Pip but no movement - shrink wrapped?

[OneFowlMama]

Quick question - does shrink wrapping occur inside of the egg before an external pip or is it only after external pips are formed? Just over thinking my previous humidity drop most likely but I'm still really curious to know the science behind it, thanks to everyone for all your replies and knowledge by the way, as hard as this situation feels right now I feel so much better after reading your stories and gaining knowledge from experienced hatchets! <3

 

[BirdsBeesTrees]

Since you incubated at 45% and are just on day 20 I think you have a good chance of having some chicks hatch out in the next two days! I personally wouldn't want the humidity at lockdown to go over 60%. But you do what you think and see what works best for you, in your location, with your incubator.

 

[slordaz]

I am so so sorry you had to go through that, I can't imagine how devastated you must've felt, my heart truly goes out to you and as painful as it was I am glad to hear your story because now I know not to mess with nature and just let it be whatever that may lead to. I have a tiny piece of cardboard placed into one corner of the lid which is keeping the humidity between 63-65% currently, I've been keeping a close eye on it since I read the drowning comment and it hasn't dropped below or gone above those incriments yet. I'll still keep my eyes on it to make sure it doesn't drop any lower than 60% though, the last thing I want is my other 5 bubs to have anything less than perfect conditions to be born into.

it will spike on it's own when they internally pip then go back down on it's own and you start hearing them cheep once they internally pip then the hard work starts, they have to get that external pip. My poor chicks have super hard shells to begin with, had one that had used up it's pipping tooth on the beak by time it got out of it's shell.

 

[Jemima Duck]

Ahh, I can relate to not knowing what to do in this scenario, as the same thing happened to me. I'm not saying you should take this as advice as such, it's just an anecdote I have that happened 3 days ago now:

The duckling was moving about and trying to internally pip, so I went to bed content that there was movement in the egg. The next morning there was no movement whatsoever in the egg... I assumed it was resting so left it another day. After seeing it still not move a day later, I decided to try to assist with the hatch, I didn't get far into assisting when I realised that the gorgeous, fully formed duckling was dead. The cause was that the duckling had gotten shrink wrapped, and had membrane over it's mouth and nostrils. Absolutely devastated me as it was my first hatch. I then decided to assist the other two eggs hatch by making air holes. If I hadn't assisted then they would have died.

I personally don't see the harm in making a decent sized air hole for the chick/ducklings (EDIT: -when they have been trying to internally pip for a too long and are tiring), because to me it's just unnecessary death to leave them unassisted (though it seems to be a hot topic in the chicken/duck-keeping community). What I did in your scenario was make a small air hole, then a larger one if I didn't see any movement or a beak poking out the hole... But as I said, I have only hatched eggs once, so I am very inexperienced

 

[LynnaePB]

Quick question - does shrink wrapping occur inside of the egg before an external pip or is it only after external pips are formed? Just over thinking my previous humidity drop most likely but I'm still really curious to know the science behind it, thanks to everyone for all your replies and knowledge by the way, as hard as this situation feels right now I feel so much better after reading your stories and gaining knowledge from experienced hatchets! <3

I have heard shrink wrapping is not really an issue so much before the external pip so your other eggs are likely fine unless other factors during incubation made them more likely to shrink wrap (I'm not sure exactly what those would be but I've heard shrink wrapping is often more complicated than a lot of hatchers think).

 

[OneFowlMama]

Ahh, I can relate to not knowing what to do in this scenario, as the same thing happened to me. I'm not saying you should take this as advice as such, it's just an anecdote I have that happened 3 days ago now:

The duckling was moving about and trying to internally pip, so I went to bed content that there was movement in the egg. The next morning there was no movement whatsoever in the egg... I assumed it was resting so left it another day. After seeing it still not move a day later, I decided to try to assist with the hatch, I didn't get far into assisting when I realised that the gorgeous, fully formed duckling was dead. The cause was that the duckling had gotten shrink wrapped, and had membrane over it's mouth and nostrils. Absolutely devastated me as it was my first hatch. I then decided to assist the other two eggs hatch by making air holes. If I hadn't assisted then they would have died.

I personally don't see the harm in making a decent sized air hole for the chick/ducklings (EDIT: -when they have been trying to internally pip for a too long and are tiring), because to me it's just unnecessary death to leave them unassisted (though it seems to be a hot topic in the chicken/duck-keeping community). What I did in your scenario was make a small air hole, then a larger one if I didn't see any movement or a beak poking out the hole... But as I said, I have only hatched eggs once, so I am very inexperienced

I haven't noticed any movement of the other eggs yet, I didnt notice any last night with the one that did manage to pip either however. I haven't candled since lockdown but did mark the top of the eggs so I could notice any wobbling or movement from within, is this a sign that shrink wrapping could be occuring internally do you think? I'll wait until day 21 or 22 but I have read stories of some chicks only pipping on day 26, it's all so difficult to gauge an egg from the outside is what I'm learning! I'm so sorry about your little one but I'm really, really glad to hear your other two bubs pulled through with your help. <3

 

[slordaz]

Shrink wrapping can occur anytime after internal pipping, eggs are porous. After the internal pip is when they start breathing air and can start chirping. if a chick dies without internally pipping they just start decomposing but aren't shrink wrapped. The danger with shrink wrapping is they get no air due to the membrane blocking the nostrils and making it so the chick cannot move or breath.

 

[OneFowlMama]

Shrink wrapping can occur anytime after internal pipping, eggs are porous. After the internal pip is when they start breathing air and can start chirping. if a chick dies without internally pipping they just start decomposing but aren't shrink wrapped. The danger with shrink wrapping is they get no air due to the membrane blocking the nostrils and making it so the chick cannot move or breath.

Oh gosh, I haven't heard any chirping from the other eggs but in saying that I didn't hear any from the pipped egg at all either last night, I checked them last at 2am and when I woke up at 7:30 I discovered the pip hole! Is it quite quick between internal and external pipping usually?

 

[slordaz]

I haven't noticed any movement of the other eggs yet, I didnt notice any last night with the one that did manage to pip either however. I haven't candled since lockdown but did mark the top of the eggs so I could notice any wobbling or movement from within, is this a sign that shrink wrapping could be occuring internally do you think? I'll wait until day 21 or 22 but I have read stories of some chicks only pipping on day 26, it's all so difficult to gauge an egg from the outside is what I'm learning! I'm so sorry about your little one but I'm really, really glad to hear your other two bubs pulled through with your help. <3

21 days is an average , ultimately it depends on how steady the incubator remained during incubation, cold spots or low temps cause late hatches, high temps can cause early hatches I've had chicks hatch at 19 days and then some not hatch until days 23-25 due to cool spots.

 

[slordaz]

Oh gosh, I haven't heard any chirping from the other eggs but in saying that I didn't hear any from the pipped egg at all either last night, I checked them last at 2am and when I woke up at 7:30 I discovered the pip hole! Is it quite quick between internal and external pipping usually?

it depends, that internal pip is what starts them breathing, and can take up while as that starts them absorbing the veins and yolk. some chicks do not chirp they are focused on getting out while others are like a song bird while they work on getting out so don't stress to much.

That's why it's so hard to figure out whether to assist or not