when will we stop calling them "cornish cross"?

[WinklerFarms]

New hamps

http://www.amerpoultryassn.com/breed_classifications.htm

 

[WinklerFarms]

Please correct me if I am misunderstanding you Fred. Not trying to argue just wondering what you mean by the new hamp not being a breed.

 

[A.T. Hagan]

So what? They may be far removed from the original Cornish, but if you say Cornish Cross I know exactly what type of bird you are speaking about.

If you call them "Broilers" there are multiple types of broilers and they differ quite a bit.  Different colors, different growth rates, different muscle structure, even different methods of raising and different feed requirements.

The same with "meaties".  That could be any sort of "broiler". See above.

Cornish Cross just happens to be what that particular type of chicken is called.  The world is full of misleading names for animals.  I assure you, the Australian Shepherd did not come from Australia at any time of its development. But that is what it is called and if I call it Australian Shepherd, anyone who knows anything about dogs knows what breed I am referring to.  It's clarity of communication, not genetic accuracy.

I agree with you. It's well known what is meant when the phrase "Cornish Cross" is used. Trying to change it at this point will only make the confusion worse rather than lessen it.

New hamps are recognized by the standard And have been since 1935. How can there be no such breed as you say if it is recognized?

You'll note that he said New Hampshire Reds. It's the Reds appendage that is the problem since their proper name is simply New Hampshires.

But even there it is well understood what is meant when it's used.

 

[WinklerFarms]

Ah I got it! I thought about that after I had posted.

 

[Fred's Hens]

New hamps are recognized by the standard And have been since 1935. How can there be no such breed as you say if it is recognized?

New Hampshires? Yes. New Hampshire Red? No.

 

[Fred's Hens]

I don't really have a dog in the hunt, just to be clear. I'm not an anti-hatchery snob, as I buy their products with eyes wide open. Cultural usage of words is fluid. Hatcheries use all kinds of titles for their birds, Comets, Queens, Stars, Araucanas, Cornish-Rock Cross to sell them. Hey, it's a free country I suppose, and the hatcheries are in business to sell birds.

But accuracy, to those who care about such things, as witnessed by the OP's creation of this thread, indicates some folks do care about all this. As long as the hatcheries use the terms they use, for the breeds, strains, mixes and hybrids they are selling, for 90% of the people who only see these birds and see them named in this way, that is a powerful effect. If the hatchery says they are this or that, then that must be the case. The web pages and catalogs are very authoritative and the influence is very strong.

 

[enel 1]

So what? They may be far removed from the original Cornish, but if you say Cornish Cross I know exactly what type of bird you are speaking about.

If you call them "Broilers" there are multiple types of broilers and they differ quite a bit. Different colors, different growth rates, different muscle structure, even different methods of raising and different feed requirements.

The same with "meaties". That could be any sort of "broiler". See above.

Cornish Cross just happens to be what that particular type of chicken is called. The world is full of misleading names for animals. I assure you, the Australian Shepherd did not come from Australia at any time of its development. But that is what it is called and if I call it Australian Shepherd, anyone who knows anything about dogs knows what breed I am referring to. It's clarity of communication, not genetic accuracy.

yeah sure if you dont own pure breed Cornish,but try to talk to some one who knows very little about chicken,as soon as you tell them you have Cornish birds they jump to the conclution that you are talking about "those chickens like they have at the grocery store". and the Australian sheperd comment...are you sure about those facts. any one with any pride in thier flock would like thier bird to be recognised for what they are,and my Cornish are no way cornish cross nor do those "cornish cross"have any resemblance to my Cornish. Thats what!

 

[enel 1]

oh and broilers no matter what color they are are bred to be BROILERS! geez some people.

 

[WinklerFarms]

I don't really have a dog in the hunt, just to be clear.   I'm not an anti-hatchery snob, as I buy their products with eyes wide open. Cultural usage of words is fluid.  Hatcheries use all kinds of titles for their birds, Comets, Queens, Stars, Araucanas, Cornish-Rock Cross to sell them.  Hey, it's a free country I suppose, and the hatcheries are in business to sell birds.  

But accuracy, to those who care about such things, as witnessed by the OP's creation of this thread, indicates some folks do care about all this.    As long as the hatcheries use the terms they use, for the breeds, strains, mixes and hybrids they are selling, for 90% of the people who only see these birds and see them named in this way, that is a powerful effect.  If the hatchery says they are this or that, then that must be the case.  The web pages and catalogs are very authoritative and the influence is very strong.  

I couldn't agree more. The hatcheries come up their there own names to sell chicks. Comets, queens, and stars sounds better than Red Sex Link to most people.

 

[booker81]

You can beat your head all you want, but all you'll end up with is a sore head. Rather, if it's important to you, you just continue to educate, and be easy on the knowledge that folks can and will call things the wrong names. All you can do it to provide education in a way that is easy to understand.

My family used to raise, breed and import Shire horses. I imagine 99% of the folks reading this don't know what a Shire horse is. But, I give you a picture of our late stallion, then it's the shout of "The Budweiser Horses!!!" A Clydesdale!! Well, sorry, but even though Anheuser-Busch.com says they are all Clydes, they aren't, and I know some of the horses that are definitely Shires, and I can pick them out of a line up (a lot of Bud's wheel horses are Shires). Does that mean I rant at anyone who called one of our horses a Clydesdale or a "Budweiser Horse"? Nope. I just give them the spiel of education (the breeds are distinct, but very similar, there are specific characteristics that distinguish them, one is more rare, etc etc etc.) It's easier on the sanity to educate one person at a time, than to wish that the world would change.

By the way, here's our boy - he's all Shire, and had at least two sons that were imported to become "Budweiser Clydesdales":

'''

Now, I admit, I do call them Cornish X or CX, because of the simplicity of covering a wide variety of "variations" - a CX should cover any breed or type of chicken that has a carcass weight of 5lbs give or take at 8 weeks and is white feathered. That covers Hubbard White Mountain Broilers, Ross 308, Cobb 700, Indian River Meat, Arbor Acres Plus Broiler, Hybro, etc etc etc. I prefer not to use the term "broiler" mainly because I personally still process and consume heritage type breeds, and use the old time designations of broiler/fryer/roaster/stew fowl.