I have got to find a way to hold pens down without the stakes. A few years back I tried ropes but they were a hastle when moving pens. Prior to that pens simply in cover of trees. Trees, even during winter really slow wind down. I have a 2 acre area that is being allowed to grow trees for future cover. It be a couple more years before that is ready. Already got area fenced in. Same area **** bobcat also worked so got to keep it out with dogs.