Our Dog Killed the Neighbors' Turkey Poult

[buffy-the-eggpile-layer]

I found this book extremely helpful. Maybe it will help you too.

https://www.amazon.com/Fired-Up-Frantic-Freaked-Out/dp/0985934921

Ordering it. THANK YOU!!!

 

[buffy-the-eggpile-layer]

First all, you have experienced a very disappointing behavior in your Gorgeous Albi. Naturally, you feel terrible about the chicken but, I as a King Shepard owner pride myself in my ability to have trained her in Advanced obedience. I did not see your pups tail but, that would be a dead give away of being a King Shepard especially by the pictures and the weight of 80lbs @ eight mos.
A King Shepard is a mix of a GSD/Shiloh Shepard with a very high excitable prey drive. These dogs are often used for Boarder Control because of the prey drive, with tuffs between the toes, ears and thick undercoat on the back hunches.
Did I describe your dog? Please send me a picture of his tail.
I know this sounds dumb but, I trained my King Shepard with my new flock of chickens. But, even at 7 years old, I have to keep an eye out.

Sounds like Albie for sure! I'll see if I can get a picture of his tail for you and send it. He does have tufts around his ears and a think undercoat on back haunches--not sure about tufts between toes. If not exactly the same breed, maybe quite similar in mixture of lines/genetic make up.

Training your dog with chickens doesn't sound dumb--that's precisely what I wanted to do, though sadly, we lapsed a bit. Good to know there is hope, and also the importance of realistic expectations (i.e. that he can become chicken-friendly but never be able to be around them unsupervised).

 

[ShrekDawg]

We do not yet have a fenced in yard, nor do they, so it might have to be controlled playtime (like you mentioned, birds penned up). This was actually the first time Albie ever saw their birds out--we just didn't know they were out until it was too late. And I think the neighbors assumed Albie would be fine with their birds because he had been with ours. I hope, as time mends our wounds, we can move past this as neighbors (we've had such a GREAT relationship with them, I'd hate for this to ruin that!).

I do hear 2-3 years is when they might calm down a bit. I think he'll always be a goofball. But judging how he is around the house and on a normal day, he is quite a calm, controllable dog. He just gets overly stimulated by things he loves--new people, other dogs, etc.--and turns into a giant, hyperactive blur.

Thanks for the reassurance. As I just replied to a previous poster, my fears are now that this will extend to my cats who I had always thought were relatively safe (he's been so great with them). I'll be keeping a close eye, and will not give up.

They seem like they’ve been good about it so far so hopefully they’ll continue to be! Sounds like they know it was an accident.

He sounds like an amazing dog! And hopefully this will be a one time mistake but it will definitely take management on your part and some more training. The behavior you just described though is very common in young dogs though so you’re not alone.

Hopefully that book will help with this too!!

But you can also start to work on it a bit just on leash and at a distance from people and other dogs at first. Just getting him exposed to them and learning to focus around them will be huge but will take time. And hopefully too by being exposed he will learn it’s not that exciting. You can start far away where he’s able to focus and then slowly moving closely and closer as he’s able to.

If you haven’t already, I would teach him eye contact as well. This is fairly simple to teach and will be huge in getting focus around distractions. You can just start rewarding him whenever he looks at you and/or you can also get a piece of paper or treat and hold it to the side and get him to look at that and then back at you and reward with another treat. You can eventually add in a verbal cue once he’s doing it reliably like “watch me”, “focus”, “eyes”, “up here”, whatever you want really. Just pick one and be consistent with it.

And as for your cats, I wouldn’t worry too much about them but definitely keep an eye out! But if he’s been good with them all along, even with as young as he is, then that’s not likely to change. I think he just got overly amped up with his buddy and wanted to chase something. If it hadn’t been the turkey, it might have been something else. Plus he likely views their flock and animals as different from your own. Seems like he’s accepted the cats as part of his family.

That said though, you may need to watch him around strange cats and small animals but I don’t think he’d go after yours.

I am glad you are not giving up on him!

 

[ShrekDawg]

Ordering it. THANK YOU!!!

Hopefully it helps!!!

 

[Folly's place]

This is a tough 'first dog' for you, but you are moving in the right direction, and this was a big 'wake-up call' too.
Fencing!!! You need to be able to keep him at home, in your yard, all the time except when he's with you and really under control. He's in adolescence, and listens some of the time, if it's convenient, and he's not distracted. Not enough yet!
Don't assume that he won't run into the road, or chase a cyclist, or do something that gets him injured out there.
Consider Invisible Fencing at least, or a physical fence, some way to keep him safe, and prevent problems.
He never met a turkey before, so it was fair game! He also might think of your chickens as his (maybe) but not the neighbor's flock.
Right now attending group obedience classes won't be a good idea, because of Covid 19; normally that's the best way to train with distractions. Be creative! Outside, walking out there, noisemakers, kids running around, something. Obedient in the living room won't help outside during a situation.
Look at making him a good canine citizen, and plan on it taking a year at least.
He won't be mentally mature until he's three years old at least, and he will try things again that seem worth attempting as maturity happens.
Mary

 

[buffy-the-eggpile-layer]

They seem like they’ve been good about it so far so hopefully they’ll continue to be! Sounds like they know it was an accident. ❤

He sounds like an amazing dog! And hopefully this will be a one time mistake but it will definitely take management on your part and some more training. The behavior you just described though is very common in young dogs though so you’re not alone.

Hopefully that book will help with this too!!

But you can also start to work on it a bit just on leash and at a distance from people and other dogs at first. Just getting him exposed to them and learning to focus around them will be huge but will take time. And hopefully too by being exposed he will learn it’s not that exciting. You can start far away where he’s able to focus and then slowly moving closely and closer as he’s able to.

If you haven’t already, I would teach him eye contact as well. This is fairly simple to teach and will be huge in getting focus around distractions. You can just start rewarding him whenever he looks at you and/or you can also get a piece of paper or treat and hold it to the side and get him to look at that and then back at you and reward with another treat. You can eventually add in a verbal cue once he’s doing it reliably like “watch me”, “focus”, “eyes”, “up here”, whatever you want really. Just pick one and be consistent with it.

And as for your cats, I wouldn’t worry too much about them but definitely keep an eye out! But if he’s been good with them all along, even with as young as he is, then that’s not likely to change. I think he just got overly amped up with his buddy and wanted to chase something. If it hadn’t been the turkey, it might have been something else. Plus he likely views their flock and animals as different from your own. Seems like he’s accepted the cats as part of his family.

That said though, you may need to watch him around strange cats and small animals but I don’t think he’d go after yours. ❤

I am glad you are not giving up on him! ❤

We are working at new environments/distractions and have noticed a distance threshold--i.e. he ignores people from a certain distance away and dogs, too, except they have to be REALLY far away because he is obsessed with other dogs--like it blows his mind whenever he sees one. At least he's friendly towards them but it's an overexcited, annoying kind of friendly. He did great on a walk in a new park yesterday in which multiple people and types of dogs were present.

We also have worked on eye contact, which he's pretty good at, of course not so much in new situations (which we will keep at). Thank you for all of these tips.

I appreciate your encouragement about the cats. I feel bad because I'm now constantly scrutinizing/re-reading his every movement around or look he gives the cats and it's quite stressful. Yesterday, I accidentally dropped one of his treats on the floor and of course my cat goes for it right under Albie's nose--I was ready to jump into action, but, thankfully, it was fine. Albie ate his treat and ignored the cat's attempt at a steal. I know all this anxiety is not good for the dog and I hope it passes with time.

I will keep watching him in any and all situations. It's scary how fast things can go wrong.

Best,
Jenna

 

[buffy-the-eggpile-layer]

This is a tough 'first dog' for you, but you are moving in the right direction, and this was a big 'wake-up call' too.
Fencing!!! You need to be able to keep him at home, in your yard, all the time except when he's with you and really under control. He's in adolescence, and listens some of the time, if it's convenient, and he's not distracted. Not enough yet!
Don't assume that he won't run into the road, or chase a cyclist, or do something that gets him injured out there.
Consider Invisible Fencing at least, or a physical fence, some way to keep him safe, and prevent problems.
He never met a turkey before, so it was fair game! He also might think of your chickens as his (maybe) but not the neighbor's flock.
Right now attending group obedience classes won't be a good idea, because of Covid 19; normally that's the best way to train with distractions. Be creative! Outside, walking out there, noisemakers, kids running around, something. Obedient in the living room won't help outside during a situation.
Look at making him a good canine citizen, and plan on it taking a year at least.
He won't be mentally mature until he's three years old at least, and he will try things again that seem worth attempting as maturity happens.
Mary

You're right, he's a handful of a first dog, but I dunno, also he's been so easy in many other ways so it's complicated. House training, chewing, nipping/biting was never a problem. Loves all people. He's been so great with our cats, and surprisingly good with our chickens. But this whole obsession with other dogs and overstimulation thing is where it gets untenable. He was in group puppy class and he was the WORST student... he could not, despite the trainers' and our actions, constantly bark/whine at and be obsessed with the other dogs the entire time and literally acted like he'd explode at any second. Another trainer said group classes aren't a good fit for him. Sigh.

I'm hoping the newness/sudden closeness of the turkey was part of the issue. I do have my sights on him being a Canine Good Citizen but it seems so far away... we will keep moving forward and training this guy with all we've got.

 

[ShrekDawg]

We are working at new environments/distractions and have noticed a distance threshold--i.e. he ignores people from a certain distance away and dogs, too, except they have to be REALLY far away because he is obsessed with other dogs--like it blows his mind whenever he sees one. At least he's friendly towards them but it's an overexcited, annoying kind of friendly. He did great on a walk in a new park yesterday in which multiple people and types of dogs were present.

We also have worked on eye contact, which he's pretty good at, of course not so much in new situations (which we will keep at). Thank you for all of these tips.

I appreciate your encouragement about the cats. I feel bad because I'm now constantly scrutinizing/re-reading his every movement around or look he gives the cats and it's quite stressful. Yesterday, I accidentally dropped one of his treats on the floor and of course my cat goes for it right under Albie's nose--I was ready to jump into action, but, thankfully, it was fine. Albie ate his treat and ignored the cat's attempt at a steal. I know all this anxiety is not good for the dog and I hope it passes with time.

I will keep watching him in any and all situations. It's scary how fast things can go wrong.

Best,
Jenna

That’s good you’ve been working on all that stuff and noticed his threshold and everything! A lot of people don’t notice those things. It seems like you’ve done your research and work with him

If you know his threshold, I would just keep trying to work on it as often as you can and try to slowly decrease it and get closer as he’s able to. It will probably take some time and that’s okay! But you can test it and see if he’s ready by starting at the usual and then getting a bit closer and if he gets over threshold and unable to focus, etc. then go back to below threshold. He may not necessarily freak out but if he won’t focus or won’t take the treat, etc. those are subtle signs too.

And I am sure he loves his kitties

 

[ShrekDawg]

You're right, he's a handful of a first dog, but I dunno, also he's been so easy in many other ways so it's complicated. House training, chewing, nipping/biting was never a problem. Loves all people. He's been so great with our cats, and surprisingly good with our chickens. But this whole obsession with other dogs and overstimulation thing is where it gets untenable. He was in group puppy class and he was the WORST student... he could not, despite the trainers' and our actions, constantly bark/whine at and be obsessed with the other dogs the entire time and literally acted like he'd explode at any second. Another trainer said group classes aren't a good fit for him. Sigh.

I'm hoping the newness/sudden closeness of the turkey was part of the issue. I do have my sights on him being a Canine Good Citizen but it seems so far away... we will keep moving forward and training this guy with all we've got.

Are there any other trainers available that might be able to work with him? It does sound like he was way over threshold there though and perhaps working one on one with like one dog at a time might help him? Maybe you could get your neighbors to help with their Lab? And then when he’s good with one dog (should many different ones ideally) then you could move to two, etc. should definitely go slow with him though with how overaroused and above threshold he was. But it is possible. And hopefully that book will help too because it talks about a lot of this stuff. I think he just needs more exposure. My brother’s dog was insane around other dogs too and would lunge and pull and stuff but calmed down.

 

[Vickischics]

Just checking in on your dog chicken training.