. I'm sure I won't participate but I will read and learn.

I buy the Practical Poultry magazine because, I learn about different breeds, what to look for and how to buy. I may not buy or keep any of the many breeds out there, but I'm learning.

Now for those who may or may not have taken leave. I've been at the same church for nearly 40 years and I've learned to endure when my nose gets out of joint. I've got many long time friends and it has become my life. I am grateful to have been taught to press on and hang in there. Not become a church hopper like some who go from church to church every time someone says or does something that upsets them.

So, what has this to do with what I see happening here ? ( I could be wrong, I wear dollar store glasses)

If you're an expert, judge, breeder or what ever you'd like to be called, then have a little faith that you just might reach someone and stick it out. Why should it matter if your classroom is only filled with those YOU choose or prefer. I know my pastor doesn't get to choose who sits in the pews. Yet there he was week after week, year after year and now he's in his seventies, and I'm all the better for it. And he sure hasn't quit when folks get up in the middle of a meeting, walk out and never come back.

So whatta ya say? Are you strong enough to continue and move on? I hope so, cuz I've got a granddaughter who they're calling my chicken girl.

Peace,

Rancher

 

[BGMatt]

Sounds like what the Breeding, Genetics & Showing section should already be, but maybe that will undergo a name change?

Glad to hear BYC is finally waking up. Hopefully it's effective. NYREDS is probably right about it not keeping all the riff raff out but if some sort of standards are actually enforced maybe the newcomers and casual people that come there might actually learn something which would be a big improvement over now.

 

[rancher hicks]

People will still get their Feelings Hurt, its just the nature of our Humanity... Helping with genetics is what I do best anyways,

Won't work. The chicken mommies will invade.

I think the best way to keep the "pet owners" away (as opposed to breeders) is to establish the guidelines for conversation, requirement to use Std of Perf terminology and insist the moderators direct "pet owner" posts to the appropriate other thread locations.

I know BYC has been and wants to continue to be friendly to the "causal poultry owner", but a thread of this sort will only be as good as those who can be attracted to participate on a regular basis

One of the things discussed many year ago at the ALBC conference was the attitude of the "experts" with regards to them being kind to the young and newcomers. Quite frankly it's this attitude, that some have, that prevents them from teaching anyone anything.

It's to bad for your short sightedness that your legacy will die with you and the "chicken mommies" and "pet owners" will go to those who will gladly have them and that is to the hatcheries, inexperienced and uneducated. Which is exactly what was said.

I'm so happy for those who think they will live forever. Bob Blosi's legacy isn't the snobby "breeders". It's those who are now keeping closer to standard of perfection birds in their coops like the "chicken mommies" and "pet owners" are now.

I used to keep and show Cavies, but dropped out when it became apparent that there was a wall of snobs I was going to have to break through. So called experts, who were to good to deal with my ignorance and judged me unworthy. Which is what's kept me back in showing chickens. I just don't want to deal with the "I don't have time for you" attitude. If you want to know why your shows are smaller than in past times, it's your attitude toward new comers.

Funny folks don't realize how much alike they are to other social groups. Folks will bash Hollywood, the fashion industry and other snobby social groups but not realize they're a part of one right here.

Yes you may get some who will never come up to YOUR standards, may never show, or learn everything a good chicken breeder should know, but in alienating them you alienate their kids and grandkids who just might carry on the torch.

When you wonder why there are fewer and fewer folks keeping good chickens in their yards, why breeds are nearing extinction and why your shows are small, take a good look in the mirror!

This thread is a good idea. I just have a different opinion on who the "riff raff" are.

What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal. Albert Pine

 

[speckledhen]

Exactly. It''s only an organization of material, not some exclusive club with a "Keep Out" sign.

 

[Tumbleweed Farm]

I gave up hatchery birds three years ago and have hatched out chicks myself since then from BYC members. I became very interested in the Plymouth Rocks some months ago. I've read for hours, studied and found the best known breeders on here for Rocks and now have a few Columbian, Penciled and Barred. I am a newbie but I'm no dummy. I have joined the APA and bought the SOP. I have miles and miles to go to be anywhere but without some help or input it will be difficult.

My intent is to get somewhere someday with these birds and share with others. I live in the far West and there are not many Heritage Plymouth Rocks in these parts. I don't dream of selling eggs and chicks to make any money--I have spent so much getting started I would not be able to even recoup those costs anyway. I dearly love the breed and am willing to do my part to help--but, if I am ignored when I have a question or make a post--I will indeed find the answer, it will just be harder. I look forward to the new thread -- I will be reading!