Sigh - dog issue

Discussion in 'Predators and Pests' started by jjthink, Mar 13, 2011.

  1. I think it is all well and fine to talk about fences but in the end You Should not Have To Provide A Fence when their dogs are in the wrong. Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought you said there was a leash law where you live.If that is right I would get a copy of that leash law for those neighbors to read since they are h*ll bent on letting their dogs loose.It is ludacris to me that you would be made to do all this FOR THEM so you can keep yourself and chickens safe. All this is too much stress for you to worry about when the law is on your side.

    I can see that you are a very nice person and want to keep in good standing with them but when does it get to be too much?
     
  2. jjthink

    jjthink Crowing

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    Quote:Right about now!

    The neighbor I wrote back to (copying the second one) passed my note along to a third on the street so now that's 3 dog owners who anticipate I'd set up a signal system. As much as I love all animals, including dogs, I'm really more tired than I can say of the dog-chicken issue. Dog owners must control their dogs. I will have to try to work something out with these particular people given the complexities in my particular situation right now (with having ticketed other much more irresponsible dog owners and with the legal hell from flooding - people are intertwined and I couldn't begin to explain it all) but at heart I do not believe it is the bird guardian's responsibility to mitigate for the lack of responsible behavior on the part of dog owners. Practically speaking there is often little choice, unfortunately. Tractor - I'm afraid I have injuries from trying to save my property from all the flooding such that I would be unable to move a tractor around, tho it otherwise would be a great idea for some folks..... Re: temporary fencing/wiring...with the legal he77, no alterations of any kind can be made right now to the property....madness I know.....I can't get into it in a public forum so have to leave it at that...

    Such a gorgeous day and I had to leave my feathered friends locked in their run. I'm at work. Such is our lives...

    JJ
     
  3. Sonoran Silkies

    Sonoran Silkies Flock Mistress

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    I think that you need to send a politely phrased note back to them stating that there IS a leash law, requiring that their dogs be on-leash and under the owner's control (quoting the law would be good). That your bird range on your own property at unpredictable times when you can watch them (mention your irregular work schedule if you think it might help), and that they need to keep their dogs on their own property or leashed. If they really want to run them off-leash at the park, suggest that they see what would be entailed in getting a portion of it fenced for a dog park, and that you would be happy to support those efforts. That returns the onus to them, but also lets them know that you appreciate their desire for their dogs to have a "social" life, and are willing to provide some support for a reasonable compromise that keeps all the animals safe.

    One other thing that you can point out is that not all dogs are playfully friendly to each other. I know for a fact that if other dogs got into my yard, my dog would attack them, and the chances that she would be playing are pretty slim--she does NOT like other dogs. She might be smaller (she's a JRT), but she thinks she is not, and can pack a mean bite. I have a neighbor with boer bulls (huge mastiff-like dogs). He got in between two of them to break up a fight (when a maintenance person left gates open) and ended up in the hospital for a week wth a severely damaged hand and forearm. They were not trying to attack him, but breaking up a dog fight is DANGEROUS.
     
  4. greeneggsandham

    greeneggsandham Songster

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    Mar 10, 2008
    Putnam,CT
    Quote:Right about now!

    The neighbor I wrote back to (copying the second one) passed my note along to a third on the street so now that's 3 dog owners who anticipate I'd set up a signal system. As much as I love all animals, including dogs, I'm really more tired than I can say of the dog-chicken issue. Dog owners must control their dogs. I will have to try to work something out with these particular people given the complexities in my particular situation right now (with having ticketed other much more irresponsible dog owners and with the legal hell from flooding - people are intertwined and I couldn't begin to explain it all) but at heart I do not believe it is the bird guardian's responsibility to mitigate for the lack of responsible behavior on the part of dog owners. Practically speaking there is often little choice, unfortunately. Tractor - I'm afraid I have injuries from trying to save my property from all the flooding such that I would be unable to move a tractor around, tho it otherwise would be a great idea for some folks..... Re: temporary fencing/wiring...with the legal he77, no alterations of any kind can be made right now to the property....madness I know.....I can't get into it in a public forum so have to leave it at that...

    Such a gorgeous day and I had to leave my feathered friends locked in their run. I'm at work. Such is our lives...

    JJ

    This should be the sign system. "If your dogs are on my property you will not see them again!!!!"
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2011
  5. greeneggsandham

    greeneggsandham Songster

    834
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    Mar 10, 2008
    Putnam,CT
    Quote:Right about now!

    The neighbor I wrote back to (copying the second one) passed my note along to a third on the street so now that's 3 dog owners who anticipate I'd set up a signal system. As much as I love all animals, including dogs, I'm really more tired than I can say of the dog-chicken issue. Dog owners must control their dogs. I will have to try to work something out with these particular people given the complexities in my particular situation right now (with having ticketed other much more irresponsible dog owners and with the legal hell from flooding - people are intertwined and I couldn't begin to explain it all) but at heart I do not believe it is the bird guardian's responsibility to mitigate for the lack of responsible behavior on the part of dog owners. Practically speaking there is often little choice, unfortunately. Tractor - I'm afraid I have injuries from trying to save my property from all the flooding such that I would be unable to move a tractor around, tho it otherwise would be a great idea for some folks..... Re: temporary fencing/wiring...with the legal he77, no alterations of any kind can be made right now to the property....madness I know.....I can't get into it in a public forum so have to leave it at that...

    Such a gorgeous day and I had to leave my feathered friends locked in their run. I'm at work. Such is our lives...

    JJ

    This should be the sign system. "If your dogs are on my property you will not see them again!!!!"
     
  6. jjthink

    jjthink Crowing

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    New Jersey
    Bad timing - look what hit the papers today, front page. This pertains to the adjacent, more rural town. Bolded sentence below is troubling though presumably 'at large' would not include one's own property! Also, amazing what people go through to regulate chickens when dogs usually make far more noise. I have a roo and a hen. BJ rarely crows but once in awhile for a few minutes (in broad daylight, as any early morning crowing is done in an insulated quiet coop). Some of the neighbor's dogs bark for hours on end. Any which way sliced, this action by the neighboring, less densely populated town could well get people hankering to clamp down here.


    HOPEWELL TOWNSHIP: Chickens may find new roosts
    DATE POSTED: Thursday, March 17, 2011 11:05 AM EDT
    By John Tredrea, Staff Writer


    Residents whose homes are on lots at least one-half acre in size would be able to keep up to six chickens on their properties under a measure introduced by the Hopewell Township Committee Monday night.

    The proposed ordinance, scheduled for a public hearing and adoption vote April 25, is backed by the Residential Animal Agriculture Subcommittee of the township’s Agricultural Advisory Committee.

    For homes on lots larger than one-half acre, up to four additional chickens may be kept for each additional half-acre. Mature roosters would be prohibited. However, roosters may visit the property, for purposes of fertilizing chickens, up to 10 per days per year, but no more than five days consecutively.

    A cockerel, or young male chicken, that crows would have to be removed from the property.

    Slaughtering chickens in public view would be prohibited.
    Chickens would have to be in a fully enclosed shelter, in the rear yard, at least 25 feet from any neighboring property line and at least 50 feet from any neighboring house.

    The size of the shelters would be limited. Feed and waste would have to be kept in tight containers. Chickens would be prohibited from running at large

    or disturbing the peace. There would be penalties for violations.

    The measure was backed Monday by John Hart, a farmer and former township mayor and member of the township’s Agricultural Advisory Committee, and Ted Borer, of the subcommittee on Residential Animal Agriculture.

    The proposed ordinance “is consistent with ordinances in townships across the country,” said Mr. Borer
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2011
  7. jjthink

    jjthink Crowing

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    New Jersey
    Same topic, appearing in a more regional paper.

    N.J. town proposes limiting mating of roosters, chickens in backyard farms to 10 days a year

    Published: Thursday, March 17, 2011, 8:35 AM
    By Lisa Coryell/For The Times

    HOPEWELL TOWNSHIP — It might not make the chickens happy, but the township committee hopes to keep the peace in neighborhoods by limiting conjugal visits between roosters and hens in backyard farms.

    Male fowls would be allowed into the henhouses 10 days a year under an ordinance introduced by the township committee Monday night. No rooster would be allowed to stay more than five consecutive nights and any crowing would be strictly prohibited.
    "You can bet if you have one rooster in there with six hens, he’s going to be crowing," chuckled John Hart, a beef farmer who sits on the town Agricultural Advisory Committee that helped draft the ordinance. "Only in Hopewell Township would we waste the time and money on chicken legislation. Other towns are laughing at us."
    Hopewell began working on the law several years ago when a father came to town hall to inquire about rules for keeping chickens in the backyard to teach his children about the cycle of life. That ruffled feathers among the town officials, who decided the laws on chickens were ambiguous and needed to be clarified.
    Three years and countless legal hours later the ordinance was unveiled for consideration.
    The draft ordinance lays out the rules for keeping backyard fowl; the only livestock permitted on township properties less than five acres.
    Under the law, up to six hens would be allowed on half-acre lots; but mature roosters would be forbidden.
    "They make too much noise," Hart said. "They’ll be out there crowing at a full moon."
    The male fowls would be allowed limited time on the property "for purposes of fertilization" but they’d have to keep quiet while they were there. Any rooster caught crowing for a prolonged period of time would subject the property to a two-year moratorium on all rooster visits.
    Hens do not need roosters around to lay the unfertilized eggs used for eating. Each hen will lay an egg a day on average.
    The law also regulates how to shelter chickens, store their feed and dispose of their waste.
    Proponents say the ordinance is needed to prevent any squabbling among neighbors in places where suburbanites want to try their hand at chicken farming.
    Hart, who owns the Rosedale Mills feed store on Route 31, says it’s a growing trend among people looking for a healthier diet of homegrown food.
    "Most people keep the chickens so they can have fresh eggs," Hart said. "We used to sell 1,000 chicks a year. Last year we sold more than 3,000."
    Hart also sells chicken coops to people all over the state. One couple comes in from New York to buy supplies for a pair of chickens they keep on an outside deck, he said.
    He also hosts a Chicken Chat in the spring and the fall for people to share ideas about raising poultry.
    He recounted a conversation last spring between a little girl and an old-time farmer who attended the gathering. The child was asking for advice on what to do with a hen that pecked and broke the eggs laid by other hens.
    "The guy said, ‘I just wring their necks,’" Hart recalled. "I told him ‘No, no, no, you can’t tell people that. These people think of their chickens as pets!’"
    Mayor Jim Burd said the ordinance is a good balance between the town’s suburban lifestyle and rich farming history.
    "Our agrarian roots are the backbone of the township and we want to do what we can to keep that going," Burd said.
     
  8. MyKidLuvsGreenEgz

    MyKidLuvsGreenEgz Songster

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    Write that John Hunt who supported the measure and tell him (succinctly and un-biased) about your situation, and that there needs to be clarification of "at large" in the proposed ordinance. Beyond that, it sounds like a major win for backyard chicken enthusiasts!
     
  9. speckledhen

    speckledhen Intentional Solitude

    The male fowls would be allowed limited time on the property "for purposes of fertilization" but they’d have to keep quiet while they were there. Any rooster caught crowing for a prolonged period of time would subject the property to a two-year moratorium on all rooster visits.

    [​IMG] That cracked me up.​
     
  10. jjthink

    jjthink Crowing

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    New Jersey
    Totally. Who dreams this stuff up? I know most of the people involved and last I had heard, there was going to be no ordinance since they said a review revealed that chicken-keeping was already okay and best not to open a can of worms. Sigh....

    JJ
     

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