URGENT-- frozen feet!

[Bogtown Chick]

Here is a picture progression of my first one. So you get an idea. I didn’t know what to expect with mine —what would happen next and when— so I did document for others Here on BYC .

January 21-23

Jan 27-29

You can see the body’s response to the frostbite happening here I think. Tissues are walling off. I thought the pink was good at the time and it was going to heal but the body is cutting its losses so to speak. February 7.

February 14. Eschar is forming up.

March 9. It had actually been this way for a bit before I got the camera down to the coop.

March 12th. Looks ready to crumble off but not quite yet.

Toe sloughed April 8th.

Week or two for the skin to cover the tip. I did bandage again at this time. Mud season too! Ugh

July. Happy rooster grazing.

 

[Dona Worry]

The dusky tissue on Jaimie’s middle toe and victoria’s one leg might be inidicative of the loss to come. It will wall off, turn to dark black eschar and break off- yes bone and all. Frost bite of the feet has not infected on me. But I did not keep them inside for long periods of time either in warmer environments that can sometimes increase a bacteria bloom. I got them back out to the coop as soon as I felt I could manage it. Veterycin, neosporin and vet wrap for holding the med and supporting toes and feet. But I did not have young Polish either.
This was a horndog rooster chasing hens and hitting 2 x 4 framework in the coop—breaking his toe.
Last year I had a fox attack on my coop at Christmas. The fox got one of my old spent hens and I found the rooster on the floor of the coop his feet very cold maybe partially froze. Idk if he was flogging the attacker and breaking toes in that confined space but he was uncomfortable and on the floor. His feet were very large thereafter. The toes knobby, thick unhealthy looking but still yellow in the spring. He was slow and uncomfortable in the woods. Mother’s Day the fox returned on their free range at 4ish or so—before they turned in to the coop for the night and took him. So I cannot tell you how those feet would have turned out. I think just watching his discomfort for a few weeks of free ranging I was close to culling anyways. He was not a vibrant spring roo with those feet. I just wanted to give him a chance. I tried setting a few of his welsummer hen’s eggs because he was gorgeous. They weren’t viable so he was so sore he wasn’t even mating. What a rooster lives for.
I’m interested to see how it goes. Your care could make a difference. You take a break once in a while. It can be intense and sometimes you feel alone. BYC offers great support. And you’ve got some of the best on here. If you need to skip a day in baths because you need a break. Just do it. They’ll be fine.

Thank you for the kind words and sharing your story!
I don't think my care has reversed or mitigated any of the original damage, nor would I have expected it to. My only goal is to prevent a secondary infection from arising, prevent further damage, and provide a bearable quality of life. The soaking, ointment, and constant cleaning of the pen (oh and it IS constant!!!!) seems to be helping in that respect.

 

[aart]

I have never had a chicken with frostbite toes get gangrene. The toes turn black, shrink up, than fall off at some point. The remaining tissue ends heal over time.

I think the 'black' is gangrene...basically it's dead tissue.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

I think the 'black' is gangrene...basically it's dead tissue.

No it's just dead tissue. Gangrene is a bacteria that spreads into healthy tissue pretty quickly and smells like death as it destroys tissue. It also will ooze a green pus I believe.

The tissue on frost bitten toes is similar to when you band a male animal to castrate it. The blood supply is cut off and the tissue dies, and is limited, it doesn't spread. Incorrect banding can cause gangrene, which results in severe swelling and pus, as well as that smell. So two different things.

 

[Bogtown Chick]

Thank you for the kind words and sharing your story!
I don't think my care has reversed or mitigated any of the original damage, nor would I have expected it to. My only goal is to prevent a secondary infection from arising, prevent further damage, and provide a bearable quality of life. The soaking, ointment, and constant cleaning of the pen (oh and it IS constant!!!!) seems to be helping in that respect.

You bet. If you get any questions along the way let me know. The timeline is for a New Hampshire rooster with bigger thicker tissues than yours and also sent back out to the coop. So there’s going to be a variation there for your sized bird and conditions. Oh my fingers are crossed and I’m learning again right with you.

 

[Dona Worry]

No it's just dead tissue. Gangrene is a bacteria that spreads into healthy tissue pretty quickly and smells like death as it destroys tissue. It also will ooze a green pus I believe.

The tissue on frost bitten toes is similar to when you band a male animal to castrate it. The blood supply is cut off and the tissue dies, and is limited, it doesn't spread. Incorrect banding can cause gangrene, which results in severe swelling and pus, as well as that smell. So two different things.

Oh, I always thought it was one and the same!

 

[Bogtown Chick]

There is that potential I suppose but gangrene is bacteria. Black is eschar. ( scabbing-dead necrotic tissue)

Frostbite and burns look and are treated the same.

 

[Kris5902]

I think the 'black' is gangrene...basically it's dead tissue.

I think you’re right, (edit: in that the dead tissues are turning gangrenous and possibly spreading) and that the nastieness is from the warm and moist environment the soaks are providing, even if they are providing relief and keeping the area clean. Trenchfoot is a form of gangrene caused by wet/sweaty boots, blisters and infection (bacterial) setting in if I recall correctly, and if left untreated can lead to septsis (the red streaking and blood poisoning) my mother had some issues in 2017 with almost losing toes due to blood flow issues. That (gangrene and blood poisoning) was one of the things the Dr’s told us to keep a watch for in recovery (she kept all the toes, surprising even the cardiologist that did the emergency surgery!)

It might be time to cut back the soaking some... let everything dry and air out a bit?

 

[Kris5902]

Is there any of the oozing or rotting smell coming from the feet? With the scales it’s really hard to see exactly what’s going on with the tissue underneath. Aside from the broken blisters, that is.

 

[Dona Worry]

It might be time to cut back the soaking some... let everything dry and air out a bit?

At this point, I think the soaking is the lesser of two evils. It seems to reduce swelling, ease discomfort, and help keep the remaining flesh clean.
Because it is her feet, they don't get much of a chance to 'air out'. She has an uncanny knack of slepping through fresh poop 967 times a day, no matter how often I clean.
I always let the feet dry completely before dressing with antibiotic ointment, so hopefully I am not sealing any moisture in, but it's hard to know.
AM I doing the right thing? I don't know. But I keep reciting my Mantra of Healthy Babies--keep them clean, keep them dry, keep them warm, keep them fed-- and doing my best to follow.