The Legbar Thread!

[nicalandia]

The SOP calls for a melanized Crele bird, this on itself makes the bird another pattern, instead of clean crele...

Why? in addition to the Grey barring on the wing Triangle, the grey barring is extended to the Back, Saddle(which if you pay attention to brown leghorns, dont have stippling or penciling on the saddle or back) the SOP calls for Grey Barring on the Shoulders too. what kind of melanizer is this? I dont know... but its still called for on the SOP

 

[nicalandia]

Following post if for educationla purposes... not to imply that CCL have any melanizer or if they are related to OEG.. could it be that we are seeing a melanizer at play on some birds?
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[flyingmonkeypoop]

Following post if for educationla purposes... not to imply that CCL have any melanizer or if they are related to OEG.. could it be that we are seeing a melanizer at play on some birds?
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So if you added barring to that brassyback(?) rooster, he would look a lot like a cream legbar rooster as far as color goes. Interesting... It might also explain some of the off color on some hens too

 

[nicalandia]

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Correct, but thats only on looks, the melanizers mayby be totatly unrelated or not as powerful, or even gender related

 

[ChicKat]

here is a good comparison between a Brown leghorn with melanized secondaries(wing Triangle) but not as black as pure crow wing/birchen and a not melanized gold wing triangle

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Totally off topic, but why is there such a variation in the comb and wattles of these two birds? They are supposed to be the same breed right? One bantam and on not? Age related?

 

[ChicKat]

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Punnett did mention some gender-relation to the cream. He considered caponizing a cockerel to see if that would have an influence - but didn't follow-through on the experiment. I will put a link in if I locate it.

ETA - here it is:
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02986632#page-1

On page 328 he tells how his experiment (although I think here he is referring to Columbian pattern) shows a difference between the effects of cream on male and female coloration. He says that the cocks can be mistaken for silver but never the hens....and that as the feathers of the cockerel mature they are more "straw" coloured?

"Reduction of the melanic pigment, such as occurs in the 'Columbian' pattern, brings about a rich cream ground color in the hen, whereas the corresponding cock may be said to mimic a silver, though a faint straw tinge in the hackles tends to become accentuated as the feathers age".

Punnett goes on to say that he has bred many Columbian pattern cream birds but never a cock with the same cream as the hen. Never could a cream hen be mistaken for a silver as could happen with the Cream cock. Then he says it would be interesting to carry out castration experiments with such a strain.

This leads me to think that those who favor silver as the correct color are certainly correct before the event that the 'feathers age' -- age to adult plumage? or age to old age? What? It must be adult plumage if the birds molt annually, wouldn't you think? It also leads me to believe that there is some visible difference between silver and cream -- doubtless in the female - and in the male with 'aged feathers' --- But the question may arise would that apply to barred pattern as well as Columbian?

How do others interpret page 328?

 

[nicalandia]

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I would love the link.. I think caponizing a rooster would be just how a HF(hen feathered) males look like females, I posted a pic of a Hen Feathered Leghorn male not so long ago..

 

[nicalandia]

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the first one is from a bantam..

 

[ChicKat]

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Hi nicalandia---
I went back and edited it once I found it -- Discuss in post 5676 and repeated here:
http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/BF02986632#page-1

Thanks on the bantam ID, I thought that may be the case. Like his comb/wattles better.

 

[nicalandia]

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Thanks..I will take a look