way to keep hawks out temporaly* Please don't read if you protect hawk

[joebryant]

Quote:
engaging in respectful debate--even a heated one--is not now and never will be harassment--but it might feel like it to those who want to shut a conversation down. i think this is a great thread and the free and open exchange of ideas is another hallmark of a civil society. sometimes if one is getting too frustrated it is better to step back and take a breath rather than try to shut others down.

Right, and some people should read the ORIGINAL POST that talked about PAYING $50 TO GET A LEGAL PERMIT TO SHOOT HAWKS. This thread had no thought or mention of ANY illegal activity until ...

 

[muell112]

Quote:
engaging in respectful debate--even a heated one--is not now and never will be harassment--but it might feel like it to those who want to shut a conversation down. i think this is a great thread and the free and open exchange of ideas is another hallmark of a civil society. sometimes if one is getting too frustrated it is better to step back and take a breath rather than try to shut others down.

Right, and some people should read the ORIGINAL POST that talked about PAYING $50 TO GET A LEGAL PERMIT TO SHOOT HAWKS. This thread had no thought or mention of ANY illegal activity until ...

...the title said "please don't read if you protect hawk"...

 

[WalkingWolf]

Quote:
engaging in respectful debate--even a heated one--is not now and never will be harassment--but it might feel like it to those who want to shut a conversation down. i think this is a great thread and the free and open exchange of ideas is another hallmark of a civil society. sometimes if one is getting too frustrated it is better to step back and take a breath rather than try to shut others down.

I am not frustrated in the least, and the above was just pointing out a comparison, you obviously think it was directed. But I do however think telling a person they are going to prison for a misdemeanor bordering on harassment. You should read the laws sometimes they are interesting and it is amazing what is actually against the law.

I love a healthy debate but there is a limit to what is debating and what is considered insulting to others. Discussing the laws and telling someone they are going to jail is two different things. IMO myself included we are completely ignoring the request for ideas, but instead debating what should and should not be. So far nobody here has suggested anything illegal except for maybe one SSS post. The OP clearly intends to get a permit. NOBODY has advocated shooting firearms into the air, yet that accusation has been made several times. It is not part of a healthy debate to make accusations that are not true.

I would suggest that if some find the topic of killing a raptor legally so upsets them that they take their own advice.

 

[Oven Ready]

How many birds are you losing to the hawks?

 

[WalkingWolf]

Quote:
I think that would encourage more hawks. Even though I support the OP decision to get a permit, I think he will find it very difficult to actually do. And I think that deterrent, or harassing the hawks measures would be much more successful. I have not had a hawk attack in well over a year, and there are plenty here. I keep little chicks penned up, I have dogs on patrol, there is plenty of brush for the birds to take cover. Additionally when I see hawks I wave my arms and yell at them, they want nothing to do with predators, I have used a boating air horn at times also. The crows have been the best deterrent, they will take a hawk out of mid air, they are relentless to protect their young, but they will take chicks and eggs if they can. The bad part also of the crows is they harass the tree rats(squirrels), but tree rats will take chicks also if they can.

 

[chickerdoodle]

Quote:
Nonsense! It's cavalier when one nonchalantly accepts a bad situation as though the status quo should be allowed rather than changed.

Just an FYI fro Merriam Websters Dictionary as an adjective:
Main Entry: 2cavalier
Function: adjective
Date: circa 1641

1 : debonair
2 : marked by or given to offhand and often disdainful dismissal of important matters <a cavalier attitude toward money>
3 a capitalized : of or relating to the party of Charles I of England in his struggles with the Puritans and Parliament b : aristocratic c capitalized : of or relating to the English Cavalier poets of the mid-17th century

I did not dismiss this important matter of life and death nor was my opinion offhand.

It is my opinion--one that was formed after great thought and fairness to both sides. I care deeply about both the chickens and the hawk. I would be more than out of money if my hens were killed as they are my beloved pets. I would mourn their loss on an emotional level akin to any beloved pet.

 

[redhen]

I agree with Joebryant..
the laws DO need to change..
hawks are NOT a threatened species anymore..
Christ... they're ALL over the place here...
We can shoot deer and ducks and quail to help population control.....why not a hawk?
Now.. dont get me wrong..i think that hawks are beautiful creatures... but they really are becoming overpopulated and hence they have less food to eat... and that leads to brazen hawks that come into your yards... ..IMO

 

[Oven Ready]

Walking Wolf,

I edited my post about the rabbits, because I thought it might be considered as an inflammatory post to get more 'debating' going on this thread.

I like hawks, I like all birds (except feral pigeons), but sometimes even things we like can become pests and then something needs to be done about it.
We can all sit here quite happily discussing the best rat traps or how to kill fleas etc, but there will be forums where people feel the same about their rats as we do about our chickens - not sure about the fleas but each to his own.

Where we are it's no problem to shoot anything that comes on our land, but like you I prefer the 'scare em away' technique

We have endless predators of all sizes,
The worst are dogs - best shot with a slingshot because they remember not to come back - shooting them dead just means there will be a new one along in a few days.
Next worst are cats - the slingshot works well with them, but a BB gun is better - more rapid fire and less lasting injuries.
Then it's pretty much a level playing field of hawks, buzzards, snakes, monitor lizards, squirrels, giant centipedes and ants.
Birds, snakes and squirrels can be kept at bay during the day simply by being watchful, the chickens know they are there and give out the alert, then it's just a matter of being near the chickens until the predator disappears. It's not 100% fool-proof but it keeps the casualties low.
Monitor Lizards just need catching and released into the local canal - which is where they come from.
Giant Centipedes are a pain, as the chickens seem to think they are food - they aren't predators really but they defend themselves with a fatal sting - not much keeps them away but squidging them when you see them keeps the numbers down.
Ants are impossible to control - they are about an inch long and probably 5-10 thousand per colony. They bite and spray acid into the bite. The last thing a chick or chicken does is to disturb a nest - their sheer numbers are overwhelming.

Even the fish in the pond are capable of snatching a chick from the waters edge (catfish and snakeheads)

Crows and other large wild birds are great at annoying hawks, small birds let everyone else know they are there and the bigger ones will chase them away. We have wild Lapwings nesting on our land and they are extremely aggressive and noisy to all sort of predators.

I'd be happy if we only had hawks to woory about !!!

 

[WalkingWolf]

Redhen I agree also but to be honest I do not see it happening. We have a urban environment where most people see the hawk as symbol instead of a wild animal that needs control like any other. This is part of the reason for such passion when even legal means of control are discussed. To be clear when a hawk attacks a person or a persons pet especially in the presence of the owner, the hawk has lost it's fear of humans and is a clear danger. We should not have to hide our children in our homes to protect them from hawks.

But to be clear shooting a hawk is not easy and most times cannot be done with a shotgun. As I pointed out they dive at over 200mph and the rest of time they patrol the skies looking for prey at what they consider safe distance from other airborne predators. Well out of range of shotguns unless using buckshot ant that is dangerous. Joey was correct in the use of a high powered rifle to take hawks, but they are not shot in the air, and he did not suggest that. I guess he should have explained further how it is actually done. Shooting a hawk even with a high powered rifle sitting is still not an easy task. They are a small target and the shooter must be experienced, usually farmers hire sharpshooters for pest control.

 

[chickerdoodle]

Oven ready said "Next worst are cats - the slingshot works well with them, but a BB gun is better - more rapid fire and less lasting injuries."

Unfortunately cats can and do die from BB shots. I have seen many in my practice. It depends on where they are shot. They do hate a shot with the hose though and it doesn't cause more harm than a cold shower would.​