Turkey Talk for 2014

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I have a turkey hen emergency!! my turkey hen started laying for the first time a month ago, and since, I've had a couple soft eggs laid and have seen her look egg bound, but she ended up laying her eggs just fine!! we'll I come into the coop this morning and see this. it literally looks like she pushed so hard,her insides came out!!! she hasn't left the coop all day and I have NO IDEA what to do!!
400
 
oh no!!!! . I had a hen with a prolapsed vent.... I am unsure what this is.... but it sure looks painful. My hens was small and I was able to push it back in... can you clean her up?? is it bloody?? from the pic it looks shredded..... I think she needs professional help I'm so sorry!!
 
lflynn5324 said:
I have a turkey hen emergency!! my turkey hen started laying for the first time a month ago, and since, I've had a couple soft eggs laid and have seen her look egg bound, but she ended up laying her eggs just fine!! we'll I come into the coop this morning and see this. it literally looks like she pushed so hard,her insides came out!!! she hasn't left the coop all day and I have NO IDEA what to do!!
Click to expand...

Lflynn, she has prolapsed. I can't tell 100% from the picture, but it looks like an oviductal prolapse (where the shell gland pushed out with the egg, and stayed out, but didn't tear). The other possibilities are an intestinal prolapse, or an oviductal tear (where the part of the shell gland that is outside has torn away from the part that is still inside). An oviductal prolapse is the most common, with the others being rare.

This is not something that can wait! You have to do something for her ASAP. The longer it is prolapsed the less likely she is to survive.

If you want to save her, you need to get the oviduct back inside tonight. If you want to take her to the vet, take her in now. If your regular vet doesn't take emergencies, she needs to go to the emergency clinic. If there's no vet available that will see turkeys this time of night, or if you don't want to take her to the vet, then you need to put it back inside yourself. Here's how you do it:

1) Put her in a cage by herself where there is only a clean towel or sheet or other cloth on the ground. If her feet are really dirt, wipe them off to keep them from getting the bedding dirty. If the prolapse is hanging out enough that she's stepping on it, or if she's biting at it, quickly wrap something around her that will keep it from hanging down to prevent further injury. You can use a wash cloth with masking tape criss-crossed under her chest then up over her back. Masking tape comes off feathers easily. Do not use stickier tape.

2) Gather what you need:
a. At least 2 towels large enough to wrap around her, plus several smaller towels to soak up water.
b. Ideally a second person to hold her. If no one is available, a couple of bag clips or hemostats or safety pins to hold the towel in place.
c. Ideally, some xylocaine gel as a local anesthetic to numb the area. Lidocaine gel or Oragel will work as well.
d. Some KY jelly (not the kind that "creates sensations"). If none available, some other type of lubricant like Vaseline or Bag Balm or even vegetable oil or mineral oil or a dilute mild soap. Ideally, it should be around body temp, but definitely not ice cold, or too hot.
e. Some rubber gloves. If none available, be sure your fingernails are short, with no rough spots, and your hands are washed.
f. Warm water. I usually get several containers of water, because I always seem to need clean water after I've gotten it dirty.
g. Something soft to wash the prolapse with. Cotton balls, a baby washcloth, a cut up t-shirt, anything soft and clean that won't shred.
h. A mild liquid antiseptic soap, diluted at least 1:4 with water, or regular liquid soap, or dishwashing detergent if that's all that's available.
i. You may not need it, but have some white sugar available (about 1/4-1/2 cup).
j. Preparation H, or other hemorrhoidal cream. If you don't have any now, you can get it and use it tomorrow.
k. A non-slip surface. I like the "rubber mesh" shelf liners, but anything that is clean and will prevent her from slipping will do.
l. Scissors to cut some feathers.
m. Possibly a hair dryer.
n. Possibly, dilute betadine (dilute in warm water, to the color of weak to medium tea, not strong tea). Chlorhexidene, diluted at least 1:30 in water, can also be used.

3. If you don't have a second person to help, you will probably need to work on the floor with her head in a corner. I've done this with a towel wrapped around the bird (to control her wings) and fastened on with clips. Then I put the bird's head in a corner and drape a second large towel over her, with the ends of the towel on the floor on each side of the bird. Then I sit behind the bird, put a foot on each end of the towel, with her between my knees. Don't pull the towel down so tight that she can't stand up, but enough that she can't jump away or turn around. (It's sooo much easier with a second person!) If a bird is really sick, or just very cooperative, you can sometimes restrain them adequately by putting them in a box or laundry basket -- one just big enough for them to stand in but not turn around, with a top on it, but only the one side where their butt sticks out is open. However she's restrained, be sure that she's got a towel around her to control her wings, and that a non-slip surface is underneath her so she is less likely to hurt herself.

4. Put the rubber gloves on, apply the xylocaine/lidocaine/orogel over the entire prolapse and wait about 5 minutes for it to take effect. It should completely numb the area. The hen will not feel the prolapse go back in (at least not as much) and will stop straining to push it back out.

5. While you're waiting for the area to get numb, gently cut away any feathers that are in your way, but don't go overboard. Preserve as many as possible. Be very careful not to cut the tissue.

6. Very gently wash away any debris that is stuck to the tissue. Use the dilute soap if needed, and be sure to rinse afterwards. Do not put it back inside with anything stuck to it. If it has been pecked at by other birds or is covered in filth, or otherwise appears likely to be infected, soak it in the dilute betadine for 3-4 minutes, then rinse.

7. Apply KY or other lubricant to the prolapse and gently work it back inside. If it is too swollen to go back inside, apply sugar to it and wait 10-15 minutes. The sugar will draw water out of it and it should shrink down to a size where it can be pushed back inside. Rinse the sugar off before putting the prolapse back in.

8. Once the prolapse is back inside, put a small amount of Preparation H in after it, and on the vent.

9. If the feathers are wet, use the hair dryer to dry the area. Be sure that the dryer isn't blowing out air that is too cold or too hot, just warm.

10. In about 4 hours, gently clean the vent (if needed) and reapply the Preparation H to the outside of the vent. Repeat this once daily for another week.

11. Isolate her from all other birds for about 7-10 days. If she prolapses again, the other birds tend to peck at the prolapse and can cause severe damage or death. During this time, be sure she is kept on clean bedding.

12. Encourage the hen to drink water, but reduce her food to less than 1/5 of normal for at least a week to try to stop egg production. She can have plenty of greens though.

13. In addition to food restriction, reduce her light exposure to less than 4 hours of light per day for at least a week. This will usually stop her egg production, which is vital for now. It may be enough to cause her to molt. Don't be concerned if that happens.

14. If the prolapse looked really bad, you might consider taking her to the vet afterwards to get some antibiotics and anti-inflammatory medication. Clavamox (antibiotic) and meloxicam (anti-inflammatory), along with several other options, are very effective in most cases, but not always necessary.

14. If you've gotten to her in time, most hens with a prolapsed oviduct will be fine and can be returned to the flock in 10 days (some that progress really well can go back in 7 days, but no sooner).

15. Many hens will only prolapse once and never again, but some will prolapse repeatedly. Known causes of prolapse are starting to lay eggs too young, laying eggs that are too big, or a hen being too fat. If she is very young, you can restrict her to less than 8 hours of light a day to prevent her from laying until she is older. If she is too fat then she should have her food restricted, but she can have lots of greens. I don't know of anything that can be done to reduce egg size. Some hens will prolapse without any of these things applying to them, but just aren't put together well enough inside to be able to lay eggs properly. Those hens should not be used for breeding. If she is a beloved pet, she can have surgery to remove the oviduct. It is a major surgery, but it will usually stop her from ovulating. If she is not a beloved pet and she repeatedly prolapses, she should be culled.

I hope this helps. I know it's a really scary thing to have to do, but farmers have been doing it successfully for years. Just be gentle, but decisive. It will be much less painful to her once you, or your vet, gets the prolapse back inside. Good luck.

--April
 
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Lybe8438 said:
I guess we have an Elliott.....I was convinced I had an Ellie as she made all sorts of hen calls never heard a tom cluck or purr before.
Click to expand...

Her wattle is quite small for a tom, and her skull is more narrow than my toms, but I've really never looked at the face of a wild hen vs wild tom up close before. She's 6 months old, how much does she weigh? At that age my two toms were 18 and 25 lbs, and my 5 hens ranged from 9 to 11 lbs, so there's quite a difference in size. Have you looked up how much the average wild hen and wild tom weigh at 6 months old, or at maturity? That could be indicative of gender. Is the lack of a mohawk and the slightly oversized lower caruncles typical of wild hens, or is that typical of wild toms like it is domestic toms? Has she done any of the typical tom displaying, with full puffing up, or does she only do the type of displaying that you've shown in the pictures that you've posted? That type of displaying is what my hens usually do, and rarely do the fully puffed up display. Does she gobble like a tom? My toms started gobbling when they were only a few months old, and by 6 months old you couldn't shut them up. The hens rarely gobble, and it's not much of a gobble at that. They usually make a snipe-like sound when they're startled. Without a snood, you may only know when she lays an egg. Or if she doesn't.

If you want to know 100%, ASAP, there's a lab test that can be done. It used to be a blood test, only a few drops of blood, but it may be an oral swab now. I can look up sample requirements and cost if you're interested. Years ago I was in a situation where I absolutely could not adopt a rooster, and had the test done on a baby chick that someone wanted to give me before I agreed to take it.

I'm rooting for Ellie, but Elliott would be just as wonderful a pet.
 
Sydney Acres said:
Lflynn, she has prolapsed.  I can't tell 100% from the picture, but it looks like an oviductal prolapse (where the shell gland pushed out with the egg, and stayed out, but didn't tear).  The other possibilities are an intestinal prolapse, or an oviductal tear (where the part of the shell gland that is outside has torn away from the part that is still inside).  An oviductal prolapse is the most common, with the others being rare.

This is not something that can wait!  You have to do something for her ASAP.  The longer it is prolapsed the less likely she is to survive. 

If you want to save her, you need to get the oviduct back inside tonight.  If you want to take her to the vet, take her in now.  If your regular vet doesn't take emergencies, she needs to go to the emergency clinic.  If there's no vet available that will see turkeys this time of night, or if you don't want to take her to the vet, then you need to put it back inside yourself.  Here's how you do it:

1)  Put her in a cage by herself where there is only a clean towel or sheet or other cloth on the ground.  If her feet are really dirt, wipe them off to keep them from getting the bedding dirty.  If the prolapse is hanging out enough that she's stepping on it, or if she's biting at it, quickly wrap something around her that will keep it from hanging down to prevent further injury.  You can use a wash cloth with masking tape criss-crossed under her chest then up over her back.  Masking tape comes off feathers easily.  Do not use stickier tape.

2)  Gather what you need: 
a.  At least 2 towels large enough to wrap around her, plus several smaller towels to soak up water.
b.  Ideally a second person to hold her.  If no one is available, a couple of bag clips or hemostats or safety pins to hold the towel in place.
c.  Ideally, some xylocaine gel as a local anesthetic to numb the area.  Lidocaine gel or Oragel will work as well. 
d.  Some KY jelly (not the kind that "creates sensations").  If none available, some other type of lubricant like Vaseline or Bag Balm or even vegetable oil or mineral oil or a dilute mild soap.  Ideally, it should be around body temp, but definitely not ice cold, or too hot.
e.  Some rubber gloves.  If none available, be sure your fingernails are short, with no rough spots, and your hands are washed.
f.  Warm water.  I usually get several containers of water, because I always seem to need clean water after I've gotten it dirty.
g.  Something soft to wash the prolapse with.  Cotton balls, a baby washcloth, a cut up t-shirt, anything soft and clean that won't shred.
h.  A mild liquid antiseptic soap, diluted at least 1:4 with water, or regular liquid soap, or dishwashing detergent if that's all that's available.
i.  You may not need it, but have some white sugar available (about 1/4-1/2 cup).
j.  Preparation H, or other hemorrhoidal cream.  If you don't have any now, you can get it and use it tomorrow.
k.  A non-slip surface.  I like the "rubber mesh" shelf liners, but anything that is clean and will prevent her from slipping will do.
l.  Scissors to cut some feathers.
m.  Possibly a hair dryer.
n.  Possibly, dilute betadine (dilute in warm water, to the color of weak to medium tea, not strong tea).  Chlorhexidene, diluted at least 1:30 in water, can also be used.

3.  If you don't have a second person to help,  you will probably need to work on the floor with her head in a corner.  I've done this with a towel wrapped around the bird (to control her wings) and fastened on with clips.  Then I put the bird's head in a corner and drape a second large towel over her, with the ends of the towel on the floor on each side of the bird.  Then I sit behind the bird, put a foot on each end of the towel, with her between my knees.  Don't pull the towel down so tight that she can't stand up, but enough that she can't jump away or turn around.  (It's sooo much easier with a second person!)  If a bird is really sick, or just very cooperative, you can sometimes restrain them adequately by putting them in a box or laundry basket -- one just big enough for them to stand in but not turn around, with a top on it, but only the one side where their butt sticks out is open.  However she's restrained, be sure that she's got a towel around her to control her wings, and that a non-slip surface is underneath her so she is less likely to hurt herself.

4.  Put the rubber gloves on, apply the xylocaine/lidocaine/orogel over the entire prolapse and wait about 5 minutes for it to take effect.  It should completely numb the area. The hen will not feel the prolapse go back in (at least not as much) and will stop straining to push it back out. 

5.  While you're waiting for the area to get numb, gently cut away any feathers that are in your way, but don't go overboard. Preserve as many as possible. Be very careful not to cut the tissue.

6.  Very gently wash away any debris that is stuck to the tissue.  Use the dilute soap if needed, and be sure to rinse afterwards.  Do not put it back inside with anything stuck to it.  If it has been pecked at by other birds or is covered in filth, or otherwise appears likely to be infected, soak it in the dilute betadine for 3-4 minutes, then rinse.

7.  Apply KY or other lubricant to the prolapse and gently work it back inside.  If it is too swollen to go back inside, apply sugar to it and wait 10-15 minutes.  The sugar will draw water out of it and it should shrink down to a size where it can be pushed back inside.  Rinse the sugar off before putting the prolapse back in.

8.  Once the prolapse is back inside, put a small amount of Preparation H in after it, and on the vent.

9.  If the feathers are wet, use the hair dryer to dry the area.  Be sure that the dryer isn't blowing out air that is too cold or too hot, just warm.

10.  In about 4 hours, gently clean the vent (if needed) and reapply the Preparation H to the outside of the vent.  Repeat this once daily for another week.

11.  Isolate her from all other birds for about 7-10 days.  If she prolapses again, the other birds tend to peck at the prolapse and can cause severe damage or death.  During this time, be sure she is kept on clean bedding.

12.  Encourage the hen to drink water, but reduce her food to less that 1/5 of normal for at least a week to try to stop egg production.  She can have plenty of greens though.

13.  In addition to food restriction, reduce her light exposure to less than 4 hours of light per day for at least a week.  This will usually stop her egg production, which is vital for now.  It may be enough to cause her to molt.  Don't be concerned if that happens.

14.  If the prolapse looked really bad, you might consider taking her to the vet afterwards to get some antibiotics and anti-inflammatory medication.  Clavamox (antibiotic) and meloxicam (anti-inflammatory), along with several other options, are very effective in most cases, but not always necessary.

14.  If you've gotten to her in time, most hens with a prolapsed oviduct will be fine and can be returned to the flock in 10 days (some that progress really well can go back in 7 days, but no sooner).

15.  Many hens will only prolapse once and never again, but some will prolapse repeatedly.  Known causes of prolapse are starting to lay eggs too young, laying eggs that are too big, or a hen being too fat.  If she is very young, you can restrict her to less than 8 hours of light a day to prevent her from laying until she is older.  If she is too fat then she should have her food restricted, but she can have lots of greens.  I don't know of anything that can be done to reduce egg size.  Some hens will prolapse without any of these things applying to them, but just aren't put together well enough inside to be able to lay eggs properly.  Those hens should not be used for breeding.  If she is a beloved pet, she can have surgery to remove the oviduct.  It is a major surgery, but it will usually stop her from ovulating.  If she is not a beloved pet and she repeatedly prolapses, she should be culled.

I hope this helps.  I know it's a really scary thing to have to do, but farmers have been doing it successfully for years.  Just be gentle, but decisive.  It will be much less painful to her once you, or your vet, gets the prolapse back inside.  Good luck.

--April
Click to expand...
April, I can't thank u enough for all the vital information. I hadn't been able to find ANYTHING online for something this severe. so im praying I can get her well.my hen is overweight and I Thot maybe that is why she has had such a hard time. I just had a surgery on a cyst on my ovary, and am trying to figure out how to do this alone as she is at least 45lbs. but im pretty sure I have most everything you stated to take care of this, so I will go do it immediately. I will let u know what happens to my Miss Piggy. thank u SO MUCH AGAIN, and God bless you. Lindsay
 
Quote: April, I can't thank u enough for all the vital information. I hadn't been able to find ANYTHING online for something this severe. so im praying I can get her well.my hen is overweight and I Thot maybe that is why she has had such a hard time. I just had a surgery on a cyst on my ovary, and am trying to figure out how to do this alone as she is at least 45lbs. but im pretty sure I have most everything you stated to take care of this, so I will go do it immediately. I will let u know what happens to my Miss Piggy. thank u SO MUCH AGAIN, and God bless you. Lindsay
Oh my gosh Lindsay, be careful. I don't want you to hurt yourself so soon after surgery. Is there anyone that can help you?

At 45 pounds, she is quite big. I am assuming she is a broad breasted white. How much overweight is she? I don't know for sure, but I would assume a BBW that has been laying for a month is about 7-9 months old, and should weigh around 30-34 pounds (total guess, could be completely wrong). Chances are she will prolapse again if she keeps laying eggs at this size, so once you get the oviduct replaced it is critical that you stop her ovulations. Short term you can do it by limiting her exposure to light, but if she's a pet you probably need to take her to a vet that is very knowledgeable about birds. There are hormone injections that can be given to stop her from ovulating. I would not recommend doing the surgery on her to remove her oviduct unless you had no other option, as anesthesia is quite risky at her size.

If she does well through this, and if she is a pet, I would not allow her to eat unlimited food anymore. Years ago I had a pet white Cornish cross broiler hen, Sydney. She had a number of medical problems, and I had to be very careful with her weight. I fed her three times a day, only 2 tablespoons at a time of chicken food, plus finely chopped veggies, chopped greens, and some fruit at every meal. She also free ranged and foraged very well, so she ate lots of grass, bugs, slugs, blackberries, currents, peppers, anything that was within reach of her little beak. I even saw her kill and eat a mouse once. She got lots of variety, but very little concentrated calories (chicken food), and absolutely no grain. The other chickens were able to fly to a high shelf that she couldn't reach, so that was where their food was fed, and she was brought inside and fed separately. She was always looking for food, but she was happy and lived 6 & 1/2 years, so weight control really works for the big "meat birds."

Good luck with her tonight, and be careful.
--April
 
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