The IMPORTED ENGLISH Orpington Thread

[jdoane]

Does the color of their legs tell us anything?

 

[galanie]

No, they should all have partly slate/partly white legs and feet at this stage. I'm guessing a splash and a dark blue.

 

[jdoane]

Interesting about the feet. My "Splash" has legs that look greenish bluish depending on the light. For my education can you tell me why you think Splash and why dark Blue? Just trying to learn as much as possible.

 

[galanie]

Interesting about the feet.  My "Splash" has legs that look greenish bluish depending on the light.  For my education can you tell me why you think Splash and why dark Blue?  Just trying to learn as much as possible.

The slate can look greenish when they're tiny. Should turn more of a grey eventually. I think splash because the chick has too little "gray" to be a blue, but I'm not 100% sure on that. Still could maybe be a light blue. I haven't hatched enough splash chicks to be positive beyond doubt. And the other has gray on it, black chicks don't have any grey, it's just black and white in that penguin pattern.

 

[jdoane]

Got it! Thanks. Looking forward to finding out for sure when they're older!

 

[deek]

then why bother with English birds if you want SOP? there are plenty of American birds that fit the SOP for America, I thought the point of importing and buying and breeding ENGLISH birds was because we liked the fluff and shape? why go through the trouble to get them here only to change them to fit the American SOP? and I say this with the nicest intentions. I just dont get it, cant we have both? instead of trying to make them all fit the same mold?

Not that my breeding plans need to be explained or justified...Honestly, it is the same as most of us on this thread. To improve and preserve what we have.

I love the cobby English type. I love the German GL type most. I am keeping two lines working towards that very type.

The reason Lynne and Vickie made those suggestions is because they know my goal with the Gold Laced (they weren't implying that everyone needs to breed towards the SOP) and that is to work towards presenting them to the standards committee. I want to see them accepted in my lifetime. Not because I want or need a ribbon, not because I pleased a specific judge in a show. Although I want to do both. But I want to do so for a very different reason. I'll explain.

Three years ago, the GL were the latest fad. The must-have for the newbies because they were rare-here. I was one of them. They sold for a very high price because the demand was high. Many invested in them since they were sure to get a return. This is a fact.

The following is my opinion: if you need to make a quick return on your investment all you need to worry about is "when will they start laying?" (which was asked over and over again.) I get that. The problem is that very little attention has been given to the actual breeding. Yes, a girl was paired with a boy. But that was about it. When the GL were originally imported, they came with many problems as all projects do. But I have personally seen them get worse. In a few more generations no one will want them. Those that have them as their first bird are beginning to see how difficult it is to breed a laced bird and will give up when they can't sell any. Their popularity is already waning. The future for the GL is not very bright.

WHEN they are accepted (some of us are working towards that), the Gold Laced variety will have exposure at the shows. This sparked interest might put them in hands of those that love them for their beauty and perhaps can take the time to reflect on their breeding decisions. Perhaps- only a guess. But certainly those that will show them will meet their basic needs and continue to work towards them looking like Orpingtons.

I am not a fan of the SOP. But I know the value. There is very little difference between the SOP and the Eng -please let's not start THAT discussion again :0) An Orpington is an Orpington is an Orpington. The biggest visual difference, in my opinion, is that the SOP calls for a bigger head, less skirt with more shank, and a different tail angle. All of which I do not like. Will I breed towards the SOP? You betcha. I will have a line that I can show. I feel it is the easiest way to promote them. (There are many breeders that do not come to BYC) The exposure will be enormous. The Gold Laced as a variety will slip into oblivion without it because their notoriety is over.

For me, the fun is just beginning. I am seeing bits of improvement with each generation. I only have the GL (and the blks as a necessary means to an end-which I love, BTW). I'll just keep trudging along, doing my thing. Taking waaay too many pictures. Promoting them on a website that I've dedicated for them. Talking about them in the GL forum. And loving every minute.

To answer your question, why bother with the Eng if you want SOP? The Gold Laced will not survive without it. Can't we have both you asked. Of course. I will have both.

I hope my explanation can be viewed as a simple discussion. I am not trying to be argumentative or judgmental in any way.

 

[delisha]

Quote: I like him too,is he blue or black based? I do not know much about them but his fluff looks blue, I have seen some on the UK sites that say blue laced and black laced.
He is black. I have a poor camera. He does need a darker black foundation. He has the body and with help from others I can and will improve the lacing and color. I also have beautiful blacks and I will use those if I have to.

No, they should all have partly slate/partly white legs and feet at this stage. I'm guessing a splash and a dark blue.

X2

Quote: Very well said.

 

[jdoane]

So I'm new to this thread and the whole ENG vs SOP thing. Love the look of the ENG and got them mainly for their look. My daughters are planning on doing 4H and showing some of our birds. (We also have a barred rock and aBlack Australorp). Should they not show our English Orpingtons??????

 

[fowlman01]

Great post Deek, it was very well thought out.

W.

 

[Renie'sPeeps]

I have managed to hatch a few white splashes... They are white feathered, blue legged, red combs.