The whole flock is sick! how to save them?

[tadpole98]

It would be nice to know what you are dealing with since you know that there are many different respiratory diseases, bacterial, viral, and others. Bacterial diseases can respond to the right antibiotic, but viruses don't. If you can find out in your state where to have a necropsy done on one of your dead chickens (and if it needs to be refrigerated not frozen) I would like to know which disease I was dealing with. It will probably cost you something, but hopefully it is not too much.

If somebody actually does die (so far one has but i have a feeling it wasnt because of this), then I am going to have a necropsy done.

 

[SilkiesForEver]

Lets hope one doesn't, but if so I hope they can figure out whats wrong.

 

[casportpony]

It would be nice to know what you are dealing with since you know that there are many different respiratory diseases, bacterial, viral, and others. Bacterial diseases can respond to the right antibiotic, but viruses don't. If you can find out in your state where to have a necropsy done on one of your dead chickens (and if it needs to be refrigerated not frozen) I would like to know which disease I was dealing with. It will probably cost you something, but hopefully it is not too much.

Necropsies are free in CA for CA residents and they'll let you use their FedEx account number to save on shipping. It's worth checking other states if your own state seems expensive. MD, for example, has a very affordable out of state fee for poultry.

 

[Sweetened]

If somebody actually does die (so far one has but i have a feeling it wasnt because of this), then I am going to have a necropsy done.

I have to say that though what Eggcessive has stated in bold is entirely correct, I still don't agree with it in a way. If you can use a natural antibiotic like Oregano oil (which doesn't promote resistance), you will stop the bird from having to deal with the bacterial infection it may or may not have; this is the same for any critter. By promoting healthy gut flora, a virus cannot survive in the areas it needs to (like stomach and intestine, where it can penetrate the walls and push easily throughout the system). Gut flora don't just assist in the digestion process by making it easier, they also help by keeping virus's and bacteria, negative ones, in check.

If sending a bird off for a necropsy is not economical for you, you can do one yourself. When I checked my boy, without having ever seen pictures of the illness, I knew something was wrong when I gutted him (sorry for the blunt language, at work, can't be tender!). They get lesions on the internal organs, primarily liver, kidneys and lungs. My boy also had lesions on his chest wall which also happens with Mereks. Have a look at what you see and either bring in or take pictures of what seems strange to you -- go with your instinct, you'd be surprised what you know. Take it in, google it and have a look.

 

[tadpole98]

Quote: After processing and gutting roosters year after year for food, I know what healthy insides look like. So most likely if I do it myself I would be able to tell whats wrong, if not, I have google and BYC peeps to help me out.

 

[Sweetened]

After processing and gutting roosters year after year for food, I know what healthy insides look like. So most likely if I do it myself I would be able to tell whats wrong, if not, I have google and BYC peeps to help me out.

Then you'll recognize it quickly. It's been pretty obvious in my experience.

 

[Sweetened]

Checking to see how your flock is doing? cleared up? Getting worse or staying the same?

 

[casportpony]

While I'm thinking about it, the pathologist I spoke with this week said that it would be very helpful if the next time I have one that's sick and looking like it's going to die to get a few cc's of blood and send that with the dead body to his lab.

 

[cowcreekgeek]

Two weeks ago, I found a hen hunched up and gasping and choking and sneezing blood. Her eyes had junk in them and cheesey stuff started coming out her nose. I separated her and the next day found three more young pullets/cockerels having stuff in their eyes, but not sneezing. A few days later everyone was all better so I put them back in with the flock. In about 4 hours I went back down to the henhouse and 5 more had it, then that night i rounded up 2 more and put them up in a separate coop. the next morning a rooster got it, so he went up too. a few days later about 10 of them were sneezing (which is one of the symptoms of what they have, coryza). I instantly knew that I should not bother separating them and that everybody has it. sure enough right now every single bird has it. two days ago a black sex link passed away and i have a feeling some more are following after her.
From what I believe we have CORYZA. I would like to treat it naturally, but in this case I am willing to do whatever it takes to make them better. please do not say to cull, I will NOT cull, i want to know how to save them, not kill them. If I wanted to kill them they would be dead right now. Thank you.

To appropriately treat the illness/disease, you'll have to be more certain of the diagnosis: It may very well be Infectious Coryza, but must be differentiated from others w/ similar symptoms ...

Compare the following descriptions w/ those symptoms observed w/in your flock:

The subcutaneous tissues of the head are swollen and there is a thick discharge from the nose. A small amount of clear discharge is present in the eye. Additionally, the area over the infraorbital sinus is swollen.

Clinical Signs

The incubation period for IC is approximately 1-3 days. The severity of infection varies depending on the age, breed, environmental stress, and presence of concurrent infections.

In the mild form, typically seen in young chickens, birds may become depressed and have nasal discharge and mild swelling of the face.

In the severe form, typically seen in young adults, there is an acute infection of the upper respiratory tract. Signs may include serous to mucoid nasal discharge, swelling of the infraorbital sinuses, facial edema including swollen eyelids that do not open, swollen wattles and intermandibular space, and conjunctivitis. If the lower respiratory tract becomes involved, rales may be observed. Signs usually persist for only a few weeks, however, if secondary infection occurs, the swelling can persist for months. Feed consumption, egg production, and growth are often severely reduced.

Differential Diagnosis

Swelling of the face and wattles must be differentiated from chronic fowl cholera, Newcastle disease, infectious bronchitis, avian influenza, avian metapneumovirus (swollen head syndrome), mycoplasmosis, and infectious laryngotracheitis. A nonpathogenic species, Avibacterium avium, may be cultured from the sinus of chickens, either alone or in combination with A. paragallinarum. A. paragallinarum is catalase negative, while nonpathogenic species are catalase positive.

 

[cocosandy]

I have had some similar issues with my flock in the past few months with less death because I have treated and sent birds for necropsy.
I am still waiting for final results but the last 5 birds I sent in last week have gross results that seem pretty clear to me and others that I regularly consult with. The initial findings were incoonclusive around 6 weeks ago, with 5 birds necropsied and the lab sent me kits to take swabs of other birds. Be sure to ask your lab what they can do because its not usual, but they will do it. In Ct most of this is free including the courier that will come take the birds to the lab in Storrs. I did have a negative on coryza and MG (though I think it was a false negative on MG in that they have found it here before...this is different and nonresponsive to MG treatment) I was preparing to vaccinate my flock for these things but I wanted a real diagnosis before moving ahead as birds may exhibit illness for a couple of weeks when vaccinated (see www.firststatevetsupply.com and talk to Peter Brown there for info on vaccines)
Rather than send the swabs, I called and sent 5 sick birds because they had a variety of issues and I hadnt seen this in this constellation before. The gross findings were that there was thick pus like a plug in the throat that was literally choking them. I showed this to someone that knows poultry disease and that person confirmed what I was thing which was: Laryngotracheitis .
I ordered the vaccine here: http://www.firststatevetsupply.com/...cines/laryngotracheitis-vaccine-lt-i-vax.html
(but am waiting for results from the lab) and realized going over things, and doing much research, that one thing that has worked is VetRX!! It loosens the phlem that is common in this disease...watery eyes, bubbly eyes, clear discharge, some phlem in the throat, and then in extreme cases, the eyes are swollen shut with much watery stuff inside and the sinus' fill up with thick mucus that comes out the hole on the roof of the beak in the back of the mouth and goes down the throa. But what also happens is that the thick rubbery pus gathers on the opening of the trachea and it obscures it more and more until they literally choke to death. They shake their heads alot to dislodge this stuff but also they can inhale it and die if they do dislodge it.
I went up to the one coop where Ive had this today with my vetrx and some probiotics and vitamins, fruit and such, and I only so far have addressed the worst ones. The ones that are trying to breathe and are puffed up got vetrx....then the other...then I started to look closer and the worst one was gaping...I held her and massaged her throat to see if I could help her out a little, cleared her nares, and looked her over. I realized that the opening to her trachea came upward when I massaged and I could see yellow rubbery pus in the opening. Being careful that she could breathe I gently massaged all around that from underneath, and the plug popped out! I then gave her some more vet rx, she could breathe but still has much more liquid junk in her throat...and let her go. she seems fine. I remember reading that a long swab would help with this, and I believe it would. I was able to help out a few more like this...and will call the lab tomorrow to see what they think. I am interested in anyone that might have info of another diease that has this tracheal plug....
Coryza is what most people go to because its the worst and most feared but many treatments address the commercial poultry business and backyard chicken keepers cant always burn their birds or put them all down.
MG is everywhere, and I am looking into vaccinating my entire flock and any incoming birds for these things.
You cannot pass on these birds, even vaccinated, but its better than culling your whole flock knowing that wild birds/animals and people at the feed store are covered with these germs...there is no biosecurity strong enough to make it OK not to vaccinate, as far as Im concerned. Birds that are carriers might get sick enough to cull or they may die, but that is also a way to tell who is a carrier. Future vaccinated birds will not get the diease from the vaccinated birds, but still you cant move them on.
I always urge people to use the lab for diagnosis, but also know that most labs and states deal with what works for commercial poultry operations, so use the info gained there and then consult with Peter Brown of First State Vet Supply or with your local chicken keepers group where people may have hands on experience with these things in a backyard chicken keeping world. This is a new area so we have to use resources available.

That said, I also urge people who have not had hands on experience with natural cures and a particular disease to say that "possibly" this or that might work because it works on my cold. If you dont know about it first hand you shouldnt suggest it. This is because in the case of Coryza, MF, LT, etc...you could cause someone to lose their entire flock while they try to do something natural. If you can say "I used oregano oil on an outbreak of MG last year and half of my birds went into remission" then you have an anecdotal first hand piece of advice to give. do not tell people who have chickens dropping that they just need some ACV and that its probably sour crop. I think Ive experienced that once or twice in years of keeping hundreds of chickens.

What you can do, is to have a few things on hand all the time, like Tylan 50, needles, denaguard, sulmet, sutures, bactine, vet wrap, and a good probiotic and vitamin....Oh and Oxine for disinfecting! you can get these all online at the outlets like randall burkey, first state, Valley Vet, and any number of supply houses that you can google. and do some research on the 5 or 6 things that birds get ...always buy vaccinated chicks and vaccinate for Mareks if you hatch. Realize that along the way you will lose some birds and its better to give one or two up for necropsy to save the whole flock as opposed to nursing and nursing one bird and not finding out whats wrong.

State vets will allow shipping of birds on ice and some will send swab kits. Many will pay for transport of birds and necropsy. Your state may require you to cull your flock for certain illnesses but at a point, you may have to follow state laws if you are in a meat production state and your germs may effect the industry. I have no great love for the factory industry but I do know that these germs travel on your tires and feet from supermarket to feed store to your neighbor's coop or the large farm across town's birds. So either work on laws in your state that treat small flocks differently or follow the existing laws.

Hope that was helpful...You can save the struggling birds by taking the plug out. Thats the big message here...use a long Q tip, massage carefully allowing the bird to breathe in between, and try to get it out. VetRx clears out the mucus a little...and vacinating will stop the spread.

Good Luck!!